Young people and Cancer

[Matt34]

There have been three people in the past year that I know personally that are/have fought this terrible disease and all of them are under 30 years old. In every case it was very aggressive in which one had of them just passed away two months ago after fighting it for just over a year. My friend Mike S. probably doesn't have much longer to go either as his situation has gone down hill very quickly the past couple days (I deployed to Iraq with him in 2006-2007). The other is a 24yr old single mom that is looking to lose one of her legs to stop it from spreading.

I have heard talks that this area is unusually high for cancer cases and above the national average. I'm going to start doing some research on that but this is some very scary stuff.

 

[jostenmeat]

I have heard talks that this area is unusually high for cancer cases and above the national average. I'm going to start doing some research on that but this is some very scary stuff.

I'm sorry Matt.

That is a scary thought. Many years ago I read "A Civil Action". It's also a movie that I never cared to see because I thought there is no way in hell anyone could do it justice. I may check it out eventually. Anyways, ever since I've read it, I refuse to drink tap water.

The stuff that Beatrice and/or Grace International was dumping actually absorbs faster thru the skin (read: shower) than if you drank it. Nasty stuff, like TCE, etc. Degreases the myelin sheath around your nerves for instance. Girl wakes up, but this time as a parapligic. The people in this area of Mass were using Tang, etc, to mix with the tap water since it tasted so bad.

The mother who was first paranoid about something going on found patterns according to where persons lived. The doctors, everyone, just figured she was nuts, or at least figured that it was very common for a bereaved mother to find some sort of hare brained reason. She was right.

Beatrice used Harvard Law's top professor, never lost a case in his life. He would train his students essentially to fight over everything, anything, ruin the opposition's train of thought, etc. If you wake up from falling asleep in the courtroom, the first thing you do is stand up, and say "I object", even if you have no idea what's going on.

Grace Int Chemical Co used a preeminent expert in killing cases pre-trial. That failed, but I think they came out unscathed at the end.

Beatrice, of course, was off the hook. The EPA (and/or USGS?), analyzed and investigated. It was the largest toxic cleanup, and still is I believe, in northeastern US history. They made Beatrice pay up a nice sum. Beatrice said it's proven in court they are guilt free. Federal govt said, we don't a ****, you are paying something. Of course, even that sum was a slap on the hand compared to what could've happened.

Anyways, I do hear weird theories from various places around the world. I know at least a while ago, in CT, some said if you want to have a baby, not to drink the tap water for 5 years prior. You go jogging, your eyes tear up in the summer. It's all the odorless toxic chemicals from NYC that naturally go up the coast.

in Mexico City, there were, if not still, over a million stray dogs. Their feces mixes with the air, into this airborne terrible stuff, but people were wondering why they weren't dropping like flies. Some think the spicier foods help them.

Anyways, I highly recommend the book. Extremely engrossing. I think I finished it in barely over a day. It wasn't found in the literature section, but actually in the law section.

*end of wandering banter*

 

[Swerd]

There have been three people in the past year that I know personally that are/have fought this terrible disease and all of them are under 30 years old. In every case it was very aggressive in which one had of them just passed away two months ago after fighting it for just over a year. My friend Mike S. probably doesn't have much longer to go either as his situation has gone down hill very quickly the past couple days (I deployed to Iraq with him in 2006-2007). The other is a 24yr old single mom that is looking to lose one of her legs to stop it from spreading.

I have heard talks that this area is unusually high for cancer cases and above the national average. I'm going to start doing some research on that but this is some very scary stuff.

Matt

I'm truly sorry to hear about your friends. No one, young or old should have suffer through what they have been.

The trouble with the "areas with unusually high rates of cancer" line of thinking is that cancer is not a single disease. There are, I believe, at least 84 different types of cancer now recognized. So, when you talk about unusually high rates of cancer, I have to ask, what types of cancer? It is easy to generalize too much about cancer.

Effective cancer treatments, when we know of one, vary greatly depending on the type of cancer. And we only know or suspect the causes for a very few types of cancer. The single best thing we can do is early diagnosis, which probably was not the case for the friends you mentioned. Who seriously looks for rare cancers in young adults?

Searching the internet to learn something about cancer can be overwhelming, and in some cases, full of misinformation. I recommend you start with the National Cancer Institute, and WebMD Cancer Health Center. You may not find answers for all the questions you have, but at least you won't be reading medical snake oil.

I'll be glad to try to answer any questions you may have.

 

[speakerman39]

Matt, I too am very sorry to hear about your beloved friend. My Mom is battling cancer of the lung right now as we speak. She has made it through radiation treatments, but can't seem to handle the chemo. The sad part is, she underwent surgery to remove the mass, but it was too large to do so. We all know what that means if she can't handle the chemo treatments as radiation alone has not been enough to eradicate it. To be honest, I am scared to death for her. Been trying to spend as much time with her as I can. I will, however, keep all of you in my prayers. Perhaps one day, the good Lord will give mankind the tools needed to do away this horrible disease.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[TLS Guy]

There have been three people in the past year that I know personally that are/have fought this terrible disease and all of them are under 30 years old. In every case it was very aggressive in which one had of them just passed away two months ago after fighting it for just over a year. My friend Mike S. probably doesn't have much longer to go either as his situation has gone down hill very quickly the past couple days (I deployed to Iraq with him in 2006-2007). The other is a 24yr old single mom that is looking to lose one of her legs to stop it from spreading.

I have heard talks that this area is unusually high for cancer cases and above the national average. I'm going to start doing some research on that but this is some very scary stuff.

