How can I track down grounding problems with my AVR?

[FuzzyReets]

Hi folks. The other night I was watching a blu ray and thought I heard a very faint high pitch noise in the background but ignored it until I got to the credits and then clearly noticed it. It's a high pitch noise that seems to change pitches every couple seconds. The movie I was watching had a very low level to the soundtrack so I have my AVR boosted a lot which is why I think this is the first time I heard it. Now I notice it more of course. I tried a different blu ray player, different HDMI cables, and plugged the AVR into a different power source but still have it. Is there a way to track this down? Any help/info/links would be appreciated. Thank you!

 

[TLS Guy]

Hi folks. The other night I was watching a blu ray and thought I heard a very faint high pitch noise in the background but ignored it until I got to the credits and then clearly noticed it. It's a high pitch noise that seems to change pitches every couple seconds. The movie I was watching had a very low level to the soundtrack so I have my AVR boosted a lot which is why I think this is the first time I heard it. Now I notice it more of course. I tried a different blu ray player, different HDMI cables, and plugged the AVR into a different power source but still have it. Is there a way to track this down? Any help/info/links would be appreciated. Thank you!

If it is high pitched, I doubt it is a grounding problem. Are you sure it is coming from the speakers? Does it increase as you advance volume with no program?

I would bet the sound is being emitted from your TV and not the speakers. A lot of TVs emit high frequency sounds. It is a common issue. There is nothing you can do to stop it. It means service or replacement of the TV. Some models and brands just do it and there is no solution other than ditching it.

 

[FuzzyReets]

If it is high pitched, I doubt it is a grounding problem. Are you sure it is coming from the speakers? Does it increase as you advance volume with no program?

I would bet the sound is being emitted from your TV and not the speakers. A lot of TVs emit high frequency sounds. It is a common issue. There is nothing you can do to stop it. It means service or replacement of the TV. Some models and brands just do it and there is no solution other than ditching it.

Not the TV. I have unplugged everything and powered everything off except the blu ray player and the AVR and used headphones and I still have the issue. Not sure what that means at this point. Kind of annoyed.

 

[TLS Guy]

Not the TV. I have unplugged everything and powered everything off except the blu ray player and the AVR and used headphones and I still have the issue. Not sure what that means at this point. Kind of annoyed.

In that case some circuit has become unstable and generating a high frequency oscillation.

Since you can hear it on headphones, it makes analysis easier. Unplug all inputs from your receiver. See if you hear the high pitched sound. If you do it is the receiver. Then add your peripherals one at a time. When it appears the unit you last connected is the culprit.

If it is the receiver try a reset. If it persists after that, then your receiver needs service.

High frequency oscillation faults are serious, as they cause other problems down the line, especially blowing tweeters.

 

[FuzzyReets]

In that case some circuit has become unstable and generating a high frequency oscillation.

Since you can hear it on headphones, it makes analysis easier. Unplug all inputs from your receiver. See if you hear the high pitched sound. If you do it is the receiver. Then add your peripherals one at a time. When it appears the unit you last connected is the culprit.

If it is the receiver try a reset. If it persists after that, then your receiver needs service.

High frequency oscillation faults are serious, as they cause other problems down the line, especially blowing tweeters.

Pretty sure it is the receiver at this point. I've noticed as soon as I put the receiver into "Pure Audio" mode which cuts all the circuitry, it goes away. Gotta be the receiver. Now, is that a problem or just the way it is made?

 

[FuzzyReets]

Verdict. Receiver.

When I have the player do the audio processing I do not have this high pitch sound. When I bitstream the audio to the receiver and let the receiver process the audio, I have the high pitch noise. Something wrong with the receiver I guess. What to do?

 

[TLS Guy]

Verdict. Receiver.

When I have the player do the audio processing I do not have this high pitch sound. When I bitstream the audio to the receiver and let the receiver process the audio, I have the high pitch noise. Something wrong with the receiver I guess. What to do?

Have you tried a total reset? If not do that first.

It sounds as if the video circuits are somehow feeding into the audio circuits, by leakage, RF transmission or induction.

The receiver should not be that way, and you will end up burning out a tweeter or two.

