It looks like it might be open season on pirates, finally.

[Swerd]

Simple lessons for life:

1. Don't sail a yacht near the Somali coast.
2. Don't open fire on a Navy destroyer.
3. Don't stroll through crack town.
4. Don't wear a meat suit in a lion's den.
5. Don't mess with Superman's cape.
6. Don't spit into the wind.
7. Don't pee into the wind.
8. Don't pull the mask off the Lone Ranger.
9. Never wrestle with a turd…
10. Don't argue politics or religion with a zealot, or speaker cable acoustics with an audiophile.
11. Darwin was right, natural selection works. It may be the 21st century, but it still works.

 

[Rickster71]

Without a working Somalian government you will never stop the piracy. Why waste even more money setting up a military operation that will never ever solve the problem, just throw more money and bloodshed at it to at best disrupt it. Wait, that sound like exactly something this country would do.

Personally, unless we want to rebuild the entire continent of Africa after we are done rebuilding the entire Middle East/western Asia/Haiti and are completely bankrupt, I say you don't vacation to African waters, the same way intelligent people don't go to Mexico. Is it right that we can't travel to legitimate places? No, but does it make you stupid if you do anyways? Yes.

While I agree with most of what you've said.
The majority of ships hijacked were oil tankers and cargo ships, not vacationers.
The solution is to shoot the pirates each and every time, and not rebuild their entire country.

 

[gmichael]

While I agree with most of what you've said.
The majority of ships hijacked were oil tankers and cargo ships, not vacationers.
The solution is to BLOW UP the pirates each and every time, and not rebuild their entire country.

Fixed that for ya.

 

[mike c]

Have you seen photos of typical Somali "pirate ships"? It would be like using an atom bomb to swat flies. With a submarine, there is no such thing as a proportionate response. It's a big ka-boom or no ka-boom. Plus, a single Mk48 torpedo or Harpoon missile is worth about 1000 of those "ships".

Surfacing right beside one of those boats would would make them all crap their pants though.

i'm sure the US has used even more expensive means of killing a single person. i.e. cruise missiles, bunker busters, drone missiles

it's not actually the boat, but the pirates on it. send the message: pirates die real quickly, i believe that should put a damper on volunteer pirates.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Since I'm no expert on sailing I need to use the walking analogy again. I don't think you would fair too well distributing Korans from a back pack in Mississippi ... you get what I'm sayin'?

We have no trouble questioning the sanity of somebody wearing a meat suit in a lion's den. Yes ... stop piracy ... probably the best way to do that is by moving to Manitoba.

I highly doubt that anyone distributing korans in Mississippi would ever be kidnapped and murdered for it. But yes, I certainly get what you're sayin'.

"The Adams ran a Bible ministry and had been distributing Bibles to schools and churches in remote villages in areas including the Fiji Islands, Alaska, New Zealand, Central America and French Polynesia."

As far as I know, none of these places are hotbeds of radical Islam.

From what I gather from the linked article, they were heading for the Suez Canal. In which case, it's hard to avoid coming close to Somalia. They were actually close to Oman, and still hundreds of miles away from Somalia, when they were hijacked. The alternative was taking the long way around Africa - thousands of miles and umpteen more weeks at sea. They gambled and lost. I personally would never have taken the chance they took, in such a vulnerable vessel.

 

[GO-NAD!]

i'm sure the US has used even more expensive means of killing a single person. i.e. cruise missiles, bunker busters, drone missiles

You're absolutely right. But, such operations were aimed at "high value" targets, such as Bin Laden and is ilk. I wouldn't waste such resources on these clowns - dangerous as they might be.

it's not actually the boat, but the pirates on it. send the message: pirates die real quickly, i believe that should put a damper on volunteer pirates.

Yes, something certainly needs to be done about them. The trouble is, nobody can really know which vessels are manned by pirates until they attack another vessel. Then, simply shooting them becomes more complicated.

I've been out of the navy for a few years, but I have friends and relatives who have been on anti-piracy patrols in that region. There are thousands of square miles of ocean to cover and hundreds of small boats at sea at any given time. It's impossible to stop and search them all. Besides, as soon as a pirate spots a warship, they dump their arms overboard and by the time they've been boarded, they've become simple fishermen.

You can watch them dump their weapons, but you still can't just shoot at them - that makes you a pirate yourself! Of course, if there are no other vessels in the vicinity, a warship's captain can order them blasted out of the water. However, with hundreds of crewmembers on his ship, he knows that somebody is gonna spill the beans.

Perhaps merchant ships should all be required to carry the means of defending themselves. But, you know what happens then - some trigger-happy dough-head is bound to open up on an innocent fishing boat.

I'm afraid that "just shoot 'em all" is easier said than done.

 

[highfigh]

Yes, something certainly needs to be done about them. The trouble is, nobody can really know which vessels are manned by pirates until they attack another vessel. Then, simply shooting them becomes more complicated.

