Advise for a replacement 5'' woofer

[freethepeople]

Greetings!

I have a pair of Bohlender Graebener Radia X3 speakers and I need some replacement woofers. When I had purchased these speakers one was damaged in the shipment and the magnets were literally snapped off from the cone. I'm not sure about matching a new set of woofers "exactly" to the system specs. If there is any chance i can deviate from the specs that would be nice, but still being able to fullfill the power requirements and general things that need to be the same to somewhat match the factory sound. Here are some specs below.

Thanks so much for your suggestions!


_________________________________________________________________
The X3 is a hybrid three-way design, using a 3" ribbon as the tweeter, a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver for the midrange/bass, and a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver as the woofer. Both of the bass drivers have phase plugs. Crossover is at 2.4 kHz to the tweeter and 500 Hz to the woofer. They have a very nice set of gold-plated speaker binding posts (bi-ampable), and are ported just above the binding posts.

Igor Levitsky, BG's engineer, told me, "The two woofers work from the lowest frequency until 500 Hz, then the lower woofer starts rolling off. Thus, the X3 has one (the upper) mid-woofer which is closer to the tweeter, working up to 2.4 kHz where it crosses over to tweeter. Having only one woofer working in the upper midrange band allows better dispersion, better imaging, more balanced reproduction, and seamless vertical integration. Also, 500 Hz is very close to a "baffle" diffraction step that increases output of any system. This technique compensates for the diffraction effect as well. The 500 Hz rolloff is a first order network. The 2.4 kHz crossover between the upper mid-woofer and the tweeter is a second order Linkwitz-Riley network that sums at -6 dB in phase, thus yielding a flat frequency response. From my experience this works the best in all respects. Thus, the X3 crossover provides seamless integration, does not produce excessive lobing, does not present a hard load for amplifiers, and provides reliable system operation protecting the tweeter from excessive mid frequency peaks. All inductors are air core for perfect linearity. All capacitors are polypropylene for minimum distortion and high resolution."

 

[highfigh]

Greetings!

I have a pair of Bohlender Graebener Radia X3 speakers and I need some replacement woofers. When I had purchased these speakers one was damaged in the shipment and the magnets were literally snapped off from the cone. I'm not sure about matching a new set of woofers "exactly" to the system specs. If there is any chance i can deviate from the specs that would be nice, but still being able to fullfill the power requirements and general things that need to be the same to somewhat match the factory sound. Here are some specs below.

Thanks so much for your suggestions!


_________________________________________________________________
The X3 is a hybrid three-way design, using a 3" ribbon as the tweeter, a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver for the midrange/bass, and a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver as the woofer. Both of the bass drivers have phase plugs. Crossover is at 2.4 kHz to the tweeter and 500 Hz to the woofer. They have a very nice set of gold-plated speaker binding posts (bi-ampable), and are ported just above the binding posts.

Igor Levitsky, BG's engineer, told me, "The two woofers work from the lowest frequency until 500 Hz, then the lower woofer starts rolling off. Thus, the X3 has one (the upper) mid-woofer which is closer to the tweeter, working up to 2.4 kHz where it crosses over to tweeter. Having only one woofer working in the upper midrange band allows better dispersion, better imaging, more balanced reproduction, and seamless vertical integration. Also, 500 Hz is very close to a "baffle" diffraction step that increases output of any system. This technique compensates for the diffraction effect as well. The 500 Hz rolloff is a first order network. The 2.4 kHz crossover between the upper mid-woofer and the tweeter is a second order Linkwitz-Riley network that sums at -6 dB in phase, thus yielding a flat frequency response. From my experience this works the best in all respects. Thus, the X3 crossover provides seamless integration, does not produce excessive lobing, does not present a hard load for amplifiers, and provides reliable system operation protecting the tweeter from excessive mid frequency peaks. All inductors are air core for perfect linearity. All capacitors are polypropylene for minimum distortion and high resolution."

Why didn't you file a "Concealed Damage" claim?

I would stay with the OEM parts.

 

[AJinFLA]

I have a pair of Bohlender Graebener Radia X3 speakers and I need some replacement woofers....

....Igor Levitsky, BG's engineer, told me...

What did Igor tell you about....ordering woofers from BG??

 

[freethepeople]

What did Igor tell you about....ordering woofers from BG??

HAHAHAHA! That made me laugh, and I hope you did as well. That whole lower section is from a review of the speakers and someone getting pretty detailed. I just pasted it here for some more intel.

highfigh-

I did contact the customer support, and no luck as of yet (haven't heard a word). I will try calling them too. Do you really think they will have replacements for an almost ten year old set of speakers? They are not even in the archives of their website...but their site is not the most impressive anyways.

 

[freethepeople]

Why didn't you file a "Concealed Damage" claim?

I would stay with the OEM parts.

Oh, and i did submit a damage claim and got them paid for. So that's taken care of.

 

[TLS Guy]

Greetings!

I have a pair of Bohlender Graebener Radia X3 speakers and I need some replacement woofers. When I had purchased these speakers one was damaged in the shipment and the magnets were literally snapped off from the cone. I'm not sure about matching a new set of woofers "exactly" to the system specs. If there is any chance i can deviate from the specs that would be nice, but still being able to fullfill the power requirements and general things that need to be the same to somewhat match the factory sound. Here are some specs below.

Thanks so much for your suggestions!


