Two receivers for HT and stereo sound

[ahblaza]

Hello All,
I would like to use two receivers integrated into a HT and two channel stereo setup. I will try to explain my intentions taking into account my ignorance of subject matter and humbly accept your advise. I have near mint, low usage receivers, Onkyo TX-SR702 and Pioneer VSX-DS1. I would like to use the Onkyo to drive center, rears and sub., and the Pioneer to drive mains. The 702 has five channel pre-outs, would I use the R&L front main outs to the VSX? How and where on the Pioineer rear panel do I input these two pre-outs from the 702. I understand a pre-out to be the equivilent of a line level source, correct me if I'm wrong! I noticed on rear of Pioneer two bridged inputs..pre-out and power in, does this mean the VSX can be used as a preamp and or second amp? I will complicate this fiasco even further, I would like to connect a turntable and CD player to use with VSX for two channel stereo since I'm hoping only to use the two front channel amps in the Pioneer. Please advise on the feasibility of this endeavor. If this can be done I'm sure setup menu will be another discussion. Thank you so much for listening, I look forward to your reply.
Best regards.....

 

[Adam]

Welcome to the forum, Jeff!

I'll look into that and get back to you.

 

[ahblaza]

Thanks Adam for the welcome and your taking the time to read my post.
Best regards....Jeff

 

[Adam]

Jeff, I can't find any good info on the VSX-DS1. Do you have any links to a manual, pictures of the back panel, or other info?

Thanks.

 

[ahblaza]

Adam,
I do have the manual, on the back of unit there are pre amp out jacks and power in jacks, the two pair of jacks have jumpers or connector bars in them. Manual says to remove the bars and use the power amp in jacks if the unit is to be used as the power amplifier for front, center or rear channels, also says with separate surround processing components, each corresponding channel (front, center, rear) which has a sound output should be connected correspondingly. Here is a side note: When the connector bars are removed to make connections, sound from all channels of separate components connected to this unit's inputs terminals, as well as broadcasts received by the unit become unable to be heard via speakers connected to the unit. I guess this means if I remove those bars and use the unit's power amp inputs, I can't connect my TT or Cd player to this unit, I would have to use the 702 for any source components, and I could connect my mains to the Pioneer speaker terminals. Adam what about not using those pre amp power in jacks and leaving the connecting bars in place and connecting the the two preouts from the 702 into a line input on the Pioneer and selecting that input on the VSX. This is so confusing, I'll try and send you a Photo of rear of VSX. Thanks again so much.
Jeff

 

[Midcow2]

An Answer

Hello All,
I would like to use two receivers integrated into a HT and two channel stereo setup. I will try to explain my intentions taking into account my ignorance of subject matter and humbly accept your advise. I have near mint, low usage receivers, Onkyo TX-SR702 and Pioneer VSX-DS1. I would like to use the Onkyo to drive center, rears and sub., and the Pioneer to drive mains. The 702 has five channel pre-outs, would I use the R&L front main outs to the VSX? How and where on the Pioineer rear panel do I input these two pre-outs from the 702. I understand a pre-out to be the equivilent of a line level source, correct me if I'm wrong! I noticed on rear of Pioneer two bridged inputs..pre-out and power in, does this mean the VSX can be used as a preamp and or second amp? I will complicate this fiasco even further, I would like to connect a turntable and CD player to use with VSX for two channel stereo since I'm hoping only to use the two front channel amps in the Pioneer. Please advise on the feasibility of this endeavor. If this can be done I'm sure setup menu will be another discussion. Thank you so much for listening, I look forward to your reply.
Best regards.....

Ahblaza,

Welcome to the forum. Assumming what you have stated is true for your Onkyo and Pioneer you can easily do what you want. On the Onkyo leave the pre-outs to main for the channels you want to drive with the Onkyo: center, rears and sub. Connect your center, rears and sub speakers to the Onkyo. Disconnect the pre-out bridges on the Onkyo for the L/R fronts. On the Pioneer disconnect the two bridged inputs from pre-out to power-in. Connect the L/R Preouts from the Onkyo to your Pioneer L/R Power-in and connected your front speakers to the Pioneer.

The result is you are using the Onkyo as your preprocessor and also to provide amps for your rears, center and sub. You are not using any of the pioneer features and are only using it a power amp for your fronts.

It should work fine, good luck and let us know.

MidCow2

 

[Adam]

Jeff,

We can get you set up the way that you are asking, but perhaps we should first discuss if it's going to give you what you want. A reason to use the Pioneer to amp the front speakers when you listen to 5.1 sources is if the Onkyo doesn't have enough power for all five channels and sounds strained. You can run a two-channel/five-channel set up the way that you asked, but you can do it a different way, too. Let me explain some of my thinking.

Two-Channel on Pioneer Only, Five-Channel using Both
Working around the jumpers between the pre-amp outputs and power inputs on the Pioneer wouldn't be too difficult. A switch box used for RCA connections is what comes to mind to me. You'd connect the pre-amp outputs from the Pioneer to an input on the switch box, connect the pre-amp outputs from the Onkyo to an input on the switch box, and then connect the outputs from the box to the power inputs on the Pioneer. You could then push a button on the box to select between having the Pioneer get it's signal from the Onkyo or from itself.

If you want to listen to CDs and records through the Pioneer, then you'll be using the volume control on the Pioneer to adjust how loud the music is. If you then want to listen to a movie, you'll need to reset the volume on the Pioneer (to a level that you've determined through calibration) so that it acts simply as an amp for the Onkyo. The volume setting when acting like an amp will probably be significantly higher than the setting used for either CDs or records, so you would want to be careful to not switch over to listen to music on the Pioneer without turning the volume down. Certainly possible, but the opportunity exists to forget and blast the music.

