Build Your Own Sub

[Guinness6]

Hello All,

I mentioned to a friend that I'm about to start looking for a sub in the $800 - $1,000 range & he strongly urged I build one myself. (Of course he hasn't built one, and doesn't know anyone that has...).

I'm nervous about dropping the money on something I have to build myself, though I have a competent friend I know will help.

So I thought I'd ask for some suggestions!

My house is semi-attached, I like my neighbors and don't want to annoy them (too much), so I'm not looking to shake the foundation, or anything. My Living Room is about 15x20 with 10ft ceilings. 2 open doorways lead into the dining room, with a staircase leading upstairs.

Right now I have 2 Paradigm Mini Monitors as fronts (just beginning to build my HT), and I'll probably be upgrading them to Studio 10s or 20s.

This is for 50% music, 50% HT.

Would this be easier if I started sub shopping and got an idea of the brand name sub/model I like best, then try to match it to that?

Thanks!

 

[jeffsg4mac]

Well if you have never built a speaker before than a simple sub project is the best way to start. You might also want to consider a kit too. Either way doing all yourself or a kit will save you money. You can get some pretty good kits here as well as parts for you own DYI sub.

I just finished two subs with their Titanic 12's and total cost was about $450 for both. Even with the paint gun and table saw I bought I was still under 1K.

If you decide to build your own I hope you have access to at least a table saw and an air compressor/with stapler/nailer. If you decide on the DIY route, I would recommend a build with the Titanic 10 or 12. The 10 would have a smaller box. Several of us here can work you up a box for whatever driver you decide on.

You might want to take a look at the little sub Matt suggested too. Two of those would be small and sound really good with music.

 

[annunaki]

A pair of the Dayton Reference 10" in some smaller vented enclosures with a Behringer EP2000 would fit your budget and blow anything away in that price range.

Multiple subs will allow for better overall integration as well.

 

[WmAx]

Forget Dayton. Right now www.partsexpress.com has a clearance on 10" and 12" Audio Pulse (TC Sounds) EPIC drivers. The 10" is only $150 each. These drivers are in another league of linear output at higher SPL as compared to anything else anywhere near this price bracket.

10" EPIC: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-604
12" EPIC: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-608

-Chris

 

[jinjuku]

Nice find on those drivers Chris...

 

[annunaki]

Forget Dayton. Right now www.partsexpress.com has a clearance on 10" and 12" Audio Pulse (TC Sounds) EPIC drivers. The 10" is only $150 each. These drivers are in another league of linear output at higher SPL as compared to anything else anywhere near this price bracket.

10" EPIC: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-604
12" EPIC: http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=293-608

-Chris

They model somewhat poorly in vented enclosures but sealed seems to be ok.

Sealed requires EQ in the home environment to reach lower than 27hz (-6db point). Native f3 is 34hz (in .8ft^3 for the 12")which is nothing to sneeze at in such a small enclosure though. The problem is that one cannot add eq at those frequencies as over excursion begins to happen with rated power.

Vented requires insanely long vents (over 89 inches with surface area large enough to avoid compression and keep response from peaking). The vent displacement is 79.2% of the total net volume needed for the driver. In essence, one needs to make a 4.5ft^3 enclosure for a sub that requires 2.5ft^3 of net volume.

No doubts that TC Sounds builds solid subs, but I think they concentrate too much on linearity and don't seem to concerned about practical application or concentrating on parameters that yield reasonable enclosures.

 

[WmAx]

Anunaki, I have no idea what you are talking about. Take the 10" EPIC for example, a 2.5 foot volume plus a 3" x 10" port of 60" long provides for no port compression, and a -3 around 20Hz. That is an absolute common port for any ported design to have no port compression. You can short the port quite a bit if you want to have only -3 around 26Hz, for example.

-Chris

 

[Warpdrv]

TC drivers are generally designed to work their best in small sealed boxes - they do require larger power to get them to sing properly in that scenario, but with big power and output the SQ is still top notch and are very linear.

They can perform quite well, but they take some pretty large ported boxes to get there..

Another great way to get a super amazing sub with rediculous output would be to look at the kits that AE Speakers has....

I posted a thread here.... http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64085

 

[highfigh]

Oh, look! It has cup holders!

Why do the corners look like you used solid surface counter top material- is it just the tight radius?

 

[WmAx]

TC drivers are generally designed to work their best in small sealed boxes - they do require larger power to get them to sing properly in that scenario, but with big power and output the SQ is still top notch and are very linear.

They can perform quite well, but they take some pretty large ported boxes to get there..

Another great way to get a super amazing sub with rediculous output would be to look at the kits that AE Speakers has....

I posted a thread here.... http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64085

Most drivers, including most of the TC Sounds units will produce depper, higher output with less distortion in properly design ported boxes. It just happens that they work better than most drivers in sealed applications because of the high thermal capacity without compression and long linear stroke. The general specs I give for the 10" above for a ported box allow for no compromise in performance.

-Chris

 

[lsiberian]

Most drivers, including most of the TC Sounds units will produce depper, higher output with less distortion in properly design ported boxes. It just happens that they work better than most drivers in sealed applications because of the high thermal capacity without compression and long linear stroke. The general specs I give for the 10" above for a ported box allow for no compromise in performance.

-Chris

Those are certainly a great deal. I can certainly vouch for TC Sounds performance in sealed applications. My sub destroys the ported Dayton I had. Folks on a budget have never tasted a sub this good before. Even the sealed version would best what they have.

 

[annunaki]

Anunaki, I have no idea what you are talking about. Take the 10" EPIC for example, a 2.5 foot volume plus a 3" x 10" port of 60" long provides for no port compression, and a -3 around 20Hz. That is an absolute common port for any ported design to have no port compression. You can short the port quite a bit if you want to have only -3 around 26Hz, for example.

