TV Shopping - Pulling my hair out

Moutee

Moutee

Junior Audioholic
Good afternoon AV aficionados,

I've posted this same thing at Home Theater Shack, so I apologize if this is the second time you see it:

I'm helping my parents shop for a new 55"-58" television, but their patience is low, and they want a new set within the next week or so. Their budget is $1900 and below. We're stuck on plasma sets; the picture quality seems impossible to beat, and we love the inky blacks compared to LCD and RP sets. Our only concerns are the issues with respect to rising blacks, floating blacks, etc. If we're going to be stuck with this set for the next 4+ years, we would like them to be trouble free.

Also, are the next-gen Panasonic Plasmas worth waiting for? If so, does anyone know when they're expected to arrive in stores?

Thank you everyone, and I look forward to your responses and recommendations. :)
I've done a fair amount of research over the last few weeks, but I still haven't been able to find a straight answer. I appreciate any help that I receive, so don't be shy to share your feedback.

Thanks again!
 
B

Ban-One

Enthusiast
I have heard that it is not too much of an issue. Have you also looked at led?
 
STRONGBADF1

STRONGBADF1

Audioholic Spartan
Good afternoon AV aficionados,

I've posted this same thing at Home Theater Shack, so I apologize if this is the second time you see it:



I've done a fair amount of research over the last few weeks, but I still haven't been able to find a straight answer. I appreciate any help that I receive, so don't be shy to share your feedback.

Thanks again!
I did the waiting game to see what the next generation of TV's would bring...twice. Don't beat yourself up. I would go out and look at the Panasonic 54" G25 and see if it will fit the bill also look at the Samsung C550. I bought the 58" C550 and like the picture very much and I haven't run the calibration disc yet...Great TV for $1300 on sale.

Once you get it home and live with it then calibrate it with a disc you won't know what you're missing...if anything.

If you/or they are picky buy the TV from a store with a liberal return policy (like Best Buy)

My Samsung hums a little more than my 42" Panny S1 but you can not hear it over low volumes.


sorry about the rambling post...I need to get going...The wife is waiting!:eek::)
 
Nomo

Nomo

Audioholic Samurai
From what I've read as far as the rising black level goes on the Panasonics; even after the rising black has happened they still will have slightly better level that the Samsungs.

I was in the same boat, I tetered between a few 58" Samsungs and the Panny TC-P54G25. Finally went with the Panny. It's not here yet.
I'm going from a 57" rear projection to the new plasma. So going smaller was a tough choice. If size is the issue; go Samsung. If it's PQ; Panasonic.
Either way, the're both great choices.
 
J

jostenmeat

Audioholic Spartan
I'm helping my parents shop for a new 55"-58" television, but their patience is low, and they want a new set within the next week or so. Their budget is $1900 and below. We're stuck on plasma sets; the picture quality seems impossible to beat, and we love the inky blacks compared to LCD and RP sets. Our only concerns are the issues with respect to rising blacks, floating blacks, etc. If we're going to be stuck with this set for the next 4+ years, we would like them to be trouble free.

Also, are the next-gen Panasonic Plasmas worth waiting for? If so, does anyone know when they're expected to arrive in stores?

Thank you everyone, and I look forward to your responses and recommendations.
If you bust the budget just by a bit, couple hundred at the most, you can get the best TV currently made in the world, in the VT25 as a 54". A 58", OTOH, would be over the budget by a third.

I can nearly guarantee you with nearly any other AV component, if you said you bought the best in the world as currently made, it will blow your budget by a whole lot more than $200. And in the HT experience, nothing is more important than the choice of display.

As for waiting for next year's, sure, every generation beats the one before it. You'll have to jump on at some point.

I do think the VT25's ability to recreate 24p without 3:2 pulldown is worth something by itself. No other Pana plasmas can do that, AFAIK. However, I pretty much only watch movies, and not really any TV or video gaming, so it would be something more desirable to me than to others, perhaps.

I vote to break budget by 10% for a VT25, if your viewing distance is not too great, and/or that bluray playback quality is the #1 priority. I might change that vote eventually, but tally that for now!
 
Moutee

Moutee

Junior Audioholic
I have heard that it is not too much of an issue. Have you also looked at led?
Have not looked at LED yet since they are LED back lit LCDs. Many models are out of the budget. I would rather buy a plasma for the same price, but thank you for the suggestion.

I did the waiting game to see what the next generation of TV's would bring...twice. Don't beat yourself up. I would go out and look at the Panasonic 54" G25 and see if it will fit the bill also look at the Samsung C550. I bought the 58" C550 and like the picture very much and I haven't run the calibration disc yet...Great TV for $1300 on sale.
I'll keep an eye out for both. Value is definitely a factor.

If you bust the budget just by a bit, couple hundred at the most, you can get the best TV currently made in the world, in the VT25 as a 54". A 58", OTOH, would be over the budget by a third.

I can nearly guarantee you with nearly any other AV component, if you said you bought the best in the world as currently made, it will blow your budget by a whole lot more than $200. And in the HT experience, nothing is more important than the choice of display.

I do think the VT25's ability to recreate 24p without 3:2 pulldown is worth something by itself. No other Pana plasmas can do that, AFAIK. However, I pretty much only watch movies, and not really any TV or video gaming, so it would be something more desirable to me than to others, perhaps.

I vote to break budget by 10% for a VT25, if your viewing distance is not too great, and/or that bluray playback quality is the #1 priority. I might change that vote eventually, but tally that for now!
How does the VT25 compare to the C8000 series from Samsung?