I've been out of the navy for a few years, but I have friends and relatives who have been on anti-piracy patrols in that region. There are thousands of square miles of ocean to cover and hundreds of small boats at sea at any given time. It's impossible to stop and search them all. Besides, as soon as a pirate spots a warship, they dump their arms overboard and by the time they've been boarded, they've become simple fishermen.

You can watch them dump their weapons, but you still can't just shoot at them - that makes you a pirate yourself! Of course, if there are no other vessels in the vicinity, a warship's captain can order them blasted out of the water. However, with hundreds of crewmembers on his ship, he knows that somebody is gonna spill the beans.

Perhaps merchant ships should all be required to carry the means of defending themselves. But, you know what happens then - some trigger-happy dough-head is bound to open up on an innocent fishing boat.

I'm afraid that "just shoot 'em all" is easier said than done.

As much as most people would like to take the high road on a problem like this, it's hard to not want to just make an example of them. We have video of the Maersk Alabama rescue- why not show that in Somalia, in HD, on every TV channel. Give them a "This is what happens when you....." message.

Not going after them directly is a lot like hugging a bully. It doesn't work. How they're reconciling their actions with Islam, I don't know but I'm pretty sure it doesn't follow the original intent of that religion. Killing Christians for handing out Bibles is just an extension of the old Holy Wars of old and we will never see religious peace. Anyone who thinks we will is deluded.

IIRC, we have satellites with optical/IR video capability that are stationary, over that area, right? Why not store video and watch backward from the time of the event and see where they came from? It would be a good start to determining which mother ships are behind this crap.

 

[GO-NAD!]

As much as most people would like to take the high road on a problem like this, it's hard to not want to just make an example of them. We have video of the Maersk Alabama rescue- why not show that in Somalia, in HD, on every TV channel. Give them a "This is what happens when you....." message.

Not going after them directly is a lot like hugging a bully. It doesn't work. How they're reconciling their actions with Islam, I don't know but I'm pretty sure it doesn't follow the original intent of that religion. Killing Christians for handing out Bibles is just an extension of the old Holy Wars of old and we will never see religious peace. Anyone who thinks we will is deluded.

IIRC, we have satellites with optical/IR video capability that are stationary, over that area, right? Why not store video and watch backward from the time of the event and see where they came from? It would be a good start to determining which mother ships are behind this crap.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not advocating a molly-coddling approach! Right now, we have no idea why they killed the hostages, so we can't assume that it was out of a religious motivation. The pirates wouldn't have targeted this yacht for that reason, because they would have no way of knowing what was onboard.

As I understand it, this "industry" is being taken out of the hands of small-timers and is now operated by large highly organized groups. Their motivation - money. Any claims of religious or territorial motivation are just so much self-serving bunk.

We can publicize the consequences of piracy in Somalia all we want - won't make a difference. The big kahunas will be safely ashore, while they send out their pee-ons in flip-flops to take all the risks. And, when these people are poverty stricken, they'll take chances that you and I wouldn't dream of taking.

There are no simple solutions to the problem. If there were, they'd already have been implemented. It'll take the establishment of a real government and the rule of law in Somalia before any real progress is made. I don't see that happening anytime soon.

 

[Davemcc]

How they're reconciling their actions with Islam, I don't know

They don't. This is about ransom not religion.

 

[majorloser]

What's wrong with sailing from Newport, RI to like Ft. Lauderdale, FL?
Water's water, right?

Though Fort Lauderdale ranks high on the list, Key West might be a little more toward your liking.

 

[majorloser]

Q-Ships

During WW2 they had ships disguised as lone merchant ship to would lure in German U-boats that would make a surface water attack. Torpedoes were too valuable to waste on an easy merchant target sailing all by itself. Once the submarine would surface to set up it's deck gun for attack, the ships would drop the disguise and open fire on the subs with numerous deck mounted guns.

This could easily be done today. Hide a MK45 5-inch gun on a the deck of a luxury yatch or small merchant ship. Add a couple M2 .50 cals on each side for close in support......

I'd be willing to bet you'd get a lot of volunteers for this duty.

http://feraljundi.com/2009/04/08/history-the-q-ship-and-how-they-could-be-used-to-battle-pirates/

 

[highfigh]

Don't get me wrong - I'm not advocating a molly-coddling approach! Right now, we have no idea why they killed the hostages, so we can't assume that it was out of a religious motivation. The pirates wouldn't have targeted this yacht for that reason, because they would have no way of knowing what was onboard.

As I understand it, this "industry" is being taken out of the hands of small-timers and is now operated by large highly organized groups. Their motivation - money. Any claims of religious or territorial motivation are just so much self-serving bunk.

We can publicize the consequences of piracy in Somalia all we want - won't make a difference. The big kahunas will be safely ashore, while they send out their pee-ons in flip-flops to take all the risks. And, when these people are poverty stricken, they'll take chances that you and I wouldn't dream of taking.

There are no simple solutions to the problem. If there were, they'd already have been implemented. It'll take the establishment of a real government and the rule of law in Somalia before any real progress is made. I don't see that happening anytime soon.

