Marants SR7001 (AVR) & NAD T955 Power amp.

E

ElCid79

Audioholic Intern
What do you all think of this pairing?

I have a marantz SR7001. Its in good working order, but I was thinking about slowly switching over to seperates. I only have a 5.1 setup.

My plan:

Buy the NAD T955 Amp. today Connect it to the SR7001 for now..

Down the road, purchase a new pre/pro.

Then if i upgrade to 7.1 buy a really nice 2 channel amp. (Probably NAD.) Use the T955 for the surrounds.

What do you all think?

Would the difference in the external amp vs. internals be significant?

ElCid79

My setup,
Mains Klipsch KF-28
Surrounds Klipsch SF-1
Center Klipsch SC-1
Sub Klipsch KSW-12
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
What do you all think of this pairing?

I have a marantz SR7001. Its in good working order, but I was thinking about slowly switching over to seperates. I only have a 5.1 setup.

My plan:

Buy the NAD T955 Amp. today Connect it to the SR7001 for now..

Down the road, purchase a new pre/pro.

Then if i upgrade to 7.1 buy a really nice 2 channel amp. (Probably NAD.) Use the T955 for the surrounds.

What do you all think?

Would the difference in the external amp vs. internals be significant?

ElCid79

My setup,
Mains Klipsch KF-28
Surrounds Klipsch SF-1
Center Klipsch SC-1
Sub Klipsch KSW-12
It may, but I doubt it. When that 110W SR-7001 is putting out 16W, those KF-28 would be producing 110 dB at 1 meter, probably still over 100 dB from your listening position depending on your room dimension/acoustic condition so you have plenty of headroom as it is now. An external amp, say one with 300W PC may gain you 3 to 5 dB of SPL.
 
adwilk

adwilk

Audioholic Ninja
The sensitive and efficient Klipsch speakers you have won't benefit much from adding an external amp. Probably won't benefit at all. But, thats already been said. If you're not happy with the sound you're currently getting, spend money on your speakers. I dont hate the Icon series by any stretch, but upgrading to the reference or a different speaker entirely will improve your sound much more than adding electronics of any sort.
 
E

ElCid79

Audioholic Intern
Thanks for the input y'all I went on ahead and ordered the amp. I have a 7 day no questions return policy, so I will give it a try and see what happens. I imagine having the isolation of a non integrated will give me a really crisp sound. I will keep you all posted.
 
E

ElCid79

Audioholic Intern
So I hooked the NAD up today, and honestly, it sounds suprisingly better. I was planning on taking it back, I just wanted to try it out. But some of the shrillness of the Marantz/Klipsch has been balanced out. It seems to have a little more punch, but overall a better balance, than what was coming out of the Marantz alone.

It also sounded a little crisper in the low/high swings..

To test this, I hooked the left speaker up to the marantz, and the right speaker up to the NAD. I played a few tracks that I was familiar with and switched between the two. (sometimes in a stereo direct output, and others in a generated mono.) This was really quite suprising...

Plus it looks really cool sitting next to everything... Haha.

I will write up a more thorough review after I break it in a bit longer.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
So I hooked the NAD up today, and honestly, it sounds suprisingly better. I was planning on taking it back, I just wanted to try it out. But some of the shrillness of the Marantz/Klipsch has been balanced out. It seems to have a little more punch, but overall a better balance, than what was coming out of the Marantz alone.

It also sounded a little crisper in the low/high swings..

To test this, I hooked the left speaker up to the marantz, and the right speaker up to the NAD. I played a few tracks that I was familiar with and switched between the two. (sometimes in a stereo direct output, and others in a generated mono.) This was really quite suprising...

Plus it looks really cool sitting next to everything... Haha.

I will write up a more thorough review after I break it in a bit longer.
Thanks for the feedback. Just so you know, when I first experimented with adding external amps I also thought it made my speakers sound better. I eventually woke up and realized that the speakers sounded different due to other factors, such as difference in SPL, locations etc. Since I invested money and was expecting improvements, any perceieved difference ended up being perceived as "better", ignoring what others told me that either they could not tell the difference, or yes they may be different but not sure if one was better than the other.

