FunkyWaves; for uncompromising men, the coolest of women, and Canadians.

GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
Funkywaves has been around since 2002 but recently there's been some growing interest. I think that there's many great internet direct sub companies out there and this one is unique in that you're not stuck to the constraints of more mass-produced commercial subwoofers.

Are you perhaps paying a slight premium for nice veneers and careful attention to detail? I don't doubt it. It's not a mass produced "big black box" you're paying for. There is a certain markup whenever anything is custom. Let me be clear here - you're not getting ripped off. You wanna hear about getting ripped off? Last summer I bought my Exodus Maelstrom-X 18" driver and contemplated many options on what to do with it. DIY means having the right tools, it takes coordination, and it takes effort. And it means you're investing a lot of time. Quite frankly I wish I knew about Funky Waves last summer! Why? Because I don't really have the right tools, I could have better coordination, and my effort with respect to my hobbies can waver. And time is a big one. I did actually inquire with all sorts of local cabinet companies. I think I sent out about 25 emails last august to get some quotes. I thought to myself "It's just a box, someone'll do it". I made some blueprints. Out of those 25 companies, I got about three personal responses consisting of "sorry, not intersted, but good luck" and one phone call consisting of "$1800". And nothing's wrong with paying $1800 for the types of things I was asking for here (like 500L, heavy bracing, piano gloss finish). But at the same time this wasn't a speaker builder. Small things I was just unsure would be done right with respect to my end result. The goal wasn't a cabinet. It was a speaker enclosure.

With any subwoofer there's IMO a few things to always consider

- Driver selection. The driver at the end of the day is the thing moving and pushing air. If it's got notable distortion, that's air being moved that isn't in the original signal - and with subwoofers distortion is not only common but more audible (by the Fletcher-Munson curves, our easy are simply more sensitive to the upper octaves of a subwoofer's passband. If a 20hz wave is sent through a sub, our ear is naturally going to be more sensitive to the 40hz, 60hz and 80hz harmonics... so even if they're lower in level we may be more likely to hear them!).

-Cabinet design. Every driver works best in certain enclosures. Some prefer a small sealed box , some might even work in a horn the size of a bedroom. For the average person, the goal is high WAF and apparently that correlates to cubic foot boxes shoved in a corner. If you're an audioholic, you may be a bit more flexible. Honestly I like the idea of tuning your own passive radiator/port/horn/transmission line/sealed box/etc to get the response you desire.

-Cabinet construction. Things like bracing and finishing. It's a *****. :)

-Electronics details. Things like high pass filters, parametric EQs, linkwitz transforms, RMS amplification, Peak amplification, efficiency, and soft start.

On the commercial end, I'd say more companies will lean towards Small, two or three stock finishes, and usability by the lowest common denominator as well as the widest variety of people. It's a reality of mass production and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it.

With DIY you get freedom. Make it as big as you want, finish it how you want, and aim for 13hz @ 121db @ 1m :D. Throw in neutrik connectors if you want. Etc. But as some have said, "not everyone can or wants do DIY". Having the right balance of Time, Money, and Equipment is different for every single person out there.

Still, you can worry about what you want to worry about. Not what another person you can't relate with dictating the market wants to worry about. That's what Funky Waves offers. A wide variety of drivers without regard to mass production limitations. Outstanding finishes. Your choice of electronics should you so desire. The box characteristics as you so desire. All on someone else's time :cool:

So in a sense, I would go as far as to liken Funky Waves to a few well-known speaker companies like Totem, Sonus Faber, Salk and many more. No, these companies probably don't have a huge budget to spend on the design and development of brand spankin new diamond/beryllium/titanium drivers and advanced servo and patents etc (or maybe they do??). Instead they take advantage of the excellence of OEM brands like Vifa, Peerless, Seas, Scanspeak, Acoustic Elegance, Tang Band, and Dynaudio among countless others. In essense... any speaker is more than just a driver so there shouldn't be a need for everything to be made "in-house". Just like the best driver designers aren't necessasrily the best crossover designers, enclosure building is its own thing as well.