From what I've read as far as the rising black level goes on the Panasonics; even after the rising black has happened they still will have slightly better level that the Samsungs.

I was in the same boat, I teetered between a few 58" Samsungs and the Panny TC-P54G25. Finally went with the Panny. It's not here yet.
I'm going from a 57" rear projection to the new plasma. So going smaller was a tough choice. If size is the issue; go Samsung. If it's PQ; Panasonic.
Either way, the're both great choices.
We're also coming from a 57" (Toshiba) RP. Anything is an improvement at this point.

Thank you all for your quick responses; please keep 'em coming! I hope that this thread will help others in the same situation.
 
HexOmega

HexOmega

Audioholic
I vote to break budget by 10% for a VT25, if your viewing distance is not too great, and/or that bluray playback quality is the #1 priority. I might change that vote eventually, but tally that for now!
I absolutely agree 100%, and if your parents don't want to spend quite as much, you won't go wrong with any of the other Panasonic plasmas from the G20/G25 series on up.

The S2 (one step below G20/G25) series is available in larger sizes for very reasonable money, but my observation on that series is that the third pane of glass used for the anti-glare coating causes issues with internal reflections. From the G20/G25 series and up there are two panes of glass, with the outer pane having a very effective anti-glare coating.

I would expect the next generation of Panasonic plasmas to be evolutionary in every series save for perhaps the flagship TVs, and even still the PQ will be very comparable.
 
F

FirstReflection

AV Rant Co-Host
You won't be seeing the new 2011 Panasonic Plasmas (GT30, VT30 series, etc.) in stores until the summer, so if your parents want the new TV soon, waiting for the new series isn't in the cards.

I have to agree that the VT25 series is the way to go if you can manage the extra cost. They are, quite simply, the best televisions available right now...period.

CNET did extensive testing on the VT25 series to see if the black levels would rise the way the 2009 models did. They concluded that the black level DOES rise, but only a very, very small amount. So little, in fact, that even after the rise, it is STILL the deepest black level available - even compared to other plasma brands when they are brand new or even compared to Panasonic's other plasma series when they are brand new! So the rising black level issue isn't fiction, but with the VT25 series, it is not something that should deter you from chosing that model line.

I have to comment about two other things though:

1) Screen size is a big deal, IMO. I personally prefer to stick closely to the SMPTE recommendations for viewing distance. The SMPTE recommends a field of view of 30 degrees (ie. 15 degrees to either side of dead center when sitting in the primary seat). To calculate the screen size needed: measure your distance from eyes (when seated in the primary seat) to screen in inches. Multiply that distance by 0.615. That will give you the diagonal screen size that you need in order to create a 30 degree field of view.

For the 54" screen size that is being suggested, you simply divide that screen size by 0.615 to get the SMPTE recommended viewing distance. That works out to 87.8 inches or about 7 feet, 4 inches. That's probably a lot closer than where your parents are sitting. Most people sit considerably further away than what SMPTE would recommend.

2) The Panasonic plasmas do quite well in terms of reducing glare or reflections, but they do NOT do so well in terms of retaining deep black levels and high contrast in anything above "dim" room lighting. "Dim" refers to JUST enough light to read by. Any more light than that, and the Panny plasmas start to look a little washed out and the black level starts to look a little grey. If your parents have sunlight coming in or fairly bright room lighting, do not expect the Panny plasma to look anywhere near its best!

Samsung's plasmas do not have as deep black levels or as high contrast as the Panny plasmas when measured under pitch black conditions. But under normal-to-bright room lighting, they actually retain their black levels and contrast a little bit better. You can also often get a larger Samsung screen size for the same price or lower than the VT25 series Panasonics.

That said, the Samsung plasmas have their own problems, which I actually find to be a lot more troubling. First, the Samsung plasmas buzz - loudly. Some people are really not bothered by the audible buzz, but I certainly am!

Second, after a relatively short time, the Samsung plasmas start to show noticeable phosphor lag. It isn't always so obvious, but if you go from a scene where there is a bright object to a sudden transition where the screen is mostly black, you will see an "after image" of the bright object remain on screen for just a moment. LG's plasmas are even worse in this regard - to the point that I wouldn't even consider recommending them for use.

Overall, I would definitely take a VT25 Panasonic plasma over any other television out there right now. The VT30 series will likely be a little bit better, but not a crazy huge amount and they won't be out until summer. I would be mindful of the screen size and the room lighting. But if your parents can nudge the seating a little bit closer and control the room's lighting a little bit, the VT25 Panasonic plasma is easily the top choice!

Also, the VT25 series is an EXCELLENT candidate for ISF or THX professional calibration. There are options in the service menu and calibration menu (which is only accessible with the use of professional calibration software) that allow for nearly perfect calibration. Most people will be perfectly happy with the pre-set THX mode or with a few minor adjustments in the user menu. But if you really want to dial in the display to almost perfect industry standards, the VT25 series allows for that, which is something that cannot be said for every TV out there ;)
 
C

cutter

Audioholic
I just had similar advice from the experts on this forum, and it paid off- I purchased a Panny 50" VT25 for my bedroom, and un-calibrated out of box performance is....awesome. I can't wait to have it calibrated!

The 54" could be had for around $1800...

good luck!
 
Moutee

Moutee

Junior Audioholic
I just had similar advice from the experts on this forum, and it paid off- I purchased a Panny 50" VT25 for my bedroom, and un-calibrated out of box performance is....awesome. I can't wait to have it calibrated!

The 54" could be had for around $1800...

good luck!
The lowest I've seen the P54VT25 is $1,929. Where did you find it for a lower price?
 
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