-Chris

Most of the drivers I have done vented enclosures for generally end up in the 40" range for compression free vent design. Many of which have had similar excursion capability to the TC Epic series. The vent lengths for these drivers are longer than most drivers in their class. As the modeling seems to show they generally work best in sealed applications with higher power.

They are intended for smaller box designs as the BL and other parameters indicate whether sealed or vented. The issue is that the enclosure in a vented application will not be smallish due to the vent increasing the enclosure size by nearly 50% in most cases. Many drivers I have worked with in the past have had the (gross) enclosure size increasing by only around 30% or so.

Not picking a fight or anything Chris they are very nice drivers. It just feels like one is building a huge vent around a tiny enclosure with these drivers. Where in most cases it is a larger enclosure with a smaller vent. The latter seeming to lend to better overall efficiency.

 

[engtaz]

Sweet sub.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

It has already been built for you.
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64459

Shameless plug by the Dawg

Hello All,

I mentioned to a friend that I'm about to start looking for a sub in the $800 - $1,000 range & he strongly urged I build one myself. (Of course he hasn't built one, and doesn't know anyone that has...).

I'm nervous about dropping the money on something I have to build myself, though I have a competent friend I know will help.

So I thought I'd ask for some suggestions!

My house is semi-attached, I like my neighbors and don't want to annoy them (too much), so I'm not looking to shake the foundation, or anything. My Living Room is about 15x20 with 10ft ceilings. 2 open doorways lead into the dining room, with a staircase leading upstairs.

Right now I have 2 Paradigm Mini Monitors as fronts (just beginning to build my HT), and I'll probably be upgrading them to Studio 10s or 20s.

This is for 50% music, 50% HT.

Would this be easier if I started sub shopping and got an idea of the brand name sub/model I like best, then try to match it to that?

Thanks!

 

[GO-NAD!]

Hey guys, I think the OP has been forgotten about during the debate!

Guinness6, what are your limits on enclosure dimensions? That might help to narrow down the list of suitable drivers. Are you open to dual subs, or do want to stick with a single? Two very good subs may be better than one top-of-the-heap sub, when it comes to integration into your system. It would depend on your priorities. If you want super low extension, a single sub with a top knotch driver might be best. The advantages of multiple subs are more articulately explained in some of the articles at the Audioholics website.

When it comes to DIY, a sub isn't all that complex. The guys "discussing" the relative merits of different drivers can come up with a great design for you. You just have to put it together!

 

[jeffsg4mac]

Oh, look! It has cup holders!

Why do the corners look like you used solid surface counter top material- is it just the tight radius?

Nope it is the a tight radius and there are no white specks they are solid black. The white specks is being caused by the flash. They are textured black finish.

 

[billy p]

Hello All,

I mentioned to a friend that I'm about to start looking for a sub in the $800 - $1,000 range & he strongly urged I build one myself. (Of course he hasn't built one, and doesn't know anyone that has...).

I'm nervous about dropping the money on something I have to build myself, though I have a competent friend I know will help.

So I thought I'd ask for some suggestions!

My house is semi-attached, I like my neighbors and don't want to annoy them (too much), so I'm not looking to shake the foundation, or anything. My Living Room is about 15x20 with 10ft ceilings. 2 open doorways lead into the dining room, with a staircase leading upstairs.

Right now I have 2 Paradigm Mini Monitors as fronts (just beginning to build my HT), and I'll probably be upgrading them to Studio 10s or 20s.

This is for 50% music, 50% HT.

Would this be easier if I started sub shopping and got an idea of the brand name sub/model I like best, then try to match it to that?

Thanks!

DIY...maybe the novel approach but unless you have all required tools or equipment for the doing it right... I thought better of it. Fwiw they're numerous kits or designs at nauseam for DIY, but unless you feel 100% confident building it yourself than IMO commercial is your best option. AAMOF...I'm having a sub built myself ...just ask around because people are always willing to help or maybe even for a fee they'll build you one.

Regards, Bill....

 

[Warpdrv]

DIY...maybe the novel approach but unless you have all required tools or equipment for the doing it right... I thought better of it. Fwiw they're numerous kits or designs at nauseam for DIY, but unless you feel 100% confident building it yourself than IMO commercial is your best option. AAMOF...I'm having a sub built myself ...just ask around because people are always willing to help or maybe even for a fee they'll build you one.

Regards, Bill....

Look forward to your impressions of the upcoming AE sub bill....

Is that a PR unit... ?

 

[billy p]

Look forward to your impressions of the upcoming AE sub bill....

Is that a PR unit... ?

No its not...but the site you linked is very interesting. It should serve people who are more incline than me, very wel. As for PR designs the 1212 looks to be the closest in ^3 area to my enclosure however mine will use a single 4"port & 14.5x24x24. FWIW....I was told that the AV driver might not equal the freq of the other AE models... but with more travel they will have more low end and output. As for my for my thoughts...I'm just stoked and I just found out it shipped out this morning but BC Canada is a long ways away.

Cheers, Bill....

 

[lsiberian]

DIY...maybe the novel approach but unless you have all required tools or equipment for the doing it right... I thought better of it. Fwiw they're numerous kits or designs at nauseam for DIY, but unless you feel 100% confident building it yourself than IMO commercial is your best option. AAMOF...I'm having a sub built myself ...just ask around because people are always willing to help or maybe even for a fee they'll build you one.

Regards, Bill....

If you can drive a screw I can give you a design and parts list for a sub. At worst you'd have to use a drill. It will be sealed, but it will be good.