Please Help With My "RTi12 Dilemma" Before The Return Day...

[PearlcorderS701]

Hi All.

As some of you already know from previous threads, I have been looking to replace and upgrade a pair of Polk R20 bookshelves for the main theater room, as we're moving into a new four-bedroom house and the upgrade simply comes just in time; I am keeping my CSi30 center from an old system (which included the R20's) and was told the best tower match for this center would be a pair from the "RTi A" line, or, better yet, something from the discontinued "RTi" line.

My budget for these new speakers will not allow me to afford even the least expensive model in the new RTi A line, the RTi A5's, as they come to well over $800 for a pair. BUT -- I found a good deal on a pair of RTi8's (the predecessor to the A5's) and purchased them, only to get an e-mail that the order was canceled for some reason (probably due to no stock from the vendor...thanks a lot).

I went to a local Frys today and they have some RTi12's in stock for $399 each, and I was told this is a tremendous value for these. Of course, they're discontinued, but they were the top of the line in the RTi series previously, so I am thinking this may be a good buy. I had the order all ready to go, but then it hit me -- these were more than we wanted to spend for new speakers.

So now the dilemma has become, do I bite the bullet and swallow hard to shell out over 800 bucks for a pair of RTi12's -- which would be suitable and ready for a receiver or amp upgrade down the line -- or should I search for some RTi10's, which would be about 200 bucks or so less? In that same manner, should I possibly be looking towards a different model line in Polk's series? Perhaps something from the Monitor line, as it would be more suited for our budget?

I was already told that if I had my heart set on the RTi's, I shouldn't really even consider going "lower" to a Monitor or the modern Polk equivalent; and then there's the issue of whether the Monitors would even be a sonic match for my CSi30 center (I don't want to buy a new center now).

Anyone have any opinions or insights here? I realize I have a bit of an underpowered receiver for the RTi12's with an Onkyo 605, but can I get away with using the RTi12's with this amp? Are they worth the $800-plus?

 

[dkane360]

I think it's really up to you to determine if you can afford to go over budget. If you feel like the extra money could go to something different either now or at some point down the road that would prove to have a bigger difference, then I wouldn't spend the extra money. After a quick browse, it seems that 400 a speaker is about what theyre going for online, although shipping becomes another issue altogether. I also found a thread from a few years ago, and they suggested to give the Rti12's as much power as possible, which I would keep in mind.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10828&page=2

They do look like very nice speakers, and I don't think you will be disappointed either way. But have you looked at other speakers besides the Polks? I know you want to stay with the Polks to match your center, but you may find something you like better at the right price. I'm not saying the Polks are bad speakers and you shouldn't get them, I just think its at least worth looking around at other manufacturers before you buy speakers.

 

[AVRat]

How large is the new HT room? If you're looking to move your HT gear up to a higher level of performance then perhaps the Polk 12s would make sense, but not powered off the 605. If I were you, I'd try to shake off the obsession with the C30 and consider upgrading the front three to obtain a good cohesive front soundstage. Since you seem to be more budget minded, an EMP E5Ti/E5Ci combo might fit the bill.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Thanks for the opinions, guys...

I pulled the trigger on a pair of RTi12's at Frys today, and from the sheer size of the boxes these things come in, I couldn't even get them in our car...so we had to arrange for delivery for another $60; I am concerned, though, that because these towers are so large, the current they're going to demand is not going to be remotely enough from my Onkyo 605...

I understand what everyone's saying about letting my CSi30 center go, but I'd really like to utilize it for different reasons right now; hence, I'd like to stick with Polk floorstander models. This would make the RTi line the best match, according to the company -- but if I decide to keep the RTi12's, will they be okay running crossed over at the 605, letting my sub do most of the work? Can they be driven with approx. 90 watts apiece?

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Okay 'All.

