Anyone else stuck using a CRT?

[yepimonfire]

yea, i have noticed CRT's have much better color, i once had a videophile tell me once that CRT's can produce more colors as well. although im sure plasma tv's can do this

 

[njedpx3]

Far from being "stuck" with a CRT, I actually still prefer them for watching anything but HD, as anything but true HD TV looks totally unacceptable to me on the new flat panels, regardless of what type. ...

You obviously have never seen a PRO 151-FD
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Products/HomeEntertainment/PlasmaTVs+Monitors/EliteTVs/ci.PRO-151FD.Kuro

I knew a guy that wouldn't look at any of the new LCD, LED, or plasma TVS and to him the 480i CRT was completely acceptable.

''If you you only have a hammer in your toolbox ..then everything looks like a nail "

Peace and Good Video,

Forest Man

P.S. -You probably wouldn't appreciate my recent upgrade to a Shimano Curado 200E7 and a Shimano Crucial graphite rod either

 

[yepimonfire]

i was talking about standard LCD's, plasmas can hit more colors and do it much better.

 

[njedpx3]

i was talking about standard LCD's, plasmas can hit more colors and do it much better.

yepimonfire - nice feedback -- threw you a green chicklet


Peace, Good Sound and Good PQ,

Forest Man

 

[yepimonfire]

yay for once im not stupid!

 

[Cristofori]

You obviously have never seen a PRO 151-FD
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Products/HomeEntertainment/PlasmaTVs+Monitors/EliteTVs/ci.PRO-151FD.Kuro

No, I haven't seen it, but every other flat panel TV I've seen looks awesome with HD, but was unacceptable for regular programming. Of course, the fancy showrooms at the shops don't show you what an over the air program such as Seinfeld for example, or even some older DVD's look like on them, which can actually be quite lousy . They only show awesome HD and other stuff that was designed to look great. Who wouldn't be lulled into purchasing one?

$6500 for one of these? No thanks, if that's what it takes to make non-HD programming look acceptable. I will wait until the prices come down. I'm content with my CRT for now.

I knew a guy that wouldn't look at any of the new LCD, LED, or plasma TVS and to him the 480i CRT was completely acceptable.

But I have looked at all kinds of flat panel TVs in real world applications, barrooms, peoples houses, etc. All of them looked awesome with HD, but worse than a VHS tape with regular over the air broadcasts, regardless of up-converters, etc.

I will never forget watching a new Sony whatever flat panel at a sports bar once that was showing a non-HD golf game. When the camera was panning fast with the flying ball over the field, the resulting image quality, with it's noticeably huge square pixels, looked worse then an old VHS blank tape recorded many times over. THAT is unacceptable! The regular non-motion images didn't look good either.

My friend uses both flat panel and CRT TV's. We've compared the same TV programs many times playing on the both, and the CRT TV was always obviously better, sometimes drastically so. When I point this out to others, they just shrug their shoulders and don't seem to care much.

''If you you only have a hammer in your toolbox ..then everything looks like a nail "

True, but all my nails look good, instead of only a few certain ones.

Believe me, I would LOVE to go to a flat panel, and might buy one just for true HD stuff in the future, but until I start to see normal, reasonably priced ones out there with the ability to make ALL video programming look decent like CRT TV's do, I'm reluctant to shell out the money.

P.S. -You probably wouldn't appreciate my recent upgrade to a Shimano Curado 200E7 and a Shimano Crucial graphite rod either

[/QUOTE]I can't possibly appreciate it because I have no idea what your talking about, and either would most average people or those of us who are mostly into audio.

I just want a reasonably priced flat panel TV that looks good with non-HD programming using basic equipment, without all the upgrades or pretentious gizmos needed to make them that way.

 

[Hi Ho]

Most of the poor quality SD can be traced back to settings. Those TV's in the bars and stores are most likely set on the default "Vivid" picture mode which introduces all sorts of "enhancements" and sharpening effects which can make even HD programs look horrendous. A properly setup plasma can have very good SD picture quality.

 

[Cristofori]

Most of the poor quality SD can be traced back to settings. Those TV's in the bars and stores are most likely set on the default "Vivid" picture mode which introduces all sorts of "enhancements" and sharpening effects which can make even HD programs look horrendous. A properly setup plasma can have very good SD picture quality.

It wasn't just at bars and stores, but at peoples houses and the one my friend had. Basically, everyone I had ever seen so far. The ones at the stores actually looked awesome opposed to everywhere else, because they never show non-HD material, and I wouldn't either if I was trying to sell the things!

I believe my friend tried everything possible to make his 42" Samsung flat panel look good with regular non-HD programing, without success (I was there when he was trying). We were actually laughing at how bad some of the over the air non-HD digital programs looked on it.

Most pictures were horribly grainy looking, or looked like they were shot through a dirty screen door. Nocturnal scenes were especially hideous. This was digital TV mind you, not analog. But when an HD channel came along, the picture was stupendously beautiful and awesome. What a strange juxtaposition!

He checked into getting an external upconverter, but wasn't impressed with what he saw, as the picture was barely, if at all improved. He got fed up and took it back, only to brake down and get a smaller model later on because he got a great deal. And I'd have to say that the smaller Samsung looks a bit better, if only because the lousy picture is less noticeable due to the smaller screen size.

He now uses this mostly for HD viewing only, which is probably what I would do if I got one, or until the (hopefully) improved looking models in the future come down in price.

