Should I go with Bookshelf Speakers + Sub, or Tower Speakers?

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Xaios

Audiophyte
First of all, just want to say hi to the folks on this forum. I've lurked on and off for about a year now, I started around the time reviews starting coming for all the subwoofers in that big Ultimate Subwoofer Showdown thingy.

I guess some background info is in order. I've only recently been bitten by the hi-fi audio bug. This is problematic as I'm young, by no means a millionaire and I already have other expensive obsessions including gaming computers and custom-made boutique guitars. Woe is me.

My dad has been an audiophile since the Sixties, I figure I probably get it from him (actually, I definitely get it from him). Growing up, my mother regaled me with stories of how he once went to the doctor because he thought his hearing was going, explaining to the doctor that middle C sounded about 3dB quieter in one ear than in the other. Then there was the story about he once loaned his old Ohm Walsh speakers to their church at the time for a Christmas function, only to have the singers in the choir break out in a panic on stage because they thought an earthquake was happening. :D

I started on the path to enlightenment (aka the path to home theater glory) about a year ago. I picked up a cheap but well reviewed Sony A/V receiver, as well as a pair or Paradigm Cinema ADP speakers. Those speakers have actually been my main speakers ever since I got them, and they actually sound quite nice, but there's no denying that I desire a deeper level of sonic mayhem in my movie merrygoing.

Unfortunately, Paradigm is out for the a variety of reasons, even though I quite like the speakers that I already have and will become my rear speakers. I live in quite a remote place (The Yukon, if you can fathom it ;)). Because of that, shipping costs an arm and a leg. We do have a small boutique electronics store locally, but their markup is... significant. It wasn't such a big deal when I was buying what were ostensibly satellite speakers, but on anything bigger than that, it becomes an issue. That, and the fact that they don't even stock the newest versions of Paradigm's speakers.

The most obvious solution I've come across thus far is Axiom speakers. My dad owns an Axiom EP500 subwoofer, and it certainly brings the thunder. They seem to be a fairly well respected brand among audiophiles from the research I've been able to do. But most importantly, they ship for free.

I'm currenty looking at 2 different scenarios. First, I could go with M60 tower speakers. The alternative is if I go with M22 bookshelf speakers and associated stands, combined with an EP125 subwoofer. (Or I could wait and save for a bit to go with an EP175).

I'm certainly still a neophyte when it comes to high-end audio, but I'm eager to learn. For what it's worth, I currently live in a 1 bedroom basement suite, by myself, so I have other people in the building to consider. However, eventually I plan to own a house as well, once this stupid housing bubble bursts in my area (a house here costs as much as a house in Toronto, if you can wrap your head around that), and I want something that will serve me well into the future.

Any feedback I can get would be most welcome, be it in response to my original query, or if anyone has any alternative suggestions, I would be open to that as well. My budget to do this is currently at about $1200.

(I would have linked to the speakers I'm referring to, but I have been deemed unworthy to do so until I post a bit more.)
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
I really don't think either solution is better. You should look for the best speaker on your budget.

Is 1200 just for the speaker + subwoofer. Do you want only 2 speakers?

Axiom subs are no longer a good value. They have been passed in recent years by a pretty good margin. I'd rank SVS, HSU, Rythmik, ED and Epik as better options.

Since we are talking 3 speakers and a sub. I would recommend a sub from the above groups and whatever 3 speakers you like.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Doesn't matter if you go with towers, in most cases you will still want a sub. With your budget, you aren't going to get 20Hz performing towers, so I'd go with a good sub and bookshelf speakers.
 
X

Xaios

Audiophyte
Thanks for the replies! Looking at some other manufacturers from whom I could get a decent sub in Canada without having to deal with the hassle of importing, I found Funky Waves and SVS. Any others?

Also, now that I look around to those manufacturers, I can see that Axiom isn't such a good value for subwoofers anymore. However from what I can see their speakers still seem to be well priced. Anyone care to chime in on that issue, or suggest alternatives?
 
G

Guinness6

Junior Audioholic
I've only recently been bitten by the hi-fi audio bug. This is problematic as I'm young, by no means a millionaire and I already have other expensive obsessions including gaming computers and custom-made boutique guitars. Woe is me.
Welcome to an addiction that will plague you for the rest of your life! (and you'll love it).

Anyway, my first suggestion is to listen to speakers first, if possible. My second suggestion is to save up as much $ as you can - no point in buying a pair of speakers that will only disappoint you in a few months and put you back in the spot you're in now...
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Thanks for the replies! Looking at some other manufacturers from whom I could get a decent sub in Canada without having to deal with the hassle of importing, I found Funky Waves and SVS. Any others?
HSU Research I believe also has distribution in Canada.

Also, now that I look around to those manufacturers, I can see that Axiom isn't such a good value for subwoofers anymore. However from what I can see their speakers still seem to be well priced. Anyone care to chime in on that issue, or suggest alternatives?
The M3 and M22 are good speakers, but they were a lot more attractive when they were about $100 less expensive in earlier iterations and economies. I don't think they would disappoint, however at about the same prices, I'd look at the Ascend CBM-170SE and CMT-340SE.
 