Here's the situation. I'm having reservations now about whether or not I should return the Polk RTi12's I just bought due to their sheer size, balancing the possibility that these are probably way too much of a demand on my Onkyo 605, current-wise. Couple that with the fact that I am having a hard time swallowing the almost $1K price for these, now that delivery charges were added into the mix, and I am feeling I should begin looking elsewhere in Polk's lineup...

So, let me address the criteria, again: I realize I have been tipped to change up my CSi30 center to something different, so I could have a more modern match for the center channel, but I would really like to keep it for now. Given that, what tower in Polk's line would be a good sonic match for the CSi? I know the RTi/RTi-A's have been established as the good pairing, but I simply cannot see paying $800+ for the entry-level RTi-A5's, and I cannot go beyond these in the A lineup.

What if I dropped down to the series below the RTi's, like, say, the TSi's, or possibly a pair of Monitors? I understand that these would be a step down especially since I have been chewing on the idea of RTi's or RTi-A's, but I think these would be better suited to my budget and current demands of my present AVR...

Would the TSi's or Monitors match with my CSi center, decently enough? Would there be a big discrepency in soundstage cohesiveness between these series?

If someone could offer any suggestions before I need to cancel the delivery on the 12's (before Thursday) I would appreciate it, so I know I made the right decision.

I have e-mailed Polk technical support regarding this as well; waiting to hear back from them.

Thank you all.

 

[AVRat]

The TSis would probably be a pretty good match and I don't think it'd be a far difference, probably better, than your current match with the 20s. Since you're budget conscious and looking to power them with the 605, I'd opt for the TSi300s.

 

[anamorphic96]

Don't even think about the RTi12's unless you have a better receiver or amp. they are power hogs. Your 605 would not be adequate.

Either step down to the TSI 300's or go back online for the RTi8's. Which can be found at One Call for the price you where paying plus shipping. You could even get the matching center to the RTi8's for 249. So for about 700 to 750 plus shipping. You could get 3 new front speakers that are matched. A little more than you wanted to spend. But in the end you will probably save money and have a completely matched front stage.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Guys,

Thanks for the input; I unfortunately was already told by Polk's support that the RTi12's, while adequately demanding, won't be a problem to drive with my setup depending on the demands I make of it...this is what they said:

The RTi12’s do look imposing with their high power handling capability and multiple drivers, however they are not a particularly difficult load to drive. They are not low impedance, nor low efficiency- which are both factors which make a speaker difficult to drive or “power hungry”.

I was also told by someone on Polk's forums that the 12's will be fine to be driven by the 605 -- I'll supply those replies here in a moment...

UPDATE: Here's what I'm being told from Polk forum folks...

You will be fine. Could the 12's use a little more power, yes they could, are they going to be just fine with the 605, yes they will. Get them all set up, listen to them and then down the road if you want, get a better AVR and an external amp and call it good.

and...

Your 605 will do just fine

and...

Take those power ratings with a grain of salt. The 12's are rated for a "max" of 500 watts IIRC. You could take a 500 watt amp and hook it up to a pair of RTiA5's though, with absolutely no drawbacks at all. There is no such thing as being able to "handle all that juice", when it comes to loudspeakers.

and...

You're going to be absolutely fine powering the 12's with your AVR. Bass is what creates the most demand on an amplifier, since woofers require more movement. All of your low bass information is going to be going to your subwoofer, thus drastically decreasing the load on your AVR. Running the 12's crossed at 80 hz, will be presenting a load that's essentially the same as an A5's load to your AVR.

As myself, and others, have said before. If you were looking for a pair of speakers to do 2 channel listening with on your 605, I wouldn't be recommending the 12's. From what I've gathered though, your rig usage is almost exclusively HT. HT is nowhere near as demanding of audio gear as 2 channel is(generally speaking). The constant dynamic swing of music makes an amp work much harder than a movie, which is generally full of quieter scenes which put next to no strain on your amp, with brief dynamic bursts in between. This obviously isn't true of all movies, of course.

