Definitive Technology Supercube II vs. Supercube 4000

[Seth=L]

I'm looking to consolidate my subwoofer situation. I have 4 subs total with only one of which in use. I only need one subwoofer in my home and I'm heavily considering one of the Definitive Tech Supercubes.

It appears the Supercube 4000 is meant to be the replacement model for the Supercube II with a slightly lower MSRP and a "56 bit DSP processor" as well as wireless capability. If there are other differences and/or someone has heard both under the same circumstances I would like to know as much as possible to help guide my purchase decision.

Now I don't think I'd ever use the wireless feature and I'm not absolutely sure that I would use whatever feature that requires the use of a "56 bit DSP processor" if said feature even does anything other than give me bragging rights, "Yep, it processes at 56 bits, almost as awesome as 64 bit Windows 7 ULTIMATE AWESOME SUPER COOL OPERATING SYSTEM, I ROCK AND HAVE THE MOST SPECIALIST STUFF!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

I prefer the more conservative look and construction of the Supercube II, and I've heard the Supercube II and it was quite impressive despite its size. I am overly obsessed with getting excellent performance out of small packages, and this follows true for most all things for me. I like small speakers, compact amps, tiny subs, and petite women......

I would be open to suggestions of other compact subs outside the two I've mentioned. I've looked at a few from Sunfire, Velodyne, & Klipsch but nothing has unanimously positive reviews like the Supercube II, which is presently what I'm leaning most toward.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Supercube II looks really tiny, but 14 hz extension out of 8" woofer?? at -10dB I assume... It's fighting the laws of physics and hopelessly loosing..

But it's out of production so the liquidation price is more attractive than original retail.

I understand you desire for smaller subs, but imo you should go with something with more kick:
http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers/sealed-box/sb13-plus?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=10&category_id=6

Rythmik Audio servo subwoofer 12" F12SE Signature Edition

Note : F12SE is -3dB at 14Hz

 

[Seth=L]

I've been doing a lot of research, reading user reviews and it seems pretty much unanimous, the Supercubes get nothing but positive mention other than the rare amplifier problems.

PS: I live in an apartment. For size and performance the supercube is the best fit I've found thus far, just trying to decide which to get. I've also added the supercube I to my consideration.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Our own warp disagrees:
AVS Forum - View Single Post - Supercube II vs everything else!!!

I heard nothing but highest praises for Rythmic subs and they do publish sub measurements, not meaningless numbers like 14-200hz...

Not that I head in person ether of them

I'm sorry that I can't help you select a supercube sub

edit:
I found some measurements for supercube II:

The SuperCube II's close-miked response, normalized to the level at 80 Hz, indicates that the lower –3dB point is at 27 Hz and the –6dB point is at 25 Hz. The upper –3dB point is at 110 Hz when using the LFE input.—MJP

Source:
Definitive Technology Mythos Four Speaker System HT Labs Measures | Home Theater

I think 14hz at -10dB was a lucky guess after all

 

[GlocksRock]

I'd go with the Supercube I over the II or 4000, the driver in that sub is a beast. It's the same one used in my BP7001SC towers and I had to replace the sub once and was very surprised at how beefy it is when I took it out of the tower.

 

[Seth=L]

Our own warp disagrees:
AVS Forum - View Single Post - Supercube II vs everything else!!!

I heard nothing but highest praises for Rythmic subs and they do publish sub measurements, not meaningless numbers like 14-200hz...

Not that I head in person ether of them

I'm sorry that I can't help you select a supercube sub

edit:
I found some measurements for supercube II:


Source:
Definitive Technology Mythos Four Speaker System HT Labs Measures | Home Theater

I think 14hz at -10dB was a lucky guess after all

As I understand it placement has a lot to do with the extension. I seem to recall 2ft x 2ft corner placement is optimal.

Again, I cannot stress enough how much size plays as a factor here. I am min-maxing my whole situation.

 

[kini]

As I understand it placement has a lot to do with the extension. I seem to recall 2ft x 2ft corner placement is optimal.

Again, I cannot stress enough how much size plays as a factor here. I am min-maxing my whole situation.

Well then there are still a few other options. I don't know how much your are able to get the SCII or SCI (or SC4000/6000) for but, SVS has the SB12-NSD that is pretty much flat from 23-200hz for less than $700 including shipping for continental US and it's about 14" cubed
http://www.svsound.com/subwoofers/sealed-box/sb12-nsd?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=11&category_id=6

NHT B-12d is quite good from 30hz and up at 14" cubed.
B-12d Powered Subwoofer | Home Theater | Premium Audio Equipment

Both will probably pick up some low end extension with room gain.

Emotiva has the similar sized X-Ref 10 and 12" subs

The SVS is probably the best of the bunch by a fair margin.

Sound and Vision measured the SC 4000 at 29-89 +,- 3db. Not a great range if you have small speakers or sats. It did perform well within that range though and you probably would see some room gain as it is a pseudo sealed sub.

Polk has some small sealed subs that you can sometimes find for big discounts on their eBay store.