Two-Channel on Pioneer Only, Five-Channel on Onkyo Only
The other option that I was thinking about is to use the Onkyo for movies and the Pioneer for music, but not to always use the Pioneer for the front speakers. You could run the CD player and TT through the Pioneer, and you would connect your front speakers to both the Pioneer and the Onkyo. This solution, however, would benefit greatly from you getting a speaker switch box - you would connect the Pioneer and Onkyo front speaker terminals to the box, and then connect the front speakers to the box. You would then push a button on the box to switch between having the speakers connected to the Pioneer or to the Onkyo.

EDIT: I started typing this while I was downloading the 702 manual and forgot to read it before finishing. The 702 does have a phono input (I wasn't sure), so you can use it as the preprocessor for everything (like you and MidCow2 mentioned). So, just consider what I said above as other options.

 

[ahblaza]

Thanks guys,
I just wanted to mention the Onkyo has no bridged pre-outs or inputs. It has separate multi channel inputs as well as multi channel outs (7.1). I don't know how this will impact your suggestions and advice, which I so much appreciate. My original plan was to leave the center and rear speakers connected to Onkyo and run two interconnects from the front L&R pre-outs of the Onkyo's multi-outs to the Pioneer some how and connect mains to front speaker terminals of the Pioneer. Also connect TT and CD player to Pioneer for two channel stereo only, I believe the phono stage is a little better than the Onkyo and has more power with only two channels driven. I think by doing this I don't have to power up Onkyo at all to listen to music. With movies I would need both, correct? I like the idea of a speaker switching box, but would this degrade the signal with all the different connections as opposed to direct speaker hookup? I'm sorry for all this rambling on, I realize and respect your time and I don't want to be selfish by taking all of it. I should just use the Onkyo for all of my surround sound and movie watching, which really does'nt seem to get strained at higher listening volumes, hook up my TT and CD player to Pioneer and just run another set of speaker wire from Pioneer and interchange wires at mains according to which receiver is used. What do you think, my ears are open. Again my friends, THANKS SO MUCH...Jeff

 

[Adam]

Hey, John. You can certainly just disconnect the front speakers from one receiver and then connect them to the other one when you want to go from surround sound to stereo listening, and vice versa. I mentioned the speaker source selector box because that would make it easier for you. Those do cost money, though.

If you don't mind resetting the volume on the Pioneer and want to power your fronts from the Pioneer all of the time, you can go the route of having a selector box for RCA inputs (like I mentioned above).

I think that we (including yourself) have covered the main options. You have a number of choices, and it'll just come down to what you prefer doing. I'd sure be interested in finding out what you end up doing, if you'd be willing to write us back and let us know. Thanks!

 

[ahblaza]

I kind of like the RCA selector switch box, but I don't know what they are, your explanation of how to use it seems pretty straight forward and seems to make the most sense, could you direct me towards one of these RCA selector boxes? I do believe we have covered all options here and I am truly grateful to AH and people like yourself who go out of their way to help those like myself to get a better grasp of the wonders of this rewarding experience of audio and video. I would be honered to stay in touch with you and share my experiences and decisions, you have opened many avenues of thought regarding my choices, of which again I am thankful. I have one more crazy thought, I saw a real good deal on a Nad T955 five channel amp, I could use the Onkyo as a pre/pro until I could afford a decent separate pre/pro. Any thoughts on that, or should I just work with what I have.
Most sincerely, Jeff

 

[Adam]

Jeff, you're very kind in your thanks. We're happy to help when we can!

Regarding RCA switch boxes, I'm a bit annoyed that I can't find what I'm looking for - but linked here is a component video/audio switch box with a remote control for $23 + shipping. What I'm looking for is one that just does the audio part, so might be cheaper. There are a number of other products like that out there. Monoprice is a good place to get quality products for good prices, so I looked there first. Amazon also has a few options.

As for getting the amp, that's totally up to you! I ended up getting a couple of amps for my system. You mentioned that the Onkyo doesn't sound strained at high volume, so I don't know how much that NAD will get you - but there's nothing wrong with scratching that upgrade itch. Well, except for debt.

 

[ahblaza]

Hello Adam,
I did not know you responded to my last post until right now, newbie that I am I did not realize that there was more than one page to my original thread, I'm sorry my friend I would have gotten back sooner. I have also been looking for the RCA switcher, but all I'm finding are multiple inputs and outputs, both audio and video, I will try the sites you mentioned and hopefully I can find an audio only one. Yes I do have that upgrade itch since the recent purchase of a plasma panel and digging my Sota Sapphire 111 table out of storage after fifteen years, I bought it new in 1986 and just set it all back up, balanced and remounted arm and new cart, belt, lubed etc., looks and operates like the day I bought it, it's the only remnant of my audiophilia days, I go back awhile my friend and this HT thing both confuses and intriques at the same time. My goal is to integrate a HT system with two channel stereo, so yes I do have an itch. Getting to know people like you just makes this all seem so worthwhile and and extremely itchy. Speaking of the Nad I really don't think it would be much of an improvement over what I have, I just like the idea of separates, old school I guess. I noticed you have Emotiva, I was also looking at their 2,3 and 5 channel amps, a lot of power per dollar ratio, whats your take on these or is this a touchy subject? I've rambled on enough, a pleasure as always Adam. Best regards...Jeff