Never buy receivers from eCost

[Warpdrv]

Buy.com also offers the same UPS return label...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Buy.com also offers the same UPS return label...

Yeah, I believe Buy.com & Amazon.com are the same GREAT company.

 

[mtrycrafts]

...
So your question for Denon support is "Why the heck does Denon keep them as an Authorized Dealer/Outlet?"...

Another question would be is who is doing the refurb on them. If Denon, why such a poor job.

 

[KEW]

How are the refurbished Denon items from eCost being packaged?
What type of foam?
Is he foam split anywhere or like new?
How thick is the foam (between the receiver and the cardboard)

If I had to guess, I would bet Denon is using packaging designed for bulk shipment (palletized for forklifts - as is normal for shipment to stores) to ship to eCost, and eCost is shipping them out in the same packaging (which is not designed for individual handling by UPS or FedEx).

I'm not sure who is to blame if this is the case, I can say the packaging of Marantz from A4L uses sturdy, durable foam in over-sized boxes (not what I would expect a receiver to be packed in if I bought it from Best Buy).

 

[dkane360]

How are the refurbished Denon items from eCost being packaged?
What type of foam?
Is he foam split anywhere or like new?
How thick is the foam (between the receiver and the cardboard)

If I had to guess, I would bet Denon is using packaging designed for bulk shipment (palletized for forklifts - as is normal for shipment to stores) to ship to eCost, and eCost is shipping them out in the same packaging (which is not designed for individual handling by UPS or FedEx).

I'm not sure who is to blame if this is the case, I can say the packaging of Marantz from A4L uses sturdy, durable foam in over-sized boxes (not what I would expect a receiver to be packed in if I bought it from Best Buy).

When I got my avr 1910, it was well packed. the foam packaging was similar to the packaging microsoft uses for sending your 360 back for repair. it was a little thicker than that, but same type.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

How are the refurbished Denon items from eCost being packaged?

The packing seems awesome - even double-boxed with thick, new-looking foams.

The AVR is wrapped with heavy clear plastic; it looks exactly the way the Denon Factory Refurb did on my AVR-5308.

 

[KEW]

Oh well...scratch that theory.

 

[JAC]

Quite often manufacturers receive back some items that have intermittent problems or problems they cannot reproduce easily.

Ocassionally the actual problem is user error and nothing is wrong with the unit. They DON'T spend undo time trying to locate said problem.

Instead these units are recycled via "refurb" channels and reach a second set of consumers.

Often the second consumers will not use the same feature set, or for some reason not have the same problem.

Equally as often, they will have the same problem and the unit goes back in for more BENCH time.

And so it goes, until either the problem is fixed, or it reaches a consumer who doesn't uncover it, or doesn't complain if they do.

 

[sholling]

Quite often manufacturers receive back some items that have intermittent problems or problems they cannot reproduce easily.

Ocassionally the actual problem is user error and nothing is wrong with the unit. They DON'T spend undo time trying to locate said problem.

That doesn't speak well of the manufacturer and is little more than a cheap way destroy a company's reputation for reliability and business ethics. Look what a "reshrinkwrap and put it back on the shelf" policy did for the reputation of a certain well known retailer.

Anything coming out of a refurb depot needs to be checked 7 ways from Sunday.

 

[M Code]

That doesn't speak well of the manufacturer and is little more than a cheap way destroy a company's reputation for reliability and business ethics. Look what a "reshrinkwrap and put it back on the shelf" policy did for the reputation of a certain well known retailer.

Anything coming out of a refurb depot needs to be checked 7 ways from Sunday.

All brands receive back open inventory and they can't be sold as new..
Even if never connected...
Next the brands have a refurbishing line, either their own or down by hired subcontractor. The returned units are checked out by a qwikee functional operation, any missing accessories are inserted (EQ mikes, AC power cords, remote controls, antennnas, operation guides) and repacked into a new blank carton.

Next each brand has different channels to move out the B stock, E-Bay, E-Cost... In the earlier days they often went to Mexico..