Anyway, quite often adding an amp does make a "better" difference but I still feel with the equipment you have any difference would not be significant, mainly due to the speakers characteristics and the fact that the SR7001 is a competent mid range AVR with reasonably strong power output, for those Klipsch anyway, unless there is something wrong with the unit. Before your return period expires you could ask other non audiophile type of people to help you determine what is what, best try doing some sort of blind tests such that the person could not tell which speaker is driven by the amp. You should not use stereo either for the obvious reason (that the speakers are not getting the same signal), unless you switch the two around several times to establish some sort of consistency. Also, remember the same speaker in a different location could also sound quite different, so you may want to take some mitigating steps in that regard also.

Adding an amp always helps and never hurts so there is nothing wrong with keeping it regardless, unless you want to spend the money to upgrade something that undoubtedly would get you more return on your investment.
 
E

ElCid79

Audioholic Intern
Peng,

Actually there WAS a problem with the amp section of my marantz. Shortly after a move, 2 of the channels were not working correctly. The Right C channel, and the surround Left. Both were very weak and staticy.

This is what got me started looking into upgrading the receiver.

Well in the course of trouble shooting, I realized that the preamp outputs were functioning properly and the fault was isolated to the amp section.

So I needed to decide, invest in a new receiver, or buy an amp, and start on the path to a pre/pro.

I found the NAD amplifier, it was within what I had established as my budget, by quite a large margin. So I thought, okay I will order this....

Well, in the mean time, just before ordering, I decided to see if I could figure out what was wrong with the amp. I was a computer science major in school. I had taken a fair bit of Electrical Engineering, and had built a ton of computers in the past. But I had never worked on an amplifier.

I thought, well who cares, I will take this thing apart and see if I can figure out whats wrong with it. I was not checking each individual part, but just looking for overal obvious problems on the individual circuits.

Everything appeard normal. No obvious falures. No funny smells. So I reassembled everything, and low and behold, it worked. Every channel had come back.

So now I didn't need to invest in seperates. But I was still worried about the Marantz amp failing again, so I ordered the NAD with the thought of just trying it out and see if I liked it. As of now I really do.

My future plans are to build a tube amp. I think that I will be hooking the smaller klipsch speakers, and perhaps the bigger ones also, up to those and then putting something different in the den with the home theater. Who knows in the long run though.

I agree, that the sound may not be "better" just different. The more mellow, or balanced even, sound from the NAD works for me. I found the Marantz/Klipsch to be very shrill, infact, I was not a fan of the speakers at first because of this. That was the first thing that I noticed when connecting to the NAD. That went away, immediatly. I have a good friend, comming over tomorrow to llisten to everything. I will blind test him a bit and see what he thinks. I will keep you all posted.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I agree, that the sound may not be "better" just different. The more mellow, or balanced even, sound from the NAD works for me. I found the Marantz/Klipsch to be very shrill, infact, I was not a fan of the speakers at first because of this. That was the first thing that I noticed when connecting to the NAD. That went away, immediatly. I have a good friend, comming over tomorrow to llisten to everything. I will blind test him a bit and see what he thinks. I will keep you all posted.
I have no doubt amps can get you "better" and more balanced sound in many setups. Again, I am surprised in this case because you have a very capable AVR and those Klipsch have above average sensitivity. May be there is till something wrong with the Marantz's internal power amps but like you said the preamp section may be perfect so the NAD is happy. Have you tried listening at lower SPL such as at -20 to -25 on your Marantz volume? I do expect the two will sound noticeably different if you crank it to say -10 and higher because the Klipsch may have some very low impedance dips that could stress the weaker amps on the SR7001. It also depends on the kind of music you listen to especially if you compare the two in MCH modes.

Regardless, having an amp such as that NAD is obviously a good thing. Some of us just want to let people know sometimes (not always) you get more return by investing on better speakers instead of amps.
 

momarty

Audiophyte
Marants SR7001 (AVR) & NAD T955 Power amp

ElCid79,

How are things going with the Nad T955?
Have you had a chance to listen to it being used for just stereo playback yet?
I hope things are going well with it; I am contemplating purchasing one also.

momarty
 
moves

moves

Audioholic Chief
It may, but I doubt it. When that 110W SR-7001 is putting out 16W, those KF-28 would be producing 110 dB at 1 meter, probably still over 100 dB from your listening position depending on your room dimension/acoustic condition so you have plenty of headroom as it is now. An external amp, say one with 300W PC may gain you 3 to 5 dB of SPL.