 

[anamorphic96]

This begs the question. Why buy such a huge floorstanding speaker for your home theater when you are going to probably cross them over at 80hz. You might want to consider 60hz. Even then the RTi12's are more designed for full range output.

Did you look at One Call. They have the RTi8s and matching center for great prices. You could have purchased all three of these and had a new front stage for less than the RTi12's. You could have then sold the older center to help offset the costs even further. In fact you would have saved 100 maybe even 200 and had a much better set up.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

This begs the question. Why buy such a huge floorstanding speaker for your home theater when you are going to probably cross them over at 80hz. You might want to consider 60hz. Even then the RTi12's are more designed for full range output.

Anamorphic,

The reason I purchased these is because Frys had them for $399 a piece, and I figured they were the flagship of the RTi line previously; it seemed like a good deal that could be upgradeable.

Did you look at One Call. They have the RTi8s and matching center for great prices. You could have purchased all three of these and had a new front stage for less than the RTi12's. You could have then sold the older center to help offset the costs even further. In fact you would have saved 100 maybe even 200 and had a much better set up.

While I understand the RTi8's are more in the range of what my 605 can power, they didn't look all that impressive to me in person; they're rather small. I also was looking towards something that can grow with me if I upgrade amplification. That said, can you specifically outline a system for me from One Call that incorporates the RTi8's and a matching center for less than what I paid for these RTi12's? I don't see these kinds of prices on there that you mention...

 

[anamorphic96]

Anamorphic,

The reason I purchased these is because Frys had them for $399 a piece, and I figured they were the flagship of the RTi line previously; it seemed like a good deal that could be upgradeable.



While I understand the RTi8's are more in the range of what my 605 can power, they didn't look all that impressive to me in person; they're rather small. I also was looking towards something that can grow with me if I upgrade amplification. That said, can you specifically outline a system for me from One Call that incorporates the RTi8's and a matching center for less than what I paid for these RTi12's? I don't see these kinds of prices on there that you mention...

https://www.onecall.com/Cart.aspx

Hopefully that link shows up. But the total came to 860.26 shipped to your door for the all three speakers I mentioned above. You could upgrade to the RTi10's for 100 more if you wanted.

If you got the 12's for 800 plus 8.5% tax and 60.00 delivery. You are at roughly 930.00 delivered.

The deal you received on the 12's is a good deal. But I mentioned the other system due to the fact you where worried about a matched, cohesive front stage.

Sine you pulled the trigger on the 12's go to One Call and get the matching center before they are gone. Then you wont have to worry about finding one in the future since they are discontinued. The 12's with the CSi5 would be a kick #ss system with room to grow. If youre gonna break the bank go all out.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

https://www.onecall.com/Cart.aspx

Hopefully that link shows up. But the total came to 860.26 shipped to your door for the all three speakers I mentioned above. You could upgrade to the RTi10's for 100 more if you wanted.

Thanks much...

If you got the 12's for 800 plus 8.5% tax and 60.00 delivery. You are at roughly 930.00 delivered.

Right...about what it came to...

That's just for two speakers; seems a bit much to me...

The deal you received on the 12's is a good deal. But I mentioned the other system due to the fact you where worried about a matched, cohesive front stage.

Sine you pulled the trigger on the 12's go to One Call and get the matching center before they are gone. Then you wont have to worry about finding one in the future since they are discontinued. The 12's with the CSi5 would be a kick #ss system with room to grow. If youre gonna break the bank go all out.

But the thing is, I am being told that the RTi12's ARE a fine match for my CSi30 center -- that's not the problem. The issue is, as you pointed out, the wallop these speakers need to make them sing, and the fact that I will be powering them with an Onkyo 605, putting out 90 watts per channel. Your point about them being gigantic full range towers makes sense to me -- I'll be crossing them over at some frequency because of my sub, but you got me thinking that these are overkill for my budget and amp...

