Velodyne DLS-5000Rs Replacement/Upgrade

[jeanseb]

I'm selling my twin DLS-5000R for an upgrade. My friend has a single uncalibrated HSU VTF3 MKII and I found that it sound so much cleaner than my Velos!!

Now I need your help because I've been out of the audio game for a while. Would you recommend the new HSU VTF3 MK4? Any other suggestions in HSU or others?

Thanks a lot for your help everyone

 

[billy p]

I'm selling my twin DLS-5000R for an upgrade. My friend has a single uncalibrated HSU VTF3 MKII and I found that it sound so much cleaner than my Velos!!

Now I need your help because I've been out of the audio game for a while. Would you recommend the new HSU VTF3 MK4? Any other suggestions in HSU or others?

Thanks a lot for your help everyone

You'd likley pay addtional shipping fees to Canada. The VFT3 MK4 retails for 699 + 99 shipped from the States while he Svs retails for 749 + shipping from Canada.

If you do the math the Svs is the better buy in Canada and would have better results <32hz for HT. AAMOF...the pb12 nsd was documented here by Gene to have deeper extension under 25hz than the VFT15H....that is saying a lot.


Read this thread if you like?
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/subwoofers/77050-outlaw-audio-lfm-1-ex-review.html

 

[jeanseb]

You'd likley pay addtional shipping fees to Canada. The VFT3 MK4 retails for 699 + 99 shipped from the States while he Svs retails for 749 + shipping from Canada.

If you do the math the Svs is the better buy in Canada and would have better results <32hz for HT. AAMOF...the pb12 nsd was documented here by Gene to have deeper extension under 25hz than the VFT15H....that is saying a lot.


Read this thread if you like?
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/subwoofers/77050-outlaw-audio-lfm-1-ex-review.html

Sounds like a good option. Is a SVS PB12-NSD as clean as an VTF-2 or VTF-3? I was truly amazed...!

 

[mike c]

i've had twin DLS-5000R's as well (CHT-15R's in my part of the world) ... they were very easy to beat, even by a single ported 10"

 

[billy p]

Sounds like a good option. Is a SVS PB12-NSD as clean as an VTF-2 or VTF-3? I was truly amazed...!

I believe the STF 3 was replaced by the VFT2.3...but I'm not entirly sure? Having heard the sft3 and pb12 & pb10 in the same showroom I eventually opted for the smaller Svs. I've read several arguments even to this day...which people describe Hsu subs as more musical and Svs likely dig a bit deeper but IMO you'd be hard pressed to hear the difference in real world. And for the most part, even to this day people still have allegiance to one brand or the other...lol. Fwiw..either the Hsu or Svs would be a huge improvment over those velos...which I've heard at future shop and for a 15" driver in a huge box they were anemic...

 

[jeanseb]

i've had twin DLS-5000R's as well (CHT-15R's in my part of the world) ... they were very easy to beat, even by a single ported 10"

By improvement was it about output or precision (clean bass)? My Velos are extremely loud but not very clean. I'm looking to buy the one that will provide me the most clean bass possible at about $1k.

My SMS-1 should provide a flat response for the time that I'll only have one sub.

 

[mike c]

across the board i would say.

the velos produced absolutely no "feel", and sometimes i'd wonder if they were even on.
those velos are tuned to around 30hz iirc, this will just not cut it for any movie.

a 1k budget would buy you a great internet direct sub.

 

[jeanseb]

Thanks Mike C!

I'm hesitating between the VTF-15H, VTF3.4 or SVS PB-12NSD. I'm looking for the cleanest bass that can be close to my dual velos output.

SVS is cheaper to get here in Canada, but never heard one. My friend has a VTF3.2 and I really love that sound!

 

[billy p]

Thanks Mike C!

I'm hesitating between the VTF-15H, VTF3.4 or SVS PB-12NSD. I'm looking for the cleanest bass that can be close to my dual velos output.

SVS is cheaper to get here in Canada, but never heard one. My friend has a VTF3.2 and I really love that sound!

Audioholics will be testing the pb12 nsd... soon. I'd wait and see what the review reveals before making any fiinal decisions. FYI...the reviewer mots certainly be Josh Ricci and without a doubt he is one of the most respected members/or reviewer on various AV forums and somebody I'd trust wholeheartedly....if I was to base my final decision without any prior audition or knowledge.

 

[jeanseb]

Audioholics will be testing the pb12 nsd... soon. I'd wait and see what the review reveals before making any fiinal decisions. FYI...the reviewer mots certainly be Josh Ricci and without a doubt he is one of the most respected members/or reviewer on various AV forums and somebody I'd trust wholeheartedly....if I was to base my final decision without any prior audition or knowledge.

Thanks Billy P! I will try to wait, all depending of how fast my 5000Rs will go. VTF3.4 x2 seems interesting. AVS did a good review on the VTF-15H and is very tempting. What do you think of the PB-12+ over the VF-15H?

 

[billy p]

Thanks Billy P! I will try to wait, all depending of how fast my 5000Rs will go. VTF3.4 x2 seems interesting. AVS did a good review on the VTF-15H and is very tempting. What do you think of the PB-12+ over the VF-15H?

AVS or did you mean Sound & Vision? I believe both SV and audioholics reviewed the VFT15H...with slightly different results. Unfortunately in both cases the reviewer in question became polarizing thus creating a lot of controversy with respect to the Hsu. Having heard the pb13u and VFT15H here locally I couldn't really hear a huge difference between the 2 but the pb13u should handle a single VFT15 but at nearly twice the cost and the pb12 plus is almost equal to its bigger brother. Truth be told...I liked both subs but I preferred my subs (Acoustic Elegance driver) tonnal quailty and pitch vs. the other 2 with music ....but hay...I'm partial that way...lol.

