Do you prefer your speakers accurate/flat or "colored"?

[JerryLove]

If it makes you happy to listen to in the long haul, and you could not have been made as happy for less money, then it was a good buy.

*Predicting* what will accomplish that is the hard part; especially for people new to the hobby.

 

[Davemcc]

Out of curiosity: what do you consider the "British Sound"?

Not entirely sure how or if it's a defined term but I tend to like how certain speakers sound from companies like Era, Epos, Castle, Triangle and other uncommon brands. It's not something I have the education or vocabulary to describe but it's not something I hear from brands like Paradigm, Infinity, Klipsch or other popular American brands.

Having said that, I sure wouldn't turn down a set of high end B&W, Focal or Dynaudio.

 

[MidnightSensi2]

Flat. Colorations can always be EQ'd. It's easier to start from zero.

10db hot dates back from the mythical Dolby Pro Logic days.

Nod. Now days you don't have to run hot for dynamics,movies are generally mixed pretty hot to begin with. Additionally, running subwoofers too high above the mains creates a lack of 'punch' which comes from the midrange - ironically the reason most people crave more bass is not their subwoofers but rather the lower midrange performance of their mains.

 

[TLS Guy]

Flat. Colorations can always be EQ'd. It's easier to start from zero.



Nod. Now days you don't have to run hot for dynamics,movies are generally mixed pretty hot to begin with. Additionally, running subwoofers too high above the mains creates a lack of 'punch' which comes from the midrange - ironically the reason most people crave more bass is not their subwoofers but rather the lower midrange performance of their mains.

You are correct, people run subs hot to cover for inadequate or no step loss diffraction compensation.

 

[Davemcc]

You are correct, people run subs hot to cover for inadequate or no step loss diffraction compensation.

Once more...in english?

 

[GranteedEV]

Once more...in english?

when you put a driver in a speaker cabinet, there comes a point where bass starts to go not only forward, but backwards. If that driver were in a wall, the backwards wave would simply be reflected forward leading to an even bass response between the forward waves and the multidirectional waves.

In a speaker cabinet, as soon as the baffle of the speaker isn't a "wall", you get a loss of lower bass. You're supposed to compensate for that by "toning down" higher frequencies above where the wave goes behind the speaker in order to equalize everything. If you don't, you get speakers that sound anemic in bass response relative to everything else, and because of that, TLS guy thinks people run their subs hot.

Which i disagree with to an extent... people just like overemphasized bass.

 

[gmichael]

I thought the reason people run their subs hot was because they loved bass. Big honkin' explosions that rattle the windows and vibrate their bowels.

 

[dkane360]

I thought the reason people run their subs hot was because they loved bass. Big honkin' explosions that rattle the windows and vibrate their bowels.

Thats why I love bass

 

[TLS Guy]

I thought the reason people run their subs hot was because they loved bass. Big honkin' explosions that rattle the windows and vibrate their bowels.

You don't have to run a sub hot to vibrate your bowels. In fact the bass is much more effective if you don't.

My system is very flat in room but still shakes the floor and threatens to blow out the windows, yet the bass does not put goo all over everything.

On my periodic visits to dealers, I note the bass is never right, in fact usually down right awful.

 

[TLS Guy]

when you put a driver in a speaker cabinet, there comes a point where bass starts to go not only forward, but backwards. If that driver were in a wall, the backwards wave would simply be reflected forward leading to an even bass response between the forward waves and the multidirectional waves.

In a speaker cabinet, as soon as the baffle of the speaker isn't a "wall", you get a loss of lower bass. You're supposed to compensate for that by "toning down" higher frequencies above where the wave goes behind the speaker in order to equalize everything. If you don't, you get speakers that sound anemic in bass response relative to everything else, and because of that, TLS guy thinks people run their subs hot.

Which i disagree with to an extent... people just like overemphasized bass.

Perfect explanation. However when a speaker is weak especially in the 80 to 200 Hz range, listening studies have shown people perceive the speaker as lacking bass. So the inexperienced boost the sub.

