Need help setting up my dream home theatre system

AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Since you are too cheap to get the B&W 802 Diamond as decor, I have decided to buy a pair of B&W 802 Diamond for my next house. They just look too damn sexy to me. I can't resist. PENG wins. I must own a pair. I wish the Rosenut were in high-gloss, though. Maybe when it's time for me to buy them, B&W will have them available in Rosenut high-gloss.:D

 
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AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Yeah...right.....you know each pair of KEF 201/2s has a pair of serial numbers as 123456-FR & 123456-FL.

When I hook up the Left speaker to the Right channel Amp, I can't hear anything. KEF designed the Left speaker to be used only as a Left speaker.

Likewise, when I hook up the Left or Right speaker to the Center channel amp, I cannot hear any dialogues at all because KEF designed them as Left speakers and Right speakers, not as center speakers.

The KEF center speaker has the serial number 123456-C.

Only when I use the speaker with the "C" serial number will dialogues work.

The KEF surround speakers have the serial number 123456-SR & 123456-SL.
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
Ok guys here we go . the question set for today (please do not hate me )

1) According to my bookish knowledge the average adult human hearing capability is from 20Hz to 20 KHz. Most loudspeakers give an output of highs much higher than mentioned above so highs are not an issue. But how important is it for the loudspeaker to produce levels as close to 20hz? I know that the subwoofers do this.

2) JBL synthesis does not have dedicated center speakers. So does this mean the audio signal intended for the center speaker otherwise would be in fact coming out of the loudspeakers. So won’t this hamper the sound quality.?(Too loud maybe). The reason I ask is I have always been taught that the dialogues are always meant to come out of the center speaker. I do not distrust JBL engineers the must have thought of something before designing a high ended product. But I do not understand the motive behind this design

3) TAD reference one gives the best range of frequency responses amongst all. But then how do I use them in a 7 ch home theater. they have no other speakers like the center or sub or surround?

4) All speakers except the subwoofers I guess require less than 1000W of output amplifier power (RMS). So will it be a good idea to keep the 2000W amplifier for every speaker or use that for 2 speakers combined.?

Well that’s it for the day, will be back with more
For what you stated you are listening to, I don't think flat down to 20 hz is really important. It doesn't look like anything you listen to digs that deep. That being said, you might as well get something that goes down that low, simply for the sake of getting a truly full-range system. Any of the high-end subs mentioned will get you to 20 and lower, especially the funkywaves subs.

The JBL sythesis systems are using a center speaker, it is the same as the left and right fronts. This is actually the best way to do a center channel.

As for the TAD One, you shouldn't be concerned about the total range of frequency response from your mains, as long as they go down to 80 hz and up to 19 or 20 khz. After that, it doesn't matter, and shouldn't be a selling point at all. Let the subs take care of everything below 80 hz. By the way, it looks like the TAD One would use an identical tower as a center channel if you were to go in that direction.

As for your fourth point, well you could use 2 kilowatt stereo amps for every couple of speakers. Or you could use a kilowatt amp for every speaker. But A Kilowatt is a lot, and is certainly more than most of any of these speakers need. That is bound to generate a lot of heat too, you would have to have some heavy-duty AC in the equipment closet. I think you would be more than fine with five or six hundred watts per channel. For the ultimate system I would probably go with monoblocks, but truthfully it doesn't matter, it will all sound the same. I would only go with monoblocks for the sake of simplicity and so cooling doesn't become an issue within any individual unit.
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
1) According to my bookish knowledge the average adult human hearing capability is from 20Hz to 20 KHz. Most loudspeakers give an output of highs much higher than mentioned above so highs are not an issue. But how important is it for the loudspeaker to produce levels as close to 20hz? I know that the subwoofers do this.
without any distortion, I honestly can not even hear below around 24hz. My sub is very low distortion. It's only when distortion products (known as doubling) are formed can I hear tones that low, and technically what i'm hearing is double the frequency - IE 48hz. HOWEVER we most certainly "feel" and experience infrasonic bass. It's a unique experience, and some movies definitely dig at least as low as 12hz or so, and some movies go even lower into the 7hz type ranges. Many commercial subwoofers will cut this out of the signal before it reaches the amplifier, in order to protect the driver from overexcursion. If you've got enough "air moving ability". you don't need to protect the driver in that capacity, because there's so many drivers contributing to output that the full signal is converted to acoustic energy without breaking any subwoofers.

An added, although not necessarily audible advantage of not using a high pass filter, is that the driver experiences less phase shift / lower group delay.

As for high frequencies, they're mostly inconsequential, but there might be slight differences in some HF sounds based on the transfer function of the speaker. Berylium tweeters as well as Ribbon Tweeters extend well beyond the audible limtis of our ears, whereas other materials might be about 1 or 2db down by 20hz - but how it sounds is a function of distortion at audible frequencies, not extension to inaudible frequencies.

THe thing ot note is that at high frequencies, the balance between off axis and on axis response is what determines "realistic reproduction". IN some rooms, flat response is a bad idea up high because reflections tilt the power response upwards. As a general rule, don't put too much stock into specifications above 10khz. I can only even hear up to around 14.5khz, personally.