My Mal-X box is ugly right now. Yours doesn't have to be. And if you're Canadian you don't need to worry about some of the various issues I ran into when I was looking to buy commercial subs including

1) Voided warranties/Arranging your own freight Forwarding - Epik told me this
2) Expensive Canadian resellers - SVS had this
3) Duties on every single component of your speaker. You might still be paying the duty for drivers or electronics in Funky Wave's price but at least it won't be a big surprise.

So no, FW might not be "the best raw bang for your buck in the whole wide world." You are paying for attention to detail, customization, all that stuff. But it's still an exceptional value - nothing like a brick and mortar markup! If you've ever considered Salk Sound like I have then these guys should be on your list for what they offer. :)
 
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billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
Funkywaves has been around since 2002 but recently there's been some growing interest. I think that there's many great internet direct sub companies out there and this one is unique in that you're not stuck to the constraints of more mass-produced commercial subwoofers.

Are you perhaps paying a slight premium for nice veneers and careful attention to detail? I don't doubt it. It's not a mass produced "big black box" you're paying for. There is a certain markup whenever anything is custom. Let me be clear here - you're not getting ripped off. You wanna hear about getting ripped off? Last summer I bought my Exodus Maelstrom-X 18" driver and contemplated many options on what to do with it. DIY means having the right tools, it takes coordination, and it takes effort. And it means you're investing a lot of time. Quite frankly I wish I knew about Funky Waves last summer! Why? Because I don't really have the right tools, I could have better coordination, and my effort with respect to my hobbies can waver. And time is a big one. I did actually inquire with all sorts of local cabinet companies. I think I sent out about 25 emails last august to get some quotes. I thought to myself "It's just a box, someone'll do it". I made some blueprints. Out of those 25 companies, I got about three personal responses consisting of "sorry, not intersted, but good luck" and one phone call consisting of "$1800". And nothing's wrong with paying $1800 for the types of things I was asking for here (like 500L, heavy bracing, piano gloss finish). But at the same time this wasn't a speaker builder. Small things I was just unsure would be done right with respect to my end result. The goal wasn't a cabinet. It was a speaker enclosure.

With any subwoofer there's IMO a few things to always consider

- Driver selection. The driver at the end of the day is the thing moving and pushing air. If it's got notable distortion, that's air being moved that isn't in the original signal - and with subwoofers distortion is not only common but more audible (by the Fletcher-Munson curves, our easy are simply more sensitive to the upper octaves of a subwoofer's passband. If a 20hz wave is sent through a sub, our ear is naturally going to be more sensitive to the 40hz, 60hz and 80hz harmonics... so even if they're lower in level we may be more likely to hear them!).

-Cabinet design. Every driver works best in certain enclosures. Some prefer a small sealed box , some might even work in a horn the size of a bedroom. For the average person, the goal is high WAF and apparently that correlates to cubic foot boxes shoved in a corner. If you're an audioholic, you may be a bit more flexible. Honestly I like the idea of tuning your own passive radiator/port/horn/transmission line/sealed box/etc to get the response you desire.

-Cabinet construction. Things like bracing and finishing. It's a *****. :)

-Electronics details. Things like high pass filters, parametric EQs, linkwitz transforms, RMS amplification, Peak amplification, efficiency, and soft start.

On the commercial end, I'd say more companies will lean towards Small, two or three stock finishes, and usability by the lowest common denominator as well as the widest variety of people. It's a reality of mass production and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it.

With DIY you get freedom. Make it as big as you want, finish it how you want, and aim for 13hz @ 121db @ 1m :D. Throw in neutrik connectors if you want. Etc. But as some have said, "not everyone can or wants do DIY". Having the right balance of Time, Money, and Equipment is different for every single person out there.

Still, you can worry about what you want to worry about. Not what another person you can't relate with dictating the market wants to worry about. That's what Funky Waves offers. A wide variety of drivers without regard to mass production limitations. Outstanding finishes. Your choice of electronics should you so desire. The box characteristics as you so desire. All on someone else's time :cool:

So in a sense, I would go as far as to liken Funky Waves to a few well-known speaker companies like Totem, Sonus Faber, Salk and many more. No, these companies probably don't have a huge budget to spend on the design and development of brand spankin new diamond/beryllium/titanium drivers and advanced servo and patents etc (or maybe they do??). Instead they take advantage of the excellence of OEM brands like Vifa, Peerless, Seas, Scanspeak, Acoustic Elegance, Tang Band, and Dynaudio among countless others. In essense... any speaker is more than just a driver so there shouldn't be a need for everything to be made "in-house". Just like the best driver designers aren't necessasrily the best crossover designers, enclosure building is its own thing as well.