Still, the folks at the Polk forum are telling me not to worry about mating the 605 with the RTi12's, that they'll be fine as long as they're not running full range, because it will be too much of a strain on the receiver...

 

[anamorphic96]

I should rephrase what I said earlier about the RTi12's. While your Onkyo will be ok at driving the 12's you will not realize their full potential with your current Onkyo. I have heard these speakers before and they sound MUCH BETTER with a dedicated amp.

 

[anamorphic96]

Since they are already set up to be delivered go all out and get the matching center before the are not available. While I agree your current center will work. You can't beat a match front stage. It sounds very seamless.

Like I just said go all out and enjoy. Get the CSi5. Put the 2 channel on hold a for a bit to get the CSi5 if you need to do.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

I should rephrase what I said earlier about the RTi12's. While your Onkyo will be ok at driving the 12's you will not realize their full potential with your current Onkyo. I have heard these speakers before and they sound MUCH BETTER with a dedicated amp.

Originally, you stated this:

Don't even think about the RTi12's unless you have a better receiver or amp. they are power hogs. Your 605 would not be adequate.

Either step down to the TSI 300's or go back online for the RTi8's. Which can be found at One Call for the price you where paying plus shipping. You could even get the matching center to the RTi8's for 249. So for about 700 to 750 plus shipping. You could get 3 new front speakers that are matched. A little more than you wanted to spend. But in the end you will probably save money and have a completely matched front stage.

THAT got me worried, right off the bat...then, you said this:

This begs the question. Why buy such a huge floorstanding speaker for your home theater when you are going to probably cross them over at 80hz. You might want to consider 60hz. Even then the RTi12's are more designed for full range output.

Did you look at One Call. They have the RTi8s and matching center for great prices. You could have purchased all three of these and had a new front stage for less than the RTi12's. You could have then sold the older center to help offset the costs even further. In fact you would have saved 100 maybe even 200 and had a much better set up.

...this lead me to believe that you were very passionate about the possibility that the 12's could NOT, under any circumstances, be driven by a 605...

Are you sure they'll be OK? I understand that once there's an amp upgrade, they will REALLY get to their potential, but will I be OK driving them with the 605 crossed over for now at least?

 

[anamorphic96]

Come on man. Do it.

Do it.


Pull the trigger.

You know you want to.

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Since they are already set up to be delivered go all out and get the matching center before the are not available. While I agree your current center will work. You can't beat a match front stage. It sounds very seamless.

Which center is matched to the RTi12?

Like I just said go all out and enjoy. Get the CSi5. Put the 2 channel on hold a for a bit to get the CSi5 if you need to do.

You mean, put the two channel system that I was planning on hold...the integrated amp and turntable and such?

If so, yes, I was definitely going to have to do this...

 

[PearlcorderS701]

Come on man. Do it.

Do it.


Pull the trigger.

You know you want to.

Seriously, though, what made you change your mind about the advice you were giving me on powering the 12's with the 605? Initially, you were telling me to stay away from them...

 

[anamorphic96]

Originally, you stated this:



THAT got me worried, right off the bat...then, you said this:



...this lead me to believe that you were very passionate about the possibility that the 12's could NOT, under any circumstances, be driven by a 605...

Are you sure they'll be OK? I understand that once there's an amp upgrade, they will REALLY get to their potential, but will I be OK driving them with the 605 crossed over for now at least?

I tend to want to do things right to begin with. Or not do them at all. The 12's are ideally suited with an external amp or higher end receiver. However the Onkyo will do the job to a certain extent. You just wont hear their full potential with the Onkyo.

I kind of jumped the gun earlier so I rephrased what I said. Sometimes words can't express what some is trying to say. I hope this makes sense.

 

[anamorphic96]

I still think you will be better off with a matched front stage. The RTi8's are no slouches either. Or for roughly 960 you could get the 10's instead of the 8's and still get the matched front stage.