Getting a good deal is a crap shoot..
Many returned units have never been powered on, or the user didn't like something or his credit card was overdrawn..

Just my $0.02...

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

And so it goes, until either the problem is fixed, or it reaches a consumer who doesn't uncover it, or doesn't complain if they do.

Yeah, so many people don't even use HDMI or some other features, and so they will not discover the problem until it is too late.

Or one or two of the HDMI inputs may be defective, but the person only uses one working input and may not discover the problem.

Just like I don't use Optical or Coaxial digital inputs, so even if they are defective, I will not know until I actually use them.

 

[nadroj]

Guess I got lucky (Just noticed this thread). I submitted an order for a Denon AVR1910 last night but I received an email today stating that they were having problems processing my order and to call within two days or it would be canceled. Is the concensus view to not order from these guys now? If so, what would you recommend for a budget receiver ($300ish)

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Guess I got lucky (Just noticed this thread). I submitted an order for a Denon AVR1910 last night but I received an email today stating that they were having problems processing my order and to call within two days or it would be canceled. Is the concensus view to not order from these guys now? If so, what would you recommend for a budget receiver ($300ish)

I will never order ANYTHING from eCost again, especially AVRs, Pre-Pros, & Amps.

NEVER!!!

Dakmart is even worse according to Denon support!

Don't play that Dirty Harry game because you might not be LUCKY.

When it comes to AVRs and pre-pros, I suggest buying brand new and from either a local store or a place you can return easily like Amazon.

And test every single HDMI inputs and functions that you can think of within the 30-day return policy!

 

[sholling]

Guess I got lucky (Just noticed this thread). I submitted an order for a Denon AVR1910 last night but I received an email today stating that they were having problems processing my order and to call within two days or it would be canceled. Is the concensus view to not order from these guys now? If so, what would you recommend for a budget receiver ($300ish)

The refurb problem seems to be limited to Denons. If you're in the US give Accessories For Less a look. I bought refurbished Onkyos from them twice and they've been 100%.

 

[lsiberian]

I will never order ANYTHING from eCost again, especially AVRs, Pre-Pros, & Amps.

NEVER!!!

Dakmart is even worse according to Denon support!

Don't play that Dirty Harry game because you might not be LUCKY.

When it comes to AVRs and pre-pros, I suggest buying brand new and from either a local store or a place you can return easily like Amazon.

And test every single HDMI inputs and functions that you can think of within the 30-day return policy!

I had heard E-Cost got their act together. I got my remote from them, but the next receiver I get will probably be from accessories4less or the HK store(cheap)

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I had heard E-Cost got their act together. I got my remote from them, but the next receiver I get will probably be from accessories4less or the HK store(cheap)

I hope the repair centers are close to where you live.

I am scared of refurbs now.

But stay the heck away from Denon refurbs and stay the heck away from eCost and Dakmart.

 

[nadroj]

Would the risk of getting screwed be eliminated if I purchased an extended warranty from squaretrade? I can get a 2 year warranty on the 1910 for $35 but I have not had any direct experience with them(have only heard good things though.) This would put the total cost of the AVR1910 at close to $300.

Other options in this price range would be the Pioneer 1020 for ~350 or a refurbished Onkyo 707 for around the same price. I basically just want whatever will have the best sound without any huge drawbacks (conversion issues, annoying mechanical sounds, etc) This will also be my first sound system so I would prefer something that is not overly complicated to set up. One of my biggest reasons for choosing the Denon was because I found a really good guide that walks me through setting it up (batpig's guide)

Which would you guys pick if you were in my situation. I am definitely up to saving money so if there is something cheaper or a better value in this range please let me know. My set up will be: P362 mains, PC350 center, 2030P surrounds, and LFM-1 Plus sub.

 

[nadroj]

So would the SR707 be the way to go? Onkyo is having a sell and I can pick one up for $303. I was reading through the thread on AVSforums and a lot of people complain about loud clicking noises when watching TV (due to the audio mode switching during commercials or when changing channels.) Is this common for all receivers or unique to this particular design? Are there any other major disadvantages or known issues with this receiver?