My Mal-X box is ugly right now. Yours doesn't have to be. And if you're Canadian you don't need to worry about some of the various issues I ran into when I was looking to buy commercial subs including

1) Voided warranties/Arranging your own freight Forwarding - Epik told me this
2) Expensive Canadian resellers - SVS had this
3) Duties on every single component of your speaker. You might still be paying the duty for drivers or electronics in Funky Wave's price but at least it won't be a big surprise.

So no, FW might not be "the best raw bang for your buck in the whole wide world." You are paying for attention to detail, customization, all that stuff. But it's still an exceptional value - nothing like a brick and mortar markup! If you've ever considered Salk Sound like I have then these guys should be on your list for what they offer. :)
Very well put....you made some many excellent points!

Thanks, Bill....:)
 
billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
Just a quick question here Nathan, because it came up in discussion:

What driver is being used in the FW12 enterd in the current sub shootout here on the forum? Looks like we have some confusion...don't know why...:eek:.

Thanks, Bill....:)
 
F

funky waves

Junior Audioholic
The Driver used in the subwoofer sent in for review is the LMS-R 12" driver from TC Sounds.
 
Warpdrv

Warpdrv

Audioholic Ninja
That right there should give an edge over the competition in SQ, as well as output....

Hows my work of art coming along there Mr Nathan... ?
 
T

templemaners

Senior Audioholic
Getting back to the Funky Waves part of the show... a couple questions I had:

  1. What is the performance implications for using two different drivers in one box, like on the 18.3?
  2. For the 12.x being tested, if it's ordered without an amplifier, does that mean you have to supply your own plate amp or a pro amp? (I'm guessing the latter)

TIA
 
Warpdrv

Warpdrv

Audioholic Ninja
The 18.3 is a not a dual driver sub... It is a powered driver with dual passive radiators... pretty much the same as a ported sub with no ports, the passive radiators are acting as the ports in this case, offering excellent headroom, with a very close SQ nature of sealed....

Funky Waves will be more then happy to build you a sub with or without drivers, as well as with or without an on board amp, allowing you to use your own amp if you so choose.



In fact, I have contracted them to build me just a box with no driver, no amp - which is the pinnacle of CUSTOM IMO.... They will custom build you anything you want....

You are welcome to check out my thread on this build here...
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1313021
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
[*]What is the performance implications for using two different drivers in one box, like on the 18.3?
Simply put, two drivers requires the internal box volume of two boxes to have the same Q factor (or damping). The advantage of the TC Sounds LMS drivers used by Funkywaves is that they're not only extremely linear, but require an unusually low internal volume displacement for good damping.

Generally with sealed subs if you can get your Q below .707 you'll have tight bass, around .6 and you'll have smooth bass, and around .45 or so to have extremely dry perfect bass for the critical classical music listener whose bass includes various secret instruments I don't know the names of :eek: But yeah, this is the sort of thing you can really discuss with FW. :D Now a Q about .707 will start to be more on the punchy and agressive side and when you get to a q near 1.0 you're straight up in car audio territory.

Now the 18.3 is not a dual driver sub. I'm sure FW could make a dual driver sub for you that can compete with Warpdrv's monsters but that particular sub is a single TC Sound 5100 Pro (extremely sensitive driver, moreso than the 5400 Ultra, but with less extreme low end as a tradeoff) paired with two passive radiators for a bass reflex alignment. Think of it as a ported box, without any chance of port noise, and with a 36db/octave rolloff below tuning instead of 24db/octave (rather irrelevant as you should always use an electronic high pass filter below tuning anyways). It is bass reflex so it's using stored energy in phase with but not at the same time as the driver.