Others who have that Onkyp HT RC 180 may post on whether they have this issue. As you probably know, I'm not a fan of receivers and have never used them.

If a reset does not solve it, then the receiver needs fixing under warranty or otherwise. I see that receiver has the loss less codecs, and is rated as mid level, so it is likely worth fixing if out of warranty. I have no idea of the cost, but suspect it will require replacement of the video board at least if a reset does not solve it.

 

[FuzzyReets]

Have you tried a total reset? If not do that first.

It sounds as if the video circuits are somehow feeding into the audio circuits, by leakage, RF transmission or induction.

The receiver should not be that way, and you will end up burning out a tweeter or two.

Others who have that Onkyp HT RC 180 may post on whether they have this issue. As you probably know, I'm not a fan of receivers and have never used them.

If a reset does not solve it, then the receiver needs fixing under warranty or otherwise. I see that receiver has the loss less codecs, and is rated as mid level, so it is likely worth fixing if out of warranty. I have no idea of the cost, but suspect it will require replacement of the video board at least if a reset does not solve it.

I just spoke to Onkyo. They said I have to take it to a service center. That's crap. They want me to reset it as well. How will that help if it is a hardware problem?

I'm guessing you use seperate preamps and such with yours eh?

I"m pissed. Grrr.

 

[TLS Guy]

I just spoke to Onkyo. They said I have to take it to a service center. That's crap. They want me to reset it as well. How will that help if it is a hardware problem?

I'm guessing you use seperate preamps and such with yours eh?

I"m pissed. Grrr.

I'm old school and still have a hard time getting used to the fact that it is just about never possible to be certain you have a software or hardware problem these days. I think it most likely is a hardware problem. However you may go to needless trouble and expense if a reset will solve it.

Anything with microprocessors and software should have an attempt at reset before pulling it apart, and I have learned that the hard way.

How does getting pissed help? If you make the decision to own complex equipment you have to expect problems now and again. If you can't agree to that bargain then don't buy the equipment and lead a simpler life style. You can't have it both ways.

Having said that there are steps you can take to minimize problems. The grid and the AC source at you wall is much worse than you imagine.

Whole house surge protection and driving gear with microprocessors from smart UPS devices that almost instantly correct for even small voltage variations goes an awfully long way to reducing failure.

There is a myth on these forums that voltage sags are innocent. I can tell you from personal experience that that is not so.

Yes, I do use a pre/pro and separate amps.

Marantz pre/pro. Note APC smart UPS devices at the bottom of the racks.

Current amp case. One more 909 here and another on the way, then all fronts will be powered by five Quad 909s.

 

[FuzzyReets]

I'm old school and still have a hard time getting used to the fact that it is just about never possible to be certain you have a software or hardware problem these days. I think it most likely is a hardware problem. However you may go to needless trouble and expense if a reset will solve it.

Anything with microprocessors and software should have an attempt at reset before pulling it apart, and I have learned that the hard way.

How does getting pissed help? If you make the decision to own complex equipment you have to expect problems now and again. If you can't agree to that bargain then don't buy the equipment and lead a simpler life style. You can't have it both ways.

Having said that there are steps you can take to minimize problems. The grid and the AC source at you wall is much worse than you imagine.

Whole house surge protection and driving gear with microprocessors from smart UPS devices that almost instantly correct for even small voltage variations goes an awfully long way to reducing failure.

There is a myth on these forums that voltage sags are innocent. I can tell you from personal experience that that is not so.

Yes, I do use a pre/pro and separate amps.

Marantz pre/pro. Note APC smart UPS devices at the bottom of the racks.

Current amp case. One more 909 here and another on the way, then all fronts will be powered by five Quad 909s.

No you're right. There is no reason to get pissed and if I'm going to have these toys I have to deal with the fact that I"m going to have problems with them from time to time. I guess that's just life. Just disappointed a bit considering I just bought this thing like 2 months ago.

You have some fancy stuff there. Far out of my price range. Maybe some day. Very nice setup you have there. Thanks for sharing.

 

[TLS Guy]

No you're right. There is no reason to get pissed and if I'm going to have these toys I have to deal with the fact that I"m going to have problems with them from time to time. I guess that's just life. Just disappointed a bit considering I just bought this thing like 2 months ago.

