Runaway Toyotas. You saw it on this site first!

N

NicolasKL

Full Audioholic
You don't live in CA, do you? Man, there is hatred there of anything GM, Ford, etc. like a mighty tempest.

I routinely deal with those Toyota worshipers on Priuschat that think Toyota can do no wrong, either. Owning a Prius with rattles and a busted air conditioning system at 40k miles tells me otherwise. Now, at 60k the Xenon HID headlamps are blinking to the point that Toyota halved the cost (rather than replaced them for free) of the replacement bulbs. The hybrid system may last to 100k. However, I wonder about the rest of the car.

Every GM car I owned had an air conditioning system that lasted well past 40k. (I replaced the one on my Grand Am at 160k.)



I agree that it's likely a combination of software and hardware. Of course, they won't mention the software part. That means they can shift more of the blame to the 3rd party supplier.
A GM owner is chiding Toyota about interior rattles? Really? :confused:
 
billy p

billy p

Audioholic Ninja
Even with all the fuss(Camry owner)I still opted to decline Fords & GM's offer and I WOULD never travel down that road again!
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Since you posted that you own a Toyota- does yours have the proximity sensor and push-button start? If so, is it possible to kill the motor without leaving the vehicle?
Yes it is. When you are stopped you just press the button. However for emergency stop you have to hold the odd button for three seconds. Individuals who have tried this say that the 3 second hold does not work. However in a panic 3 sec sounds like a long time. Under controlled conditions I have confirmed the three second hold does work

The next issue is the neutral shift. I can not find out if there is a mechanical connection between the shift leaver and the transmission. I suspect there is not, especially in the hybrids that have a continuously variable transmission. The shifting on pretty much all Toyotas since 2002 has been elecro solenoid.

The transmission has its own control module, which is typical of most vehicles now. There is tremendous interaction between the ECM module and the transmission module.

I found one solitary report of a Toyota owner with unwanted acceleration that claimed the car did not shift into neutral. However the situation self corrected and then the vehicle was fine.

There seem to be quite a few reports of this where there is acceleration and the problem self corrects before a tragedy. One thing all these reports have in common is that there are no OBD fault codes left of the incidents, and so dealers claim the vehicles are fine.

So that means either driver error, a sensor or sensors sending wrong but credible signals that the ECM does not recognize as error signals. The third possibility is that under the wrong set of unknown circumstances the software can lock up.

So Toyota may genuinely not know what is at the bottom of all this, and may not be able to find out without dumb luck if their accelerator fix does not work. Personally I doubt it will. For one thing there are credible reports of this involving quite a few Prius vehicles that are not on the recall list and do not contain that part.

I think the auto has now got so complex and dependent on microprocessors and software for vital functions, a black box needs to be mandated so there is a record of everything that took place. If we had this I doubt there would be any speculation, doubt and and anxiety about this problem at this stage.
 
Djizasse

Djizasse

Senior Audioholic
This is scary stuff. I'm glad my car has a throttle cable and the steering and gearing is all mechanical, none of those "drive by wire" stuff.

In Europe, the Citroen C1, the Peugeot 107 and the Toyota Aygo (along with the Yaris, Corolla, iQ, Auris, Verso, Avensis and RAV4 ) were also recalled. I heard that it's a problem with some accelerator part made in a Czech Republic plant.
 
N

NicolasKL

Full Audioholic
There's no rattles in my GM. Really.
What year and mileage is it? I've yet to be in a GM that wasn't a rattletrap by 60,000 miles or so, but maybe they're doing better more recently.
 
Matt34

Matt34

Moderator
This reminds me of a few years ago when my wife and I had a 1998 Ford Taurus SHO. The throttle positioning sensor failed on us three times and the car would rev up to 6000-7000rpm when in park after getting to operating temperature. Luckily for us it never did this while we were actually driving it. It was a happy day when we sold that car.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
Yes it is. When you are stopped you just press the button. However for emergency stop you have to hold the odd button for three seconds. Individuals who have tried this say that the 3 second hold does not work. However in a panic 3 sec sounds like a long time. Under controlled conditions I have confirmed the three second hold does work

The next issue is the neutral shift. I can not find out if there is a mechanical connection between the shift leaver and the transmission. I suspect there is not, especially in the hybrids that have a continuously variable transmission. The shifting on pretty much all Toyotas since 2002 has been elecro solenoid.

The transmission has its own control module, which is typical of most vehicles now. There is tremendous interaction between the ECM module and the transmission module.

I found one solitary report of a Toyota owner with unwanted acceleration that claimed the car did not shift into neutral. However the situation self corrected and then the vehicle was fine.

There seem to be quite a few reports of this where there is acceleration and the problem self corrects before a tragedy. One thing all these reports have in common is that there are no OBD fault codes left of the incidents, and so dealers claim the vehicles are fine.

So that means either driver error, a sensor or sensors sending wrong but credible signals that the ECM does not recognize as error signals. The third possibility is that under the wrong set of unknown circumstances the software can lock up.

So Toyota may genuinely not know what is at the bottom of all this, and may not be able to find out without dumb luck if their accelerator fix does not work. Personally I doubt it will. For one thing there are credible reports of this involving quite a few Prius vehicles that are not on the recall list and do not contain that part.

I think the auto has now got so complex and dependent on microprocessors and software for vital functions, a black box needs to be mandated so there is a record of everything that took place. If we had this I doubt there would be any speculation, doubt and and anxiety about this problem at this stage.
I think all cars are required to have a brake pedal lockout for shifting, partly due to the Audi 4000 incidents.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
What year and mileage is it? I've yet to be in a GM that wasn't a rattletrap by 60,000 miles or so, but maybe they're doing better more recently.
Seriously you gotta get better friends or driver smoother streets. :D

I've never been in a rattling Camaro. :p
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
This reminds me of a few years ago when my wife and I had a 1998 Ford Taurus SHO. The throttle positioning sensor failed on us three times and the car would rev up to 6000-7000rpm when in park after getting to operating temperature. Luckily for us it never did this while we were actually driving it. It was a happy day when we sold that car.
I hated the 90s Taurus.
 
Davemcc

Davemcc

Audioholic Spartan
What year and mileage is it? I've yet to be in a GM that wasn't a rattletrap by 60,000 miles or so, but maybe they're doing better more recently.
It's an 08 Corvette with 18K kms. It had a little squeak in the Targa roof when it was new, but a little shot of spray silicone silenced that and it's never come back.

Even my 02 Camaro did not develop any squeaks or rattles the whole time I owned it and that car had T-tops.
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
It's an 08 Corvette with 18K kms. It had a little squeak in the Targa roof when it was new, but a little shot of spray silicone silenced that and it's never come back.

Even my 02 Camaro did not develop any squeaks or rattles the whole time I owned it and that car had T-tops.
T-Tops in Canada? Isn't it cold up there.
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top