C

cschang

Audioholic Chief
The M3 and M22 are good speakers, but they were a lot more attractive when they were about $100 less expensive in earlier iterations and economies. I don't think they would disappoint, however at about the same prices, I'd look at the Ascend CBM-170SE and CMT-340SE.
The CBM-170SE and M22 are competitors in output....of course the sound part is subjective.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
The CBM-170SE and M22 are competitors in output....of course the sound part is subjective.
They all pretty much want a sub too, but I feel the Ascends are a bit more even handed in the midrange personally.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
They all pretty much want a sub too, but I feel the Ascends are a bit more even handed in the midrange personally.
But the cabinet construction is pretty bad on the Ascends. There bracing was only little corner braces last I saw. A few added braces would dramatically improve performance.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
But the cabinet construction is pretty bad on the Ascends. There bracing was only little corner braces last I saw. A few added braces would dramatically improve performance.
Funny that you would say that, because I wasn't too impressed with the cabinets on the Axioms (M3), especially for them being a cabinet maker :)
 
C

cschang

Audioholic Chief
But the cabinet construction is pretty bad on the Ascends. There bracing was only little corner braces last I saw. A few added braces would dramatically improve performance.
I think that is debatable. Did you own a pair, or did you see it somewhere? Pics?

Have you seen the inside of the Axioms?
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
The CBM-170SE is small enough that it doesn't need much bracing, so I don't feel bracing would "dramatically" improve it. The improvements would quickly be offset by a price increase for what would likely be only a small improvement. I haven't seen the inside of 340, but they sounded fine to me.
 
timoteo

timoteo

Audioholic General
I have sat & listened to HSU's bookshelf setup & each time i am blown away with their performance let alone their killer price. If you ever listen to the HT-Guys podcast you can hear a review they did on them. Got very good marks!!

For 2 bookshelves & a center it'd run you about $550+tax/ship. But with a $1200 budget that would leave you with enough for a VTF-2MK-4 (12"). They have a 5.1 package deal with 4 bookshelves a center & VTF-1 for $1199. But thats a 10" sub. I would prefer a better sub & sacrifice the surround channels since you have some. But honestly ive heard the Infinity Primus line that are highly reguarded & i would get the HSUs hands down over them.
 
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GoFastr

GoFastr

Full Audioholic
This sub has links to HSU design and it sounds excellant for around $300 with free shipping. It would definately rock your one bedroom. I love mine! Use the rest of your budget for mains, center and surrounds.





 
X

Xaios

Audiophyte
Wow, and I thought this thread was just going to fade into obscurity. Thanks for the replies!

Info I was able to find on that BIC sub above seems fairly positive, but I'm having trouble finding a canadian distributor. The place that Google comes up with no longer sells them, and BIC's website is "being updated." Anyone know where one can be had in Canada?
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
I think that is debatable. Did you own a pair, or did you see it somewhere? Pics?

Have you seen the inside of the Axioms?
I've seen the inside of the Ascends. They put their money in the harder stuff. Adding bracing is not that difficult. You'll find most cabinets very poorly braced because it adds a lot of construction cost. But this is not hard to help out. They are the best bookshelves at their price point IMO.
 
GoFastr

GoFastr

Full Audioholic
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BIC-Acoustech-PL-200-12-1000-Watt-Powered-Subwoofer-/390321889200?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item5ae0ff5fb0#shId
Wow, and I thought this thread was just going to fade into obscurity. Thanks for the replies!

Info I was able to find on that BIC sub above seems fairly positive, but I'm having trouble finding a canadian distributor. The place that Google comes up with no longer sells them, and BIC's website is "being updated." Anyone know where one can be had in Canada?
You might want to give the vendor a call and see what they can do for shipping to Canada. They offer free shipping in the USA but maybe you have a freight forwarder or USA friend that can get it to you somehow.

Their prce on eBay states $329 but if you do the Make Offer price you might get it for $279 like I did. Good luck with your final system purchase.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/BIC-Acoustech-PL-200-12-1000-Watt-Powered-Subwoofer-/390321889200?pt=Speakers_Subwoofers&hash=item5ae0ff5fb0#shId
 
R

Ricardojoa

Audioholic
There isnt necessary to add add braces to a bookshelf as small as the cbm170. 1 proper brace is enough. If i remember correctly, there is only one brace in my sierra. Unless there is long side panel, then there would need more braces.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
There isnt necessary to add add braces to a bookshelf as small as the cbm170. 1 proper brace is enough. If i remember correctly, there is only one brace in my sierra. Unless there is long side panel, then there would need more braces.
We aren't talking necessary. We are talking optimal. It is optimal to have a cross brace for 3 to 4" of material in a loudspeaker enclosure. This pushes cabinet resonances out of the audible range and makes for a less colored sound.
 
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Ricardojoa

Audioholic
Not sure what optimal you are talking about 3-4" braces, but speaker design/built is about trade off and we all know it.
Adding more braces in a cabinet like cbm170 will require recalculating the internal volume and shape of the box, and that will change the desing goal.
You just wont find many <$300 speaker that are heavely brace and i certainly wouldnt call a bad cabinet when the deisnger had specified the data.
 
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