It's not just this particular Samsung brand that looked lousy with non-HD material, which actually had the best looking picture out of all the others available in the store at the time, but other brands as well.

 

[yepimonfire]

no SD looks bad, nothing you do will fix it, if i understand this correctly, all an up-conerter does is uses anti-aliasing and pixel multiplication, for example SD has one blue pixel in a certain spot, upconverter now makes it have 5 pixels of blue there, then applys a filter that blurs the edges of the pixels, it really does not do to good of a job. ever tried playing a 320x240 DOS game like DOOM on a 1600x1200 CRT monitor? yea, perfect example of what happens to SD on a HD display, especially 1080 displays, the 720 arent as bad.

 

[Hi Ho]

I'm not saying that SD content on an HD set is as good as on a CRT. It isn't. It's not necessarily as bad as you describe in every situation. Cable TV often has aweful SD quality (at least around here) while the SD feed I get from Dish actually looks pretty good. This goes for my 42" Panasonic as well as my Mitsubishi DLP projector thrown on a 73" screen. Even on the 73" screen SD is amazingly decent and watchable. Great looking? No. Watchable and not horrible.

I watch almost no SD content so maybe I'm less picky.

 

[njedpx3]

Hey, Cristofori -thanks for the feedback to my post. Thanks for posting

No, I haven't seen it, but every other flat panel TV I've seen looks awesome with HD, but was unacceptable for regular programming. Of course, the fancy showrooms at the shops don't show you what an over the air program such as Seinfeld for example, or even some older DVD's look like on them, which can actually be quite lousy . They only show awesome HD and other stuff that was designed to look great. Who wouldn't be lulled into purchasing one?

$6500 for one of these? No thanks, if that's what it takes to make non-HD programming look acceptable. I will wait until the prices come down. I'm content with my CRT for now.

Yes, the Pioneer Elite Kuro is the ultimate plasma and there is a difference. I have one in my house and I just finished building a National Woods Cabin and I currently have a Sony Wega 36" CRT TV 480i with standard satellite DishNetwork feed and BD feeds and the PQ is bad and I am replacing with the lower end Sony BRAVIA, BRAVIA EX 400 Series 40-Inch LCD TV, Black.

But I have looked at all kinds of flat panel TVs in real world applications, barrooms, peoples houses, etc. All of them looked awesome with HD, but worse than a VHS tape with regular over the air broadcasts, regardless of up-converters, etc.

I think we need to be completely fair here and understand what you are actually observing IMHO. If you have really bad input, then I agree there is no way to ever improve to HD level PQ. Some cable input (which is typically what bars,restaurants, and health clubs use) is very poor input video quality and the difference IMHO between CRT looking better than an LCD, LED, or plasma is that the CRT might help mask the flaws because of the difference in video display technology and persistance whereas the LCD, LED or plasma are sharper and tend to emphasize flaws. ...but to say it is the level of VHS.. my only thought is that it must be really poor input. I would venture to say that standard DVD ( not HD or BD), Satellite, or fiber optics would show up much better on LCD, LED or plasma. Now, OTA with a digital to analog convertor ..that might be a different story

I will never forget watching a new Sony whatever flat panel at a sports bar once that was showing a non-HD golf game. When the camera was panning fast with the flying ball over the field, the resulting image quality, with it's noticeably huge square pixels, looked worse then an old VHS blank tape recorded many times over. THAT is unacceptable! The regular non-motion images didn't look good either.

I woulld say it had poor quality cable input..just my guess. And true some of the early LCDs did have a motion problem becuase of pixel persistence and slowrefresh rates. Also, sports bars usually put in the cheapest displays they can get ... thinking that after a few drinks ..who cares

My friend uses both flat panel and CRT TV's. We've compared the same TV programs many times playing on the both, and the CRT TV was always obviously better, sometimes drastically so. When I point this out to others, they just shrug their shoulders and don't seem to care much.

Interesting ..what source is your friend connected to ? possibly standard cable ?

True, but all my nails look good, instead of only a few certain ones.

Good Point Touche

Believe me, I would LOVE to go to a flat panel, and might buy one just for true HD stuff in the future, but until I start to see normal, reasonably priced ones out there with the ability to make ALL video programming look decent like CRT TV's do, I'm reluctant to shell out the money.

Okay , but consider the source ..satelite and or fiber optics look pretty sweet on LCD, LEDF or plasma ..even non-HD



"P.S. -You probably wouldn't appreciate my recent upgrade to a Shimano Curado 200E7 and a Shimano Crucial graphite rod either" - njedpx3

I can't possibly appreciate it because I have no idea what your talking about, and either would most average people or those of us who are mostly into audio.

I was just checking if you would google it It is a fairly high-level fishing rod and reel. I am into other things besides HT and audio ..sorry for the confusion; I just upgraded my fishing gear ..analogous to TV upgrade

I just want a reasonably priced flat panel TV that looks good with non-HD programming using basic equipment, without all the upgrades or pretentious gizmos needed to make them that way.

Good goals and I completely agree with you. Again I ask what is your video source ..poor source = poor PQ no matter what the output display and upconverting. I hooked up a VHS to the plasma,just to see if it would work and the output was pretty poor PQ. Just my opinion, satellite, fiber optics or standard DVDs provide a high level of input resolution that is noticeably better on LCD, LED or plasma display. Not so much so with most cable and most OTA.



Your opinion maybe different and I respect that. Have a great day.


Peace, Good Sound, Good Video, Great Hiking, and Great Fishing,

Forest Man