 

[jeanseb]

Having heard the pb13u and VFT15H here locally I couldn't really hear a huge difference between the 2 but the pb13u should handle a single VFT15 but at nearly twice the cost and the pb12 plus is almost equal to its bigger brother.

So you actually heard both Lucky you! I live in Montreal and HSU-SVS are rare breeds here. My initial budget was about $1k. I can stretch it to $1.2K but $2k for an Ultra is too much for me.

What was your impression about those subs? How do you compare the sound quality of a VTF-15H vs. a VTF3.x?

Thanks!

 

[billy p]

So you actually heard both Lucky you! I live in Montreal and HSU-SVS are rare breeds here. My initial budget was about $1k. I can stretch it to $1.2K but $2k for an Ultra is too much for me.

What was your impression about those subs? How do you compare the sound quality of a VTF-15H vs. a VTF3.x?

Thanks!

The consensus from Hsu owners would tell you the VTF15 will play louder and extend deeper compared to the 3.4. The 15h is a very capable sub but could exceed your 1200 budget factoring in the added shipping to Quebec. In terms of SQ...you'd be hard pressed to discern any noticable between the likes of Hsu or Svs subs...people have tried and taking cost into account why arguments alway ensue...lol. Of the subs present in our GTG which included a pb13 and the 15h...I stated eariler, I had a slight perference for the tactical or puncy feel of my sub...especially in the upper mid bass region it really shines and kept up with respectively given it size. I don't think it is as capable <20hz at higher SPL vs. the other two...again given its size just not probable. If your looking for more midbass punch >25hz then go with the Hsu but if you want a little more extension down deep....Svs might be a better bet...JMO.

 

[timoteo]

The PB13U is an outstanding sub for sure. Having said that jowever, i couldnt justify the 2K pricetag. Yes the enclosure is beautiful & the driver is a beast but when it came down to performance per dollar i purchased a VTF-15h. The difference between the 2 was almost not noticable when i heard them. I didnt hear them side by side so obviously my listening test was not fair. But for under 1K the 15h is IMHO untouchable.

I you can afford the Ultra then by all means its a beast & a great sub.

I was able ro hear the VTF3/3 against the VTF-15 side by side. The 3/3 was almost as good as tye 15h once calibrated. But the 15 just digs deeper at higher spl capabilities & higher headroom.

I obviously love my 15h. The only improvement for me would be a second or an IB project.

What is your room size?

Because dual 3/3 vs a single 15h is a tough call. It depends on your room really. But dual 15h would be the ultimate IMO.

 

[jeanseb]

The PB13U is an outstanding sub for sure. Having said that jowever, i couldnt justify the 2K pricetag. Yes the enclosure is beautiful & the driver is a beast but when it came down to performance per dollar i purchased a VTF-15h. The difference between the 2 was almost not noticable when i heard them. I didnt hear them side by side so obviously my listening test was not fair. But for under 1K the 15h is IMHO untouchable.

I you can afford the Ultra then by all means its a beast & a great sub.

I was able ro hear the VTF3/3 against the VTF-15 side by side. The 3/3 was almost as good as tye 15h once calibrated. But the 15 just digs deeper at higher spl capabilities & higher headroom.

I obviously love my 15h. The only improvement for me would be a second or an IB project.

What is your room size?

Because dual 3/3 vs a single 15h is a tough call. It depends on your room really. But dual 15h would be the ultimate IMO.

Thanks to you guys again.

One thing I'm scare of if to have a localization problem since I've been running twins for the past 2 years. Timoteo, did you feel any localized bass with your VTF-15H running alone? I just hope that the upgrade worth it.

 

[timoteo]

As long as you cross your speakers over no higher than 100hz then no you wont get any localization. I cross over some speakers at 80hz & my mains at 60hz so i dont have ANY localization.

As far a going from dual subs to a single i can say this. As long as you place a single sub in a good spot you will get just as good of bass at 1 or 2 seating positions. Properly placed dual subs will give you 3-6dB increase & better bass response over a larger seating area.

I used to have dual 12" subs. Once i decided to sell them to upgrade to the VTF-15h i placed them online. After selling 1 of them i recalibrated my system for the 1 left until i sold it. Besides turning the subwoofer trim in my avr up 3dB there was no noticable difference. It kinda suprised me how good the single 12" sounded alone. Now when i moved around to other seats i heard a decrease in smooth bass. However, from my 2 main seats that my wife & i always set in it sounded great.

If you go from your dual Velos to a single sub just make sure you do the "bass crawl" to locate the best placement for it. (research this process if your not familiar with it, its simple) Crossover somewhere below 120hz & experiment with settings. Also remember to give ANY new sub some time to break-in. Every single new subwoofer i have owned has gotten a lit better over the fisrt month or so of using it!!

One really nice feature of the VTF-15h, PB-13U & some others is that you have different option of running them Ported or Sealed. Depending on your room & what frequencies it boosts you can set the sub to sound its best. Also depending on your taste of sound. I run my 15h in Max Output mode which is both ports open.

 

[timoteo]

Accidentally posted twice & had to edit it out. My bad!

 

[j_garcia]

You can delete your post....

 

[jeanseb]

Freakin' UPGRADITIS! It's a kind of love and hate feeling everytime! To upgrade or not to upgrade...?

 

[jeanseb]

The Velodynes are gone It is a sweet and sour feeling since it was my choice to upgrade (upgraditis) but they entertained me a lot over the pas years.

So let's get to the brass tacks. After reading several hours of review and review critics on the VTF-15H, does this subwoofer can deliver true 20Hz extension in "max extension" mode?

Regards,