The $2500 Complete System Any Newbie SHOULD Buy! (Take Advantage of Summer)

[FirstReflection]

Cool! Thanks for letting us know what Emotiva said about the XRS-4.1 status. That's too bad they're not taking rain checks They should. Although I guess I can understand it given the unknown ETA on new units and the fact that they're basically selling them at cost during the sale Good to know they'll be back eventually though! They're such a great option for a less expensive diffuse surround speaker. Even at their regular price

 

[bw3]

So ordered what i could at this point. Looking forward to getting everything in and setting up my new system. holding off on the additional ascend spkrs for surrounds, dont really need a complete setup right away. Will just be waiting to get those emotiva surrounds when they are back in stock. Why mess with a well educated starter package!

 

[BusterBrown]

So ordered what i could at this point. Looking forward to getting everything in and setting up my new system. holding off on the additional ascend spkrs for surrounds, dont really need a complete setup right away. Will just be waiting to get those emotiva surrounds when they are back in stock. Why mess with a well educated starter package![/QUOTE

X2 ordered what I could also. Got every thing on the way except the TV.

 

[Ears to you]

Hi First Reflection,

Thank you very much for all the well thought out, practical information you generously shared about the video side of things! As the OP said, your type of generosity of advice is all too rare on forums these days!

I have had a fairly good handle on the audio, music only side of my system, but the idea of possibilities for upgrading my 9 year old Panasonic 42" enhanced definition plasma (yes - a totally extinct technology for this set that at the time was highly rated by Consumer Reports, cost $1800(!) and actually does have quite good color and motion rendition), that to date has served me well has been daunting.

I live in an apartment, and my LR is 15'x15'x8', with only 3 large contiguous windows on one side, totaling 8'x4.5' behind the tv, along with some light spilling into the room from the kitchen and bathroom down hallways on either side near the back of the room. I had been pondering the various options open to me to still be able to watch occasionally with decent picture quality during the day, as well as nighttime, when we do the majority of our viewing. Your explanations and recommendations about screen type, size, etc. were superb, and have educated me at least enough to further my upcoming tentative steps to upgrade the tv. Thanks again!!

 

[FirstReflection]

Hi First Reflection,

Thank you very much for all the well thought out, practical information you generously shared about the video side of things! As the OP said, your type of generosity of advice is all too rare on forums these days!

I have had a fairly good handle on the audio, music only side of my system, but the idea of possibilities for upgrading my 9 year old Panasonic 42" enhanced definition plasma (yes - a totally extinct technology for this set that at the time was highly rated by Consumer Reports, cost $1800(!) and actually does have quite good color and motion rendition), that to date has served me well has been daunting.

I live in an apartment, and my LR is 15'x15'x8', with only 3 large contiguous windows on one side, totaling 8'x4.5' behind the tv, along with some light spilling into the room from the kitchen and bathroom down hallways on either side near the back of the room. I had been pondering the various options open to me to still be able to watch occasionally with decent picture quality during the day, as well as nighttime, when we do the majority of our viewing. Your explanations and recommendations about screen type, size, etc. were superb, and have educated me at least enough to further my upcoming tentative steps to upgrade the tv. Thanks again!!

Hey, thanks! You're most welcome, and I'm really glad you've found my posts useful.

I actually think the biggest misstep for a lot of people is the screen size. Any of us who are old enough, we got used to those "little" 27" CRTs back in the day So with all these flat panels these days, even 42" sounded big to us at first!

But yeah, we've got this lovely 1080p resolution now, and it honestly just goes to waste if we don't sit close enough or get a screen size large enough to really make use of it! A really easy "rule of thumb" is to just take the diagonal screen size and double it to get a decent idea of a good viewing distance for that size. Or take your viewing distance in inches and cut that in half for a decent idea of a good diagonal screen size. So 50" HDTV? Double that to 100 inches. That's pretty close to 8 feet, which is a decent viewing distance for that screen size. Easy

Of course as I detailed earlier, using 0.615 gives you the "perfect" SMPTE-recommended 30 degree field of view. Multiply your viewing distance (in inches) by 0.615 to get the ideal diagonal screen size; or divide your diagonal screen size by 0.615 to get your ideal viewing distance!

And yeah, that ends up being a lot closer, or a lot larger screen size than what most people expect! 6.77 feet from a 50" screen! Most people just think that's way too close. But that's why these big 60", 70", 80" and even 90" screens that are available now are such a great option! Prices have come down so much on these huge screen sizes. And they allow us to use a BIG flat panel in a normally lit, or even brightly lit or sunlit room, whereas before, if we wanted that sort of screen size, we'd need to make our room as dark as possible so that we could use a front projector!