You have some fancy stuff there. Far out of my price range. Maybe some day. Very nice setup you have there. Thanks for sharing.

Most faults show up at the beginning and end of life of gear. Problems occurring during the initial weeks of operation are about the commonest time for faults to show up.

Please let us know what happens after a reset.

 

[FuzzyReets]

Most faults show up at the beginning and end of life of gear. Problems occurring during the initial weeks of operation are about the commonest time for faults to show up.

Please let us know what happens after a reset.

I did the reset and applied the general settings again. Same deal. I was able however to talk to the nice folks over at One Call who agreed to replace it even though it's been over 2 months time. Very impressed and thought that was very nice of them so I will be sending it back. Thanks for your input.

 

[TLS Guy]

I did the reset and applied the general settings again. Same deal. I was able however to talk to the nice folks over at One Call who agreed to replace it even though it's been over 2 months time. Very impressed and thought that was very nice of them so I will be sending it back. Thanks for your input.

You need to start another thread with a link to this thread, so members know what excellent service you had from One Call. It is that sort of information people are looking for here. That really was exceptional service.

 

[FuzzyReets]

You need to start another thread with a link to this thread, so members know what excellent service you had from One Call. It is that sort of information people are looking for here. That really was exceptional service.

It totally is. Actually I was wondering whether I should have even name dropped to be honest. They might not want everyone thinking that they will bend their policies like that. No?

 

[TLS Guy]

It totally is. Actually I was wondering whether I should have even name dropped to be honest. They might not want everyone thinking that they will bend their policies like that. No?

Service is really pretty dreadful of late. Service like that should garner more sales, and more than off set having to take back the odd unit.

A story like yours helps them get noticed in a way that no advertising can buy.
You owe it to them to spread the word about their service. One favor deserves another.

 

[FuzzyReets]

Service is really pretty dreadful of late. Service like that should garner more sales, and more than off set having to take back the odd unit.

A story like yours helps them get noticed in a way that no advertising can buy.
You owe it to them to spread the word about their service. One favor deserves another.

TLS,

Wondered what you thought of something like Monster Cable FlatScreen PowerCenter FS MP HTS400 4-Outlets Surge Suppressor. That's what' I'm currently using on my home theater stuff. Is that any good? I have this (http://www.belkin.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Product_Id=186810#) on my computer stuff upstairs but I could probably move that to my home theater stuff if you think that would be a better option. I don't know if that does any line conditioning or anything. I'm not very familiar with the power end of things. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[TLS Guy]

TLS,

Wondered what you thought of something like Monster Cable FlatScreen PowerCenter FS MP HTS400 4-Outlets Surge Suppressor. That's what' I'm currently using on my home theater stuff. Is that any good? I have this (http://www.belkin.com/IWCatProductPage.process?Product_Id=186810#) on my computer stuff upstairs but I could probably move that to my home theater stuff if you think that would be a better option. I don't know if that does any line conditioning or anything. I'm not very familiar with the power end of things. Any input would be appreciated. Thanks!

The monster device is pretty much useless. The UPS unit is fine. I use APC refurbs.

 

[FuzzyReets]

The monster device is pretty much useless. The UPS unit is fine. I use APC refurbs.

Will the UPS do line conditioning? I don't see anywhere in the product page that indicates that it will. What makes it better than my monster box?

 

[TLS Guy]

Will the UPS do line conditioning? I don't see anywhere in the product page that indicates that it will. What makes it better than my monster box?

Line conditioning is pretty much bogus and snake oil, unless it is a costly and inefficient regenerative unit that will really run up your power bill.

What you want is a unit that goes instantly to battery to give you clean lower when the grid is out of specified norms, which it quite often is for brief periods.

 

[FuzzyReets]

Line conditioning is pretty much bogus and snake oil, unless it is a costly and inefficient regenerative unit that will really run up your power bill.

What you want is a unit that goes instantly to battery to give you clean lower when the grid is out of specified norms, which it quite often is for brief periods.

Okay so you think this Belkin device is sufficient. I will use that then. Thank you.