K sooo let me get this straight because I am a little confused about some tech specs and how they are derived. As well, I am a little stoned so bare with me here...

I took a look at the Klipsch KF-28 and their sensitivity rating is 98db @ 2.83V / 1m. Correct me if I am wrong but sensitivity is measured by how loud the speaker sings when giving 1 watt of power.. is this right?

Does 1W always give 2.83V? and isn't the 1m standard? If so, then why are they listing it? I think they are just trying to confuse me! Also, those speakers say that they can take 600W peak... yikes that's a lot! When you said "When that 110W SR-7001 is putting out 16W, those KF-28 would be producing 110 dB at 1 meter"... well if the speaker plays at 110db when given 110W when it's rated 150W - 600W, what the heck is this speaker going to do when given 600W?

This might be a dumb question but I don't know!
 
moves

moves

Audioholic Chief
Wow that was so useful and easy to understand.... that answer should be a sticky. Good work Peng
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
K sooo let me get this straight because I am a little confused about some tech specs and how they are derived. As well, I am a little stoned so bare with me here...

I took a look at the Klipsch KF-28 and their sensitivity rating is 98db @ 2.83V / 1m. Correct me if I am wrong but sensitivity is measured by how loud the speaker sings when giving 1 watt of power.. is this right?

Does 1W always give 2.83V? and isn't the 1m standard? If so, then why are they listing it? I think they are just trying to confuse me! Also, those speakers say that they can take 600W peak... yikes that's a lot! When you said "When that 110W SR-7001 is putting out 16W, those KF-28 would be producing 110 dB at 1 meter"... well if the speaker plays at 110db when given 110W when it's rated 150W - 600W, what the heck is this speaker going to do when given 600W?

This might be a dumb question but I don't know!

First of all, you don't always get 1W with 2.83V, it depends on the impedance. If the load impedance is 8 ohms resistive, that is the phase angle between current and voltage is zero, then

Power=V*V/R, or V = square root of (Power*R)

If Voltage V = 2.83V, and impedance = 8 ohms (resistive),

then Power = 2.83*2.83/8 = 1W

Now if impedance = 4 ohms resistive, then

Power = 2.83*2.83/4 = 2W

You can see that for a speaker sensitivity of 98 dB, 2.83V @ 1 m, the power required to obtain 98 dB will be 1W only if the impedance is 8 ohms resitive. If it is 4 ohms then you need 2W to get the same 98 dB of SPL.

According to Klipsch, the nominal impedance of the KF-28 is 8 ohms, that's why I assume it takes 1W to yield 98 dB @ 1m. For every doubling of power you get SPL increase of 3 dB, hence 16W for 110, 32W for 113, 64W for 116, 128W for 119, 256W for 122, 512W for 124, and 600W for 124.69 dB, 1024W for 127 dB.

So in theory, if the impedance is in fact 8 ohms resistive and there is no room gain, 600W peak would yield a peak SPL of 124.69 dB. In reality, things wouldn't be that simple. The specified impedance of 8 ohms is "nominal" so we have no idea what it really is at a given signal at a given time, we also don't know the phase angle between current and voltage but it is highly unlikely that the load impedance will be purely resitive. Also, there will also be room gain due to sound reflections/reinforcement, how much gain you get depends on placement of the speaker and how it interacts with your particular room.

Now let's say we ignore any room gain effect, we are talking 124.69 dB only at 1m. For every doubling in distance you get 6 dB less, so at 4m, you get 124.69-12 = 112.69 dB. Again, in reality, you mostly likely will have room gain, 3 to 6 dB is quite possible so in the end you would most likely get more than 112.69 dB from 4m, with 600W, assuming the speaker can handle the power without any sort of compression.

Keep in mind at the end of the day we are dealing with lots of assumptions and approximations, but it probably do get you in the ball park, say within +/- a few dB.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Wow that was so useful and easy to understand.... that answer should be a sticky. Good work Peng
I was editing it but I decided it was easier to delete it first. Sorry you read it before I had it fixed.:)
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top