Why they boarded the yacht is unknown, other than the fact that they can always use another boat. Why they killed these four, I can almost guarantee is because they were Christian. Radical Muslims don't allow for the existence of any other belief. If these four were offered life in exchange for acceptance of Islam, I suspect they might decline if they were really devout Christians. They spent 6 years sailing around the world trying to offer their religion and in that part of the planet, it's not a safe proposition.

Your last paragraph is the reason AlQaeda and the Taliban are able to recruit so many. When people are truly desperate and have almost (or literally) nothing, they'll accept just about any offer of hope. Somalia is one of the places where this is happening and they haven't had a working government for over 20 years. I fail to see why the US is looked at as "Evil Incarnate" when this is happening in Somalia, The Sudan, Ethiopia, etc. Look at that's happening in Libya now- a military dictator is instructing his followers to fire on people who oppose his reign and WE'RE the bad guys?

 

[mtrycrafts]

...What's wrong with sailing from Newport, RI to like Ft. Lauderdale, FL?
Water's water, right?

Harder to peddle the bibles on that trek though

 

[Warpdrv]

I truly agree that all these so called PIRATES should be blasted out of the water or just KILLED and SUNKEN..... But who are these idiots that can't drive around the GHETTO..?

Perhaps they should have chosen a more effective and potent method of wielding a so called sword..... the printed word of god has nothing on a good 'ol fashioned Gattling Gun...

 

[highfigh]

They don't. This is about ransom not religion.

Really? What ransom did they get? I didn't even hear that they demanded ransom, but I may have missed it.

 

[highfigh]

I truly agree that all these so called PIRATES should be blasted out of the water or just KILLED and SUNKEN..... But who are these idiots that can't drive around the GHETTO..?

Perhaps they should have chosen a more effective and potent method of wielding a so called sword..... the printed word of god has nothing on a good 'ol fashioned Gattling Gun...

The fact that they sailed there makes me wonder how much they kept up on current events.

 

[Alex2507]

Really? What ransom did they get? I didn't even hear that they demanded ransom, but I may have missed it.

There have been other instances of kidnapping with the ransoms having sky rocketed over the last few years. I think 9.5 mil was the max paid out about a year ago.

 

[Shock]

Pretty sure if the USA nuked Somalia, no one would care.

 

[James NM]

Why all the pirate haters here?

These pirates are just poor people trying to make a living ... trying to overcome poverty and oppression caused by the Man. They come from a disadvantaged background. You should try to understand them and feel their pain.

I believe the haters here must fall into one (or more) of the following three categories:

1). Racist.
Since these pirates are all black, and you hate them, you must be a racist. You shouldn't hate someone because of the color of their skin.

2). Anti-Union.
Since all of these pirates belong to the IPPU (International Pillagers and Pirates Union) and you oppose them, you must be anti-union. Sure the IPPU increases the cost of doing business (ransom and murder), but isn't that a reasonable price to pay to support the union?

3). Evil Capitalist/Imperialist.
You are an oppressor of the people. You have caused all the evils known to man. It is because or You that these pirates even exist.


What is wrong with you people?

Remember, pirates are people too.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Why they boarded the yacht is unknown, other than the fact that they can always use another boat. Why they killed these four, I can almost guarantee is because they were Christian. Radical Muslims don't allow for the existence of any other belief. If these four were offered life in exchange for acceptance of Islam, I suspect they might decline if they were really devout Christians. They spent 6 years sailing around the world trying to offer their religion and in that part of the planet, it's not a safe proposition.

Your last paragraph is the reason AlQaeda and the Taliban are able to recruit so many. When people are truly desperate and have almost (or literally) nothing, they'll accept just about any offer of hope. Somalia is one of the places where this is happening and they haven't had a working government for over 20 years. I fail to see why the US is looked at as "Evil Incarnate" when this is happening in Somalia, The Sudan, Ethiopia, etc. Look at that's happening in Libya now- a military dictator is instructing his followers to fire on people who oppose his reign and WE'RE the bad guys?

You can amost guarantee it!? Wow, I had no idea your an insider in the pirate trade!

From what I've been reading, it's beoming more like organized crime, than anything else. As for what happened in this case, they had been negotiating with the surrounding US warships for hours, maybe days, when the killings occured. The pirates had even sent a couple of representatives to the USS Enterprise. So, I highly doubt that the killings had a religious motivation. More likely, the hostages attempted to escape, or there was an argument amongst the pirates. If there was a religious motivation, they would've killed them right away.

From what I also read, the countries they (hostages) were visiting weren't exactly hot beds of Islamic fundamentalism. They were just heading for the Suez canal, which is why they were anywhere near Somalia.

The US is looked at as "evil incarnate", because of propaganda. It's easier to blame somebody else for your problems than to accept responsibility yourself. That said, US support for authoritarian regimes that oppress their own people doesn't exactly help your image either. Just sayin'....

If there was a functional government in Somalia the piracy would quickly go away. That's because we would have somebody/something to point a finger at and attack, if they didn't stop the piracy. Right now, it's a game of whack-a-mole and there's nobody we can lean on to make it stop.