Obviously, if you can build a truly dedicated, blacked out home theater room, nothing beats a truly HUGE front projection setup. Sitting 12 or 15 feet away from a 90 or 110 inch screen, respectively, is just an awesome experience. But yeah, you need as close to pitch blackness as possible for front projection to look its best. That 90" Sharp LED-LCD model now provides a real, viable option for a lit room with a 12 foot viewing distance! That's amazing. Although it does cost $10,000

Anywho, the options are there now. The Panasonic plasmas are the best TVs overall right now, but yeah, bright room lighting, sunlight, or light sources other than overhead lights are still the bane of getting the best picture quality from them. For the large 60"+ screen sizes, Sharp has some pretty good LED-LCD models. And Samsung is still very much in both the plasma and LED-LCD contender's ring. So between those options, you can find a good TV for almost any situation I just wish the super glossy screens would go away

 

[afterlife2]

Great thread with lots of great Info. Thanks alot FirstReflection.

 

[ImcLoud]

Awesome thread...
Im in need of a decent 5.1 system speakers only, I want to spend under $1000. I dont have a ton of wattage to play with a true 80w rms for each channel, so I would think eff. is important, the room is about 15X20 {9ft ceilings}... Mostly for movies... Heres what I was thinking before I read your thread...
1-Bic F12 sub $197
4-HSU- hb1 mks horn bookshelfs $600 {what do you think of these} I heard a set powered by a tiny tube amp that sounded amazing...
1 SVS scs02 center channel $100
that puts me around $900, I was also thinking about the aperion 4t setup that they have on sale for 1000, but I heard they need a lot of power... thanks your input would be greatly appreciated..

 

[shadyJ]

Awesome thread...
Im in need of a decent 5.1 system speakers only, I want to spend under $1000. I dont have a ton of wattage to play with a true 80w rms for each channel, so I would think eff. is important, the room is about 15X20 {9ft ceilings}... Mostly for movies... Heres what I was thinking before I read your thread...
1-Bic F12 sub $197
4-HSU- hb1 mks horn bookshelfs $600 {what do you think of these} I heard a set powered by a tiny tube amp that sounded amazing...
1 SVS scs02 center channel $100
that puts me around $900, I was also thinking about the aperion 4t setup that they have on sale for 1000, but I heard they need a lot of power... thanks your input would be greatly appreciated..

Wow, you do NOT want to pair the Hsu speakers with an SVS center. Two very different speakers! It is recommended that you keep the front stage (front left/right and center) the same line of speakers, if not the same exact speakers. The reason for this is otherwise you get a schizophrenic sound, it will sound very unnatural. One thing you can do is simply use another Hsu HB-1 as a center, you can turn it on its side. This can save you some money and also avoid the usual issues with traditional center speakers.

I would not get the 4t towers, those 4" woofers will have their limits.

 

[ImcLoud]

Wow, you do NOT want to pair the Hsu speakers with an SVS center. Two very different speakers! It is recommended that you keep the front stage (front left/right and center) the same line of speakers, if not the same exact speakers. The reason for this is otherwise you get a schizophrenic sound, it will sound very unnatural. One thing you can do is simply use another Hsu HB-1 as a center, you can turn it on its side. This can save you some money and also avoid the usual issues with traditional center speakers.

I would not get the 4t towers, those 4" woofers will have their limits.

OK how about this....
If I keep it all Ascend and go with
2-cmt340's for the fronts
an hmt 200 for the center and 2 hmt 200s for the rears {center and rears cant be rear ported}, then either a hsu sub or a bic f12

 

[jcl]

OK how about this....
If I keep it all Ascend and go with
2-cmt340's for the fronts
an hmt 200 for the center and 2 hmt 200s for the rears {center and rears cant be rear ported}, then either a hsu sub or a bic f12

It's probably best to stick with the cmt340 center if you can. That would be a good system, but even with the hmt200 center isn't that over the $1000 budget even before you add the sub?

HSU offers packages that you might look at.

Another thought are the Infinity Primus. Especially if you're near a Frys and can get the 363 towers for $200/pr. 143s for surrounds and 351 for center and I think you'd still be under $600, leaving a decent amount for an economic sub or two.

Newegg also has the pioneer speakers for sale. These might not be efficient enough for your needs. However, the prices are right and would leave a lot of budget for sub(s) again.

 

[jonnythan]

I'd rather do 3 CMT-170s across the front than any mixing of 340s and 200s.