_________________________________________________________________
The X3 is a hybrid three-way design, using a 3" ribbon as the tweeter, a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver for the midrange/bass, and a 5 1/2" aluminum cone driver as the woofer. Both of the bass drivers have phase plugs. Crossover is at 2.4 kHz to the tweeter and 500 Hz to the woofer. They have a very nice set of gold-plated speaker binding posts (bi-ampable), and are ported just above the binding posts.

Igor Levitsky, BG's engineer, told me, "The two woofers work from the lowest frequency until 500 Hz, then the lower woofer starts rolling off. Thus, the X3 has one (the upper) mid-woofer which is closer to the tweeter, working up to 2.4 kHz where it crosses over to tweeter. Having only one woofer working in the upper midrange band allows better dispersion, better imaging, more balanced reproduction, and seamless vertical integration. Also, 500 Hz is very close to a "baffle" diffraction step that increases output of any system. This technique compensates for the diffraction effect as well. The 500 Hz rolloff is a first order network. The 2.4 kHz crossover between the upper mid-woofer and the tweeter is a second order Linkwitz-Riley network that sums at -6 dB in phase, thus yielding a flat frequency response. From my experience this works the best in all respects. Thus, the X3 crossover provides seamless integration, does not produce excessive lobing, does not present a hard load for amplifiers, and provides reliable system operation protecting the tweeter from excessive mid frequency peaks. All inductors are air core for perfect linearity. All capacitors are polypropylene for minimum distortion and high resolution."

There is no such thing as a drop in speaker replacement. You will have to get the OEM drivers, or those speakers are useless.

If the magnets are ripped off they can not be reconed.

The problem is that all drivers have unique Thiel/Small parameters and acoustic response. So the box and crossover are custom to those speakers.

So your only hope is that either the manufacturer has the replacement drivers, or they were sourced form another manufacturer and the drivers are still available. It is quite possible they were sourced from Fountec, in which case they are likely available. BG should be able to tell you whether your speakers are salvageable or not.

Does this by any chance look like your woofers?

 

[AJinFLA]

That whole lower section is from a review of the speakers and someone getting pretty detailed. I just pasted it here for some more intel.

Ok. As TLS Guy noted, a drop in replacement for a 2.5 way, with the complex interaction between the 2 woofers and XO filter, other than the original driver...is not possible. Hopefully BG has a replacement. I would suggest continuing to contact them for an answer.

It is quite possible they were sourced from Fountec

Highly unlikely for a 10yr old speaker....since Fountek was founded in 2003.
If it were a non-custom Seas, etc. he might be in luck.

cheers,

AJ

 

[TLS Guy]

Ok. As TLS Guy noted, a drop in replacement for a 2.5 way, with the complex interaction between the 2 woofers and XO filter, other than the original driver...is not possible. Hopefully BG has a replacement. I would suggest continuing to contact them for an answer.

Highly unlikely for a 10yr old speaker....since Fountek was founded in 2003.
If it were a non-custom Seas, etc. he might be in luck.

cheers,

AJ

I could not remember when Foutek started, so that likely rules that out.

SEAS I don't think have made an aluminum driver larger than 5" and his is 5.5"

Also I really doubt the magnet would come off the back of a SEAS driver. They are much better made than that. For a magnet to come off they have to be pretty junky drivers, unless they have been in a forceful explosion.

 

[highfigh]

For a magnet to come off they have to be pretty junky drivers, unless they have been in a forceful explosion.

Never underestimate the ability of a shipper to damage anything.

 

[freethepeople]

Ok. As TLS Guy noted, a drop in replacement for a 2.5 way, with the complex interaction between the 2 woofers and XO filter, other than the original driver...is not possible. Hopefully BG has a replacement. I would suggest continuing to contact them for an answer.



Highly unlikely for a 10yr old speaker....since Fountek was founded in 2003.
If it were a non-custom Seas, etc. he might be in luck.

cheers,

AJ

Thats is starting to make sense now, in regards to sticking with OEM equipment. I had emailed the tech support at the start of the week, and still no response. I just called and left a message, so we will see where that goes...

I will try (if i can get in contact with BG) to find out who their supplier was for those woofers, and go from there. If all else fails i guess i have a nice set of speaker cabinets.


I will gets some pictures of the driver up later tonight for you all to see.

Thanks so much for all your help,
-Z

 

[freethepeople]

Does this by any chance look like your woofers?



That is very close, but not quite. I will post some pictures of mine later tonight.

Thanks for you help,
-Z

(I will post after this msg, as i need 5 post's before i can link).

 

[freethepeople]

Does this by any chance look like your woofers?

[/QUOTE]

Not quite, but here are mine:

<table style="width:194px;"><tr><td align="center" style="height:194px;background:url(http://picasaweb.google.com/s/c/transparent_album_background.gif) no-repeat left"></td></tr><tr><td style="text-align:center;font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:11px">woofer</td></tr></table>

 

[AJinFLA]

Not quite, but here are mine:

<table style="width:194px;"><tr><td align="center" style="height:194px;background:url(http://picasaweb.google.com/s/c/transparent_album_background.gif) no-repeat left"></td></tr><tr><td style="text-align:center;font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:11px">woofer</td></tr></table>

Is the (broken) frame a plastic/composite type material?

 

[freethepeople]

Is the (broken) frame a plastic/composite type material?

It sure is. I cannot believe that with the weight of the giant magnet one would consider the build quality acceptable IMO. The framework is light, cheap plastic that is (until the plastic snapped) glued to the heavy magnet.

 

[freethepeople]

Well, i finally got a hold of BG, and they did have some replacements! They were relatively cheap, a little different design, but overall get the job done. Thanks all for your suggestions!