Properly step loss compensating with a passive crossover always involves dropping the impedance usually below 600 Hz. In the cost conscious speaker arena manufacturers are reluctant to this because of running receivers out of gas and worse. It also stresses cheaper speaker drive units. The result many are not properly step loss compensated.

 

[jp_over]

system specs

If we start with a flat speaker (and a smooth roll-off past flat) we can adjust to taste with an EQ. The same is not true for one with spikes and dips.

Jerry,

I think the sytem you're running is very close to what I'm researching. Can you post what B&W speakers you have (801N or 802) and what amp? Also, if you're bi-amping or not.

I believe this is somewhat in line with the thread since you prefer a flat response & the B&W 800 series is noted by those "in the know" as fairly flat.

Thanks!

 

[gmichael]

You don't have to run a sub hot to vibrate your bowels. In fact the bass is much more effective if you don't.

My system is very flat in room but still shakes the floor and threatens to blow out the windows, yet the bass does not put goo all over everything.

On my periodic visits to dealers, I note the bass is never right, in fact usually down right awful.

That doesn't stop anyone from liking it turned up.

 

[JerryLove]

Jerry,

I think the sytem you're running is very close to what I'm researching. Can you post what B&W speakers you have (801N or 802) and what amp? Also, if you're bi-amping or not.

In B&W I have both a pair of 801 series 2's, which I power off a single Yamaha P5000S, and a pair of Nautilus 801's which I am still attempting to squire enough amp for (mid and tweet run well off the afore-mentioned Yammy).

I have done nearfield measurements on the series 2 and above 1khz they are extremely flat. Below that I have trouble exluding the room I tested in. I am thinking about putting an active crossover on.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

...the B&W 800 series is noted by those "in the know" as fairly flat.

According to the Stereophile measurement, the B&W 802D measures flat on-axis, but has a rather terrible off-axis frequency response.

 

[GranteedEV]

According to the Stereophile measurement, the B&W 802D measures flat on-axis, but has a rather terrible off-axis frequency response.

Then why is it more popular than the revel salon

 

[tom67]

In B&W I have both a pair of 801 series 2's, which I power off a single Yamaha P5000S, and a pair of Nautilus 801's which I am still attempting to squire enough amp for (mid and tweet run well off the afore-mentioned Yammy).

I have done nearfield measurements on the series 2 and above 1khz they are extremely flat. Below that I have trouble exluding the room I tested in. I am thinking about putting an active crossover on.

My brother owned a set of Nautilus 801s.....among the most detailed speakers ever made and yes, you actually have to think about amplification with those unlike most others.....worth owning just to look at....

 

[jp_over]

In B&W I have both a pair of 801 series 2's, which I power off a single Yamaha P5000S, and a pair of Nautilus 801's which I am still attempting to squire enough amp for (mid and tweet run well off the afore-mentioned Yammy).

I have done nearfield measurements on the series 2 and above 1khz they are extremely flat. Below that I have trouble exluding the room I tested in. I am thinking about putting an active crossover on.

Ah the venerable P5000S - a remnant of him whose name we don't see mentioned much here anymore (Chris). I planned on getting one of those for a while but I just don't listen at that high a volume level. I figure an Emotiva XPA 2 or even XPA 3 would do the trick and I plan on using the stock crossover. My main goal is uber clear dialogue for movies & medium level critical listening.

Do you find off axis listening to be problematic?

Any reason you chose the 801 vs 802? What do you mean by "exluding"?

Thanks again!

 

[KEW]

What do you mean by "exluding"?

I think that would be "excluding", as in isolating what to attribute to the room effects vs. the speakers.

 

[jp_over]

I think that would be "excluding", as in isolating what to attribute to the room effects vs. the speakers.

Got it - I'm still learning the terminology so I wasn't sure if it was a typo or a new one I hadn't heard yet. I googled it with no luck of course.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Then why is it more popular than the revel salon

Why is BOSE more popular than B&W?

Do you have the sales numbers for the B&W 800Ds vs. the Revel Salon2?