 

[ImcLoud]

It's probably best to stick with the cmt340 center if you can. That would be a good system, but even with the hmt200 center isn't that over the $1000 budget even before you add the sub?

HSU offers packages that you might look at.

Another thought are the Infinity Primus. Especially if you're near a Frys and can get the 363 towers for $200/pr. 143s for surrounds and 351 for center and I think you'd still be under $600, leaving a decent amount for an economic sub or two.

Newegg also has the pioneer speakers for sale. These might not be efficient enough for your needs. However, the prices are right and would leave a lot of budget for sub(s) again.

I seen the pioneers for under $300 and Im impressed with the sound {I heard the previous series, but Im pretty sure they are similar}, but I was looking to step up a little from the 5.1 in a box setup...
the ascend {2-363's, and 3 200's} comes to $832 before shipping... Leaving me enough for a bic f12 sub, {Ill be a little over budget with shipping}

 

[jonnythan]

You're not listening to us. You cannot mix speakers across the front soundstage. Don't do it. Just don't do it. Stay within the same line and preferably the same speaker.

I recommend either:
3x170s plus 2x 200s from Ascend for about $800 shipped
Pioneer C21 plus pair of FS51 plus pair of BS41 from Newegg for $450
2x P163 plus 1x PC251 plus 2x P153 from Amazon for $470

 

[FirstReflection]

Hey there, ImcLoud

Thanks for getting in touch.

First and foremost, let's start by getting better acquainted with your room!

You say your room is about 15' wide by about 20' long by 9' high. Is it enclosed? Or do you have openings to other rooms as well?

Also, how far away are you sitting? What's the basic sort of layout of your room. Do you have your TV mounted or positioned on a TV stand right against that 15' wall? Do you have your couch out into the room about 12 feet away from the TV, or do you have the couch pushed all the way back against the back wall so that your distance from the seat to the TV is closer to the full 20' length of the room?

We need to know the basics of your room before we can make suggestions that best fit your needs

Even if your room is enclosed, it's would still be 2700 cubic feet in air volume, which is a medium sized room. The HSU STF-2 subwoofer that I've recommended in this package will perform alright in a room that size. But if the room has openings to other parts of the house, the STF-2 might start to struggle a little bit, and you will want to consider a larger, more powerful (and more expensive) subwoofer.

The room really determines everything. And you do NOT want to skimp on the subwoofer! You would be far better off to use your $1000 budget to just buy one pair of good front speakers and a subwoofer that can properly handle your room size vs. getting all five speakers and a subwoofer that is not capable of handling your room size right away! But it all depends on your room and seating distance. So we've got to start with that first

There are lots of options for speakers. As others have pointed out, you always want to get a really good match across your front 3 speakers. This is a particular gripe of mine when a sound pans across the front soundstage, and the timbre of the sound clearly changes as the sound goes from Left to Center to Right, or vice versa. I want that sound to have the exact same timbre as it moves across the front 3 speakers - which is the way it SHOULD sound.

From what you've said so far, you seem to be concerned with being able to get high output (loud), and it also seems like maybe you have limited space for your center speaker, perhaps? I'm not sure. I'm just guessing based on what you've said. Again, we need to know all about your room.

So what is your room's layout? Does it have openings to other parts of the house? How far away are you sitting? How is the TV mounted or what sort of stand do you have the TV on? And just in general, how do you have the furniture arranged?

We'll get you sorted out as soon as we have a better picture of your room

 

[ImcLoud]

Hey there, ImcLoud

Thanks for getting in touch.

First and foremost, let's start by getting better acquainted with your room!

You say your room is about 15' wide by about 20' long by 9' high. Is it enclosed? Or do you have openings to other rooms as well?

Also, how far away are you sitting? What's the basic sort of layout of your room. Do you have your TV mounted or positioned on a TV stand right against that 15' wall? Do you have your couch out into the room about 12 feet away from the TV, or do you have the couch pushed all the way back against the back wall so that your distance from the seat to the TV is closer to the full 20' length of the room?

We need to know the basics of your room before we can make suggestions that best fit your needs

Even if your room is enclosed, it's would still be 2700 cubic feet in air volume, which is a medium sized room. The HSU STF-2 subwoofer that I've recommended in this package will perform alright in a room that size. But if the room has openings to other parts of the house, the STF-2 might start to struggle a little bit, and you will want to consider a larger, more powerful (and more expensive) subwoofer.