For the 12.x being tested, if it's ordered without an amplifier, does that mean you have to supply your own plate amp or a pro amp? (I'm guessing the latter)
I think it would depend on how you roll :p

FW does offer own 2000w (4000w dynamic) plate amp if i recall correctly.
 
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F

funky waves

Junior Audioholic
Getting back to the Funky Waves part of the show... a couple questions I had:

  1. What is the performance implications for using two different drivers in one box, like on the 18.3?
  2. For the 12.x being tested, if it's ordered without an amplifier, does that mean you have to supply your own plate amp or a pro amp? (I'm guessing the latter)

TIA
The amp that comes with the FW12.X is a Pro amp, and it can be bought without. We also can offer several other amplifiers from Crown, QSC, and Face. The amp it comes with is the Behringer EP4000. Our 2kw plate amp is not compatable with the 12.X design, it must be used with an external amplifier.

Warp is correct on the other point(s).
 
T

TheGovernment

Enthusiast
From the looks of the funkywaves site, Nathan builds some very nice cabs!!!
That curved cab for the lms subs looks very nice!!
 
gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
Regardless of how the Funkywave review turns out, Nathan (owner of Funkywaves) has been and extremely patient and cool headed person to deal with. He was the first to submit his product and unfortunately the last to get tested.

For anyone considering purchasing a Funkywaves product, I thought it would be nice to know their owner seems to be quite a level headed and easy person to deal with.
 
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GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
getting back to that, i noticed the lms-R 12" is only 83 db efficient. Nathan, do you prefer it over the Acoustic Elegance driver Billy has in his Funky waves sub? I know AE subs are rather well regarded themselves although i've never looked at them as carefully as I should.
 
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billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
getting back to that, i noticed the lms-R 12" is only 83 db efficient. Nathan, do you prefer it over the Acoustic Elegance driver Billy has in his Funky waves sub? I know AE subs are rather well regarded themselves although i've never looked at them as carefully as I should.
it was better suited for my needs or design goals....from what Nathan told me the two are farily close with the LMS having a little more ability down low but the AE was slightly more efficient and required less amp/power.

Fwiw..here are the spec's from TC sounds> http://www.parts-express.com/pdf/293-658m.pdf
 
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Matt34

Matt34

Moderator
From the looks of the funkywaves site, Nathan builds some very nice cabs!!!
That curved cab for the lms subs looks very nice!!
Yeah he does, "the government" needs to give me a pay raise so I can buy a LMS-18 model.:p
 
Warpdrv

Warpdrv

Audioholic Ninja
Thought I'd share some pics from Funky Waves of the 18.0 cabinet I'm having them build for me...
I chose just the empty box, as I have my own 18" LMS driver and an external pro amp (Crest 8002) I will use for this sub. EQ will be done with the SMS-1.
Wood Veneer is Padauk as pictured on their site, no stain just clear coat.




Here is the finished veneer and I opted for the 3/4" roundover on the whole top and bottom. Just needs to be routered, and cleared.
 
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billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
Damn, that is a thing of beauty...the 3/4" round over all around the edges is just gravy.:)
 
billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
Here is a link which compares the LMS-R vs the DTS-10 using the same enclosuer... http://www.data-bass.com/data?category=review&id=1

You'll also see 3rd party measuring of various other drivers...and I recognize 2 of those subs and know Funkywaves had a hand in building them...fwiw.

Good stuff...BTW, Bill...:)
 
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Warpdrv

Warpdrv

Audioholic Ninja
Billy, just an FYI - this was not a comparison of different driver alignments here

This was the original DTS-10 driver horn enclosure and then a substitute driver (12" LMS-R), which happened to be an experiment that Ricci tried out in the same DTS horn loaded enclosure....


Not a sealed or ported LMS-R compared to the DTS-10....

One cannot ascertain objective reviews in this comparison, other then how the horn enclosure reacts with the different drivers used in the same alignment.

IMO - There is not a whole heck of alot of difference with either driver - both are victim of the horn enclosure, which in all observations shows that distortion is monumental over a standard sealed, ported or LLT scenario.... check out the distortion comparison between them all....
 
Unobtainium

Unobtainium

Audioholic Intern
Looking forward to the review.
Nice box Warp, love that shape.
 
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