Gene

 

[Seth=L]

Apparently the Definitive Supercubes rely heavily on room gain and positioning. I'm tampering with a small Yamaha subwoofer with an 8" woofer using the positioning methodology suggested for the Supercubes and the results are good for music, blending is pretty seamless.

I also have a Klipsch Sub10 which is on the large side. It's rear ported and has a large cabinet volume for a 10" subwoofer. It is positioned between my entertainment center and the right front speaker. I placed the Yamaha behind the front right speaker (front right speaker is about 3 feet away from the back wall and 1 foot away from the side wall, not much I can do about that).

So far it seems the Yamaha integrates better but obviously won't share the Klipsch Sub10s ability to produce strong LFE for movies. This brings me to the Supercube. The Supercube should successfully replace both subs giving me the best of both. The size and punch of the Yamaha will likely be bested by the Supercube and I suspect it will also out the Klipsch for output and extension (the Sub10 is only rated down to 25Hz I believe and even with room gain it doesn't go much lower, maybe that's because of it's own cabinet volume and port tuning?).

I've read in several places that the Supercube II is capable of causing structural damage. While this isn't necessarily a positive thing I like to know it has room to expand if I need it to.

One user review had indicated they had previous experience with a Miller & Kreisel MX-70, which is what is very similar in design to the push-pull MX-100 I used to own. The MX-100 remains my favorite sounding subwoofer that I have OWNED, but it died long ago and I left it in the wrong hands for repairs and now it is gone. It had exeptional depth and accuracy, but had limited output due to it's meager 100 watt amplifier.

Having heard the Supercube II in the showroom I can certainly understand where the reviewer had come to that conclusion. I've heard the Supercubes under good and bad conditions and placement with this little gadget is absolutely the key to getting them to sound amazing.

I'm keeping my eyes peeled for USED subs, so I'm hoping to nail one for a good price. I'm watching all active listings and constantly checking for new ones coming up for sale. I've got the deal finding down to near science. If I can get either the Supercube I or II for $400-500 respectively, then I'm probably going to get one. I can offload the Klipsch and two M&K single 12" sealed cabinet subwoofers I'm not using, and just keep the Yamaha because it's not worth anything more than $30 on the open market anyway.

 

[its phillip]

Sb12-nsd >_>

 

[Seth=L]

Sb12-nsd >_>

-_-

It's....too....BIG! must be smaller

EDIT: Realized it's pretty much exactly the same size as the Supercube I, still gonna cost me more though.

 

[Seth=L]

Starting reading a thread here...

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/subwoofers/38193-definitive-technology-supercube-i-vs-svs-sb12-plus.html

While I haven't finished I've found an interesting post.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/341537-post11.html

It rolls off quicker like a ported sub, however without the typical behavior of a ported sub of sounding unnaturally muddy when put in a corner it seems it reduces the FR....

The SVS has a smoother roll-off because it is acoustic suspension.

 

[Seth=L]

Looking much closer at the SVS SB12-NSD, but what of the SVS SB12-Plus. It has a parametric EQ among other niceties. Is it just as good or better than the SB12-NSD? Being the NSD is the replacement have there been any improvements made?

 

[djreef]

Looking much closer at the SVS SB12-NSD, but what of the SVS SB12-Plus. It has a parametric EQ among other niceties. Is it just as good or better than the SB12-NSD? Being the NSD is the replacement have there been any improvements made?

I love my twins, but they're music only in my setup. They have a pretty steep roll of @ 25Hz in my room positioned where they are, but I'm good with that.

DJ

 

[Seth=L]

I love my twins, but they're music only in my setup. They have a pretty steep roll of @ 25Hz in my room positioned where they are, but I'm good with that.

DJ

I'm thinking loading it in the corner should get the FR down, maybe some tweaking with the EQ will help as well.

 

[djreef]

I'm thinking loading it in the corner should get the FR down, maybe some tweaking with the EQ will help as well.

It sure couldn't hurt. As long as you go with a sealed design getting the sub deeper won't be as much of an issue past a certain point, then you have distortion per watt issues the you have to deal with.

DJ

 

[ack_bak]

I own Deftech speakers (7.0) and very much enjoy them. That said, I have never put much stock in the in their advertised specs. I suspect if their sub can dig that low, it is not at high SPL, and it is most likely with lots of distortion.

Personally, I would take the SVS

But there are other options like Rythmik, Epik, and HSU that come to mind if they can fit in your space.

 

[Seth=L]

I just hope it's not just a marginal improvement over the Klipsch Sub10.

 

[Seth=L]

And I lost the auction, so no SVS SB12-Plus for me.

Going back to the drawing board.

 

[ack_bak]

What is your room size length, width, and height? Is it open to their rooms?

What is your budget?

What is this sub going to be used mostqly for, movies/TV, music, etc.

The room size will often dictate which sub you need.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

how about this one?
BOSTON ACOUSTICS RPS1000 Reflection 10in 500 Watt Powered Subwoofer | Accessories4less