The room really determines everything. And you do NOT want to skimp on the subwoofer! You would be far better off to use your $1000 budget to just buy one pair of good front speakers and a subwoofer that can properly handle your room size vs. getting all five speakers and a subwoofer that is not capable of handling your room size right away! But it all depends on your room and seating distance. So we've got to start with that first

There are lots of options for speakers. As others have pointed out, you always want to get a really good match across your front 3 speakers. This is a particular gripe of mine when a sound pans across the front soundstage, and the timbre of the sound clearly changes as the sound goes from Left to Center to Right, or vice versa. I want that sound to have the exact same timbre as it moves across the front 3 speakers - which is the way it SHOULD sound.

From what you've said so far, you seem to be concerned with being able to get high output (loud), and it also seems like maybe you have limited space for your center speaker, perhaps? I'm not sure. I'm just guessing based on what you've said. Again, we need to know all about your room.

So what is your room's layout? Does it have openings to other parts of the house? How far away are you sitting? How is the TV mounted or what sort of stand do you have the TV on? And just in general, how do you have the furniture arranged?

We'll get you sorted out as soon as we have a better picture of your room

OK.. the room is 15x20, the couch is on the 20ft wall and across from the couch on the other 20ft wall is the tv, its mounted above the fireplace... The room has an opening on one of the 15' sides that is about 8' wide that goes into the kitchen and hall to the formal parlor... The house was built in 2010 and is very well insulated, sound does not travel room to room very well...

I dont usually play music in the living room, but I wouldnt mind playing the fronts once and a while so I dont have to use the multiroom system, thats why I wanted the larger fronts.... the front center has to be mounted on the wall over the mantle since that is where the wire is and I dont think my wife would appreciate it in front of the fireplace.. The rear are also mounted on the ceiling and I would like to keep them small... The fronts can be mounted anywhere, and the sub outlet is next to the couch on the unppened 15' wall...

It may not matter but my house has a 12 channel multi room audio system, that uses yamaha ceiling speakers, that can be tied into the surround sound system, they are in the kitchen, loft, dining room, ect, pretty much all the common rooms except the living room...

I didnt want to spend more than $1000 but if I have to go to $1500-2000 to be rite, I will... More or less looking for the most for my money..

thanks in advance, I am lost with this stuff, I am a Master Mechanical Contractor so if we were talking about ground source geo thermal heat pumps I would not have any questions and tons of answers but, surround sound Im new to... The house we moved from I bought when I was 20 years old and is 1500 sq feet total so a set of pc speakers used to fill it with sound, this new house is 4000+ you can have Aerosmith playing in the master and not know it in the kitchen...

 

[ImcLoud]

All rite...
I jut called ascend, they say I can block the port hole with no trouble on the center channel, they gave me a price of $1000 for 3 320's and 2 200's with a set of stands and mounts...
So NOW Im thinking that 5.1 setup, with a BIC F12 sub Puts my cost around $1200
And I have room to expand, I will save up for a mk4 sub $550, another Emotiva 125x2 amp with another pair of 200's $650 will get me to 7.1 or 7.2 if I keep the bic...

How does that sound??? Im only home for so long, so I want get it done before Im sent back out...

 

[FirstReflection]

Sounds like a great deal on the Ascend speakers! Three CMT-340 SE across the front with HTM-200 SE surrounds is a great speaker setup!

Honestly though, I wouldn't bother with the subwoofer for the moment if you don't have the cash on hand. Just save up. You wouldn't want to pair the inexpensive little BIC subwoofer with a way better sub like the HSU VTF-2 MK4. If you go dual subs, it's best if they're identical. So just keep the subwoofer cash for now, save up, and get an HSU VTF-2 MK4 or SVSound PB12-NSD when you have the money

 

[ahblaza]

Sounds like a great deal on the Ascend speakers! Three CMT-340 SE across the front with HTM-200 SE surrounds is a great speaker setup!

Honestly though, I wouldn't bother with the subwoofer for the moment if you don't have the cash on hand. Just save up. You wouldn't want to pair the inexpensive little BIC subwoofer with a way better sub like the HSU VTF-2 MK4. If you go dual subs, it's best if they're identical. So just keep the subwoofer cash for now, save up, and get an HSU VTF-2 MK4 or SVSound PB12-NSD when you have the money

I must agree, I have the 340's upfront with the 170's sides in another room without a sub and I am happy for now, good call FR, save up for a better sub, you will be glad you did.
Jeff

 

[jonnythan]

If you're going to be spending $1200+, you really owe it to yourself to spend more of it on the sub than that. Either stretch your budget to include a VFT-2 or FV15, or get 170s instead of 340s across the front.

 

[jcl]

You're not listening to us. You cannot mix speakers across the front soundstage. Don't do it. Just don't do it. Stay within the same line and preferably the same speaker.

Thanks, that's what I meant, but not what I said.