2) JBL synthesis does not have dedicated center speakers. So does this mean the audio signal intended for the center speaker otherwise would be in fact coming out of the loudspeakers. So won’t this hamper the sound quality.?
No, it would just mean the center speaker is identical to the left/right speakers, which is optimal. You NEED acoustically transparent screen material.

3) TAD reference one gives the best range of frequency responses amongst all. But then how do I use them in a 7 ch home theater. they have no other speakers like the center or sub or surround?
There is no matching sub, and if there was, I suspect it would be overpriced.
What you would do is three of TAD Reference Ones, up front.



Mated to four TAD Reference Ones or Compact References, or Pioneer S-2EX on the sides and back.

4) All speakers except the subwoofers I guess require less than 1000W of output amplifier power (RMS). So will it be a good idea to keep the 2000W amplifier for every speaker or use that for 2 speakers combined.?
2000W is a lot of power. Enough to blow even the most robust midrange driver with the right signal. Quite frankly you don't need this sort of power - this is the territory of LARGE professional venues like Cinemas and Stadiums.

In a home, even 250w into 4 ohms is often the most power you'll ever use. I use an amp rated at about 575w into 8 ohm/750w into 4 ohm/1400w into 2 ohm and I can not say decisively if I've yet used any more unclipped power than my 100 watt into 8 ohm receiver. For subs however, limitless headroom is a great idea, because the LFE section of movies is 10db higher in maximum level.

Also bear in mind that the load presented by the speaker is a big determining factor in how much power you need, along with your distance. My speakers are about 88db, nominal 6 ohm with some dips near 4 ohm. About an average load and my 100w receiver drove them fine. If I were using Apogee Scintillas, I bet my high power amp would make a big difference compared to the receiver. If I were using Gedlee Abbeys, I could probably get away with a 50 watt amp with no current reserves and it would probably give me the same dynamics.
 
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AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Grant, you are going WAY OVER my head here, buddy.

Information overload.

Are you trying to fry my brains???:eek:
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
2000W is a lot of power. Enough to blow even the most robust midrange driver with the right signal. Quite frankly you don't need this sort of power - this is the territory of LARGE professional venues like Cinemas and Stadiums.
But if he uses a special power cord and power conditioner, won't that filter out some of the impurities in the electrical current and protect his system from blowing?
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
You know I heard a great many things about these Flatulence speakers:

They come with truly dedicated Front Right, Front Left, Center, Surround Right, Surround Left speakers, & a subwoofer.



 
A

akshay

Audioholic Intern
Can anyone tell me what exactly should i look for in a preamplifier?
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
You should look for the features you want. Do you want ipod docking? netflix streaming? 3d compatibility? support for 9.1 or 11.2 channel modes? and so on. The ones I recommended before, the Integra DHC-80.2 and the Onkyo PR-SC5508 have the latest iteration of Audyssey, MultiEQ XT32 with sub EQing, which is very nice. If I had to choose between them I would go for the Integra, because Onkyo's customer support is reputed to be kind of spotty. From what I have read they are almost identical units though. There are certainly higher-end units from companies like Krell and Anthem, but I don't think that they will be that much more functionally useful, and I don't think their room correction EQ will be substantially better. I think mostly what you are paying those extra thousands of dollars for is a heavier box.
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
We covered this way back on the first page of this thread.

A processor just needs preout voltage, DTS-HD/Dolby TrueHD decoding, and good phono section. The marantz AV7005 is an excellent choice.

Have external devices like a TACT, SVS Audyssey, DEQX, and external video processor handle everything else.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
Can anyone tell me what exactly should i look for in a preamplifier?
The most important thing about a preamplifier is that it has to be able to preamplify the amplifier with a THD of less than 0.0001% from 20Hz-20kHz, with a crosstalk of -140dB from 20Hz-20kHz, SNR of -130dB from 20Hz-20kHz, and a polar response of +/-3dB @ 90 degrees from 20Hz-20kHz.

See you guys tomorrow for the next round. :D
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
The most important thing about a preamplifier is that it has to be able to preamplify the amplifier with a THD of less than 0.0001% from 20Hz-20kHz, with a crosstalk of -140dB from 20Hz-20kHz, SNR of -130dB from 20Hz-20kHz, and a polar response of +/-3dB @ 90 degrees from 20Hz-20kHz.

See you guys tomorrow for the next round. :D
That spec is going to be tough to meet. What the heck is polar response for a preamp, are you thinking of loudspeakers??
 
mtrycrafts

mtrycrafts

Seriously, I have no life.
. What the heck is polar response for a preamp, are you thinking of loudspeakers??
I think it means that no matter which way you turn it on the 3 axis, it will do what he said or better. ;):D
 
A

akshay

Audioholic Intern
Have external devices like a TACT, SVS Audyssey, DEQX, and external video processor handle everything else.
What exactly is the advantage of having separate room correction systems when such things are included in the preamplifier most of the times?

I have read the specs of prepros from denon, onkyo,lexicon and have found out that these come with an automatic room EQ system.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
You know the Mark Levinson preamplifier costs like $20,000, and yet it does not even have room correction?

What's up with that?:eek:

I think it means that when you have enough money, like my budget is $10 million for my next HT room, you just flat out don't need room corrections.:eek:
 
cpp

cpp

Audioholic Ninja
You know the Mark Levinson preamplifier costs like $20,000, and yet it does not even have room correction?
and what did you do before room correction ?
 
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