AVR for pre/pro

[ahblaza]

Hello to all,
I'm using an Onkyo TX-SR702 receiver with no HDMI feature as a pre/pro to drive my center and side surrounds and a separate power amp for mains. I would like to purchase an AVR with HDMI to use just as a pre/pro that can handle the audio formats TrueHD and DTS-HD bitstream or PCM from a BD player. I'm awaiting the arrival of my PS3 slim to use with this AVR. I'm considering Harmon Kardon AVR-254 @ the Harmon Ebay store. The onkyo has 5.1 inputs but unfortunately the PS3 does not have multi-channel outs. I will also use the Onkyo as an amp to drive the center and surrounds or in another configuration, I am also considering a stand alone BD player with 7.1 analog outs. I seem to be rambling on here so I'll get to the point. Any thoughts on this Harmon 254, I'm not concerned about the amp section as the receiver will be used primarily as a preamp processor. I would appreciate any feedback using the 254 as described or any other alternatives. I'm leaning towards the Harmon because of warranty and the in house recondition and obviously the price. Thanks guys for the time, I really look forward to your replies, I have much respect for your advice and do not take it with a grain of salt. Thank you again.
Best regards....Jeff

 

[jostenmeat]

What's your budget? If you can swing it, go with HDMI, if only for flexibility of bass mgmt, and ability to add post processing if need be. However, I can guess that you are looking to spend a rather modest amount, and in such case, I'd like to quote myself from a previous thread. However, most will be very hard to locate I fear at this point.

Hm. Well, you sure don't need the decoders if you are keeping the PS3. In which case all you need is a receiver than can handle mch PCM over HDMI. The only real thing I would personally research is if any particular model can matrix mch PCM as I have a 7.1 rig, but if yours is 5.1 don't worry. Maybe you guys have one laying around somewhere, a demo, hidden in storage, dunno. Any of these will be cheaper. Oh, and the 661 will give you a better amp than the 663, which in of itself has a better amp than the 665!!!

Onkyo 604
Marantz 4001
Yamaha 661
Yamaha HTR-6060
HK 247
Panasonic XR57
Sony STR-DG810
Denon 887
Denon 1908CI
Denon 788
Denon 2308CI

*sorry, didn't research # of HDMI inputs for you. just a small reference list.

 

[lsiberian]

Hello to all,
I'm using an Onkyo TX-SR702 receiver with no HDMI feature as a pre/pro to drive my center and side surrounds and a separate power amp for mains. I would like to purchase an AVR with HDMI to use just as a pre/pro that can handle the audio formats TrueHD and DTS-HD bitstream or PCM from a BD player. I'm awaiting the arrival of my PS3 slim to use with this AVR. I'm considering Harmon Kardon AVR-254 @ the Harmon Ebay store. The onkyo has 5.1 inputs but unfortunately the PS3 does not have multi-channel outs. I will also use the Onkyo as an amp to drive the center and surrounds or in another configuration, I am also considering a stand alone BD player with 7.1 analog outs. I seem to be rambling on here so I'll get to the point. Any thoughts on this Harmon 254, I'm not concerned about the amp section as the receiver will be used primarily as a preamp processor. I would appreciate any feedback using the 254 as described or any other alternatives. I'm leaning towards the Harmon because of warranty and the in house recondition and obviously the price. Thanks guys for the time, I really look forward to your replies, I have much respect for your advice and do not take it with a grain of salt. Thank you again.
Best regards....Jeff

I use a 247 mainly do to it's low cost. The HK's are nothing to write home about, but they will do the job. I still suggest an Onkyo 805 or 705 if you can swing it on the used market. I'd love to have the Onkyo 705 back again as it's a much better receiver overall. The 200 series software is a joke at best.

 

[ahblaza]

I really like my Onkyo 702, just no hdmi. I guess I can run hdmi out from PS3 to display and run optical digital from PS3 to Onkyo, will there be a substantial difference in sound quality using the optical cable over the hdmi cable with the higher resolution audio formats, I know the optical cable does not not have the bandwidth to carry the full lossless audio. I guess I can look for a BD player with MCH outputs to use with the Onkyo and also use the PS3 as mentioned. I might also start looking at used onkyo 705-805 as you suggested Isiberian. Thanks, look forward to replies

 

[lsiberian]

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i got mine from amazon!
i will suggest u go for the below:
Yamaha RX-V365BL
Yamaha RXV665BL
Pioneer VSX519VK
Pioneer VSX-82TXS
Denon AVR-2807
JVC RX-D702
Sony STR-DG1000

Let's not go around suggesting receivers that won't meet the guys needs. The Sony is overpriced junk to put it kindly and doesn't even have pre-amp outs. Neither does the JVC.

 

[jostenmeat]

Let's not go around suggesting receivers that won't meet the guys needs. The Sony is overpriced junk to put it kindly and doesn't even have pre-amp outs. Neither does the JVC.

Sorry. This is an old reference list for PCM-HDMI capable receivers. It skipped my mind to let the OP know that he should look for preouts. This is probably at least the 5th time I've posted this list, and everytime the OP has different needs. The one common need, when I post that list, is low price.

 

[jostenmeat]

I really like my Onkyo 702, just no hdmi. I guess I can run hdmi out from PS3 to display and run optical digital from PS3 to Onkyo, will there be a substantial difference in sound quality using the optical cable over the hdmi cable with the higher resolution audio formats, I know the optical cable does not not have the bandwidth to carry the full lossless audio. I guess I can look for a BD player with MCH outputs to use with the Onkyo and also use the PS3 as mentioned. I might also start looking at used onkyo 705-805 as you suggested Isiberian. Thanks, look forward to replies

The difficulty lies, IMO, with subjectivity, and allocation of funds. If you have a well designed room, fantastic speakers and subs, hey, might as well get the new codecs.

If that's not the case, then the decision is a lot more difficult. Personally, I typically* find little/no difference with S/PDIF and the lossless codecs with movie soundtracks. I find a bigger difference with music BDs, in general.

The one time there was a very significant difference for me between lossy/lossless was with the Dark Knight, where I am taking a stab in the dark that the mix itself is different.

If I were you, I'd just use optical (and just wait until you have funds for the perfect unit, in your eyes, JMO). The processor is probably the one singular item in an AV setup that is superceded the very quickest (just about yearly). I would say amps are the opposite.

On a bluray, your max bitrate, using the same old skool lossy codecs, increases. I believe DD should go from (using sketchy memory) from 448 kbps to 640 kbps, and DTS will be at 1508 kbps (normally* at 768 or so, though there ARE dvds that can do 1508).

IOW, you still get some* improvement with an optical, for audio on BDs.

 

[ahblaza]

I have to agree with the S/PDIF, I have been using a borrowed PS3 for BD playback for about a month now and have to say there is significant audio difference with optical over standard DVD play back. and this also varies from one BD to another, some noticable and others not so. I've been doing some research in the interim between these posts and am liking the new pioneer lineup 820K primarily for the HDMI and processor, but then again no preouts. Also looking at the Denon's 790-890 but not real confident. I checked out the Pioneer elite series VSX-21TXH and am liking this. My significant other just gave me the ok to use the rest of my HT space for home theater and two channel listening. It's a 14' by 25' space that is half used for a dining room and my toys, now it will be all my space, there are compromises involved but that's another story. What do you guys think about the 21TXH and 7.1 audio, I've never felt the need for more than 5.1 but since it is an option I will consider. I have the room now to open it up. I look forward to your replies. I'm going to Mountaineer Racetrack and Casino on Monday, this could change a lot of purchasing power more $$$ or none. I quit smoking and drinking but wagering still runs strong. We will see. Keep the feedback coming guys, I'm listening and truly respect your input.
Jeff

 

[jostenmeat]

I have to agree with the S/PDIF, I have been using a borrowed PS3 for BD playback for about a month now and have to say there is significant audio difference with optical over standard DVD play back. and this also varies from one BD to another, some noticable and others not so. I've been doing some research in the interim between these posts and am liking the new pioneer lineup 820K primarily for the HDMI and processor, but then again no preouts. Also looking at the Denon's 790-890 but not real confident. I checked out the Pioneer elite series VSX-21TXH and am liking this. My significant other just gave me the ok to use the rest of my HT space for home theater and two channel listening. It's a 14' by 25' space that is half used for a dining room and my toys, now it will be all my space, there are compromises involved but that's another story. What do you guys think about the 21TXH and 7.1 audio, I've never felt the need for more than 5.1 but since it is an option I will consider. I have the room now to open it up. I look forward to your replies. I'm going to Mountaineer Racetrack and Casino on Monday, this could change a lot of purchasing power more $$$ or none. I quit smoking and drinking but wagering still runs strong. We will see. Keep the feedback coming guys, I'm listening and truly respect your input.
Jeff

Again, I'd like to reiterate that I believe it's about allocation of funds. If you are using HTIB speakers, then I would never say to spend first on a new receiver, for instance. Perhaps . . . you can list your equipment, and maybe people can chime in on what they think a good purchasing decision might be.

Now, for rears, yeah I'm pretty sure 25ft should allow that! However, you'll have to decide if you can handle the "ugliness" of more speakers, wherever they are placed. You'll want them, if possible, at least several feet away. Personally, I think I may go 9.1 in the future, as I have 7.1 now, by adding DSX height channels. I believe there is a moderator here that may go 11.1 by adding the DSX width channels as well. Here is rmk's system, as he uses 9.1. The height speaker on the right is cut off in the photo, and the left height is not visible:
http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showpost.php?p=673115&postcount=650

 

[nibhaz]

Let's not go around suggesting receivers that won't meet the guys needs. The Sony is overpriced junk to put it kindly and doesn't even have pre-amp outs. Neither does the JVC.

Not that what you have stated is wrong, but it comes off a little overly aggressive and indiscreet IMHO.

Perhaps in the future you should consider a more tactful response to an honest mistake by one of our most devoted and helpful members.

 

[ahblaza]

Guys,
I'm looking for a receiver that can decode the newest audio codecs, preouts to drive external amps and basically perform as a pre/pro., I'm not concerned about a robust amp section, I guess I need a control AVR to switch between several sources, I'm more concerned with the audio processing and preamp functions as I have analog devices, turntable with outboard phono stage, CD player as well as BD players that can will send bitstream or PCM signal to AVR. I need the capabilty of a pre/pro without the associated cost. I don't have the most resolving system nor do I have a HTIB, no malice intended. My listening room is 15'x8'x23' with carpeted floors, heavy drapes and comfortable furniture. I do a lot of 2 channel listening and also enjoy my HT setup. I'm in the process of new mains loudspeaker purchase to replace my current Athena F2's, I also have Infinity Primus 162's center and surrounds. Not the last word in sound quality but for now I can live with these speakers. My first priority is to get an AVR with the features that I have mentioned and then I will seek your advice on speakers. My budjet is in the $500-$750 range. Thanks guys for your time, I'm open to all suggestions as I value your opinions.
Jeff