I think your knowledge of these unfortunate and tragic cases is by chance.

I have looked at the American Cancer Society data and especially data from the Arizona state health department.

As a whole the incidence of Cancer in Arizona is below the national average, especially for males, and slightly less for females.

The only counties that have an incidence of Cancer in Arizona that approach the national average, are Maricopa and Puma counties, but even they are slightly below the national average.

Maricopa county does appear to have a slightly increased incidence of child hood leukemia. An extensive epidemiological study was done some years ago in that county, because of a gas tank farm there. However no correlation with proximity could be found, though there was interestingly a correlation with parental smoking.

Matt, you have to understand cancer occurs at all ages, including infants in the womb. The incidence of malignant tumors rises with age, and the greatest risk factor for cancer is age.

However there are quite a few particularly unpleasant solid tumors, bone marrow and lymphatic malignancies that are confined to the young.

As far as tumor types, it runs into the thousands, there are around 400 types of lymphoma alone.

I am posting this less there are any other members from Arizona that might be alarmed. They can be reassured that Arizona is below the mean.

 

[Matt34]

I think your knowledge of these unfortunate and tragic cases is by chance.

I have looked at the American Cancer Society data and especially data from the Arizona state health department.

As a whole the incidence of Cancer in Arizona is below the national average, especially for males, and slightly less for females.

The only counties that have an incidence of Cancer in Arizona that approach the national average, are Maricopa and Puma counties, but even they are slightly below the national average.

Maricopa county does appear to have a slightly increased incidence of child hood leukemia. An extensive epidemiological study was done some years ago in that county, because of a gas tank farm there. However no correlation with proximity could be found, though there was interestingly a correlation with parental smoking.

Matt, you have to understand cancer occurs at all ages, including infants in the womb. The incidence of malignant tumors rises with age, and the greatest risk factor for cancer is age.

However there are quite a few particularly unpleasant solid tumors, bone marrow and lymphatic malignancies that are confined to the young.

As far as tumor types, it runs into the thousands, there are around 400 types of lymphoma alone.

I am posting this less there are any other members from Arizona that might be alarmed. They can be reassured that Arizona is below the mean.

Maybe so but it is strange to have three younger folks that I personally know all get this disease within a year.

There was a leukemia spike among children here a few years ago that I remember reading about but no definitive link was every made to the cause of it.

http://www.tucsonweekly.com/gbase/Currents/Content?oid=oid:60589

 

[TLS Guy]

Maybe so but it is strange to have three younger folks that I personally know all get this disease within a year.

There was a leukemia spike among children here a few years ago that I remember reading about but no definitive link was every made to the cause of it.

http://www.tucsonweekly.com/gbase/Currents/Content?oid=oid:60589

Unfortunately that sort of article has no medical or scientific validity and only scares and misinforms the public. That sort of article gets us nowhere.

Cancer unfortunately is not a rare disease even in the young.

I can match you in my experience outside of my medical practice. A couple very close to us had there 18 month old son develop a malignant tumor of the brain stem, that is pretty much confined to that age group. He has done reasonable well following surgery and radiation, but has a shunt and developmental problems.

The 30 year old son of one of my nurses who worked for me for nearly 30 years, has recently developed an osteo sarcoma of a vertebra in the neck. He has had limited surgery and is undergoing very aggressive chemotherapy.

The 20 year old son of our ICU director recently developed a squamous cell cancer of the mouth at an unusually young age. Unfortunately his tumor has been very aggressive and his prognosis is poor. However all these cases alone, and in isolation, do not further the study of the issue of cancer incidence, or cause. They are isolted unfortunate cases.

The light of day is shed on the broader issues by careful scientific work, both on the bench, clinically at the bedside and careful epidemiological studies, based on rigorous statistical data. Anything else is anecdotal, of which there is far too much in the public media. It only serves to harm the public. Just look at the nonsense over vaccines and autism. That sort of thing distracts resources and personel from issues more worthy of study.

I was impressed by what I found on the website of your state health department. It looks as if they have careful thorough personel, and that should be the first place you should look to get answers to your concerns.

 

[speakerman39]

Interestingly, according to my family doc Kentucky has some of the highest rates of Cancer in the nation. Most of which is due to smoking. This is a dreadful disease that needs to be eradicated. Some day we will do just that as many advances are taking place every day. Sooner or later a cure is bound to be found as it is just a matter of time. As with anything, funding is also essential to finding a cure. Therefore, please support you local cancer society. You can help to make a difference.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[TLS Guy]

Interestingly, according to my family doc Kentucky has some of the highest rates of Cancer in the nation. Most of which is due to smoking. This is a dreadful disease that needs to be eradicated. Some day we will do just that as many advances are taking place every day. Sooner or later a cure is bound to be found as it is just a matter of time. As with anything, funding is also essential to finding a cure. Therefore, please support you local cancer society. You can help to make a difference.

Cheers,

Phil

Yes he is right! Your state has the highest lung cancer rate of any state, and the highest cancer rate overall for the lower 48. Your colon cancer incidence is also worryingly high. The only areas were it is not high is breast cancer. This latter may reflect that it is a state with a high poverty index and hormone replacement therapy was not as widely available as other states.

I was not impressed with the site of your State Health Council. As far as I can tell you do not have a proper state health department, but a political image department, and a not very informative web site. They do however get good marks for data reporting to national data banks.

I think you need a vigorous state smoking cessation program. You need to stop smoking in all public places including bars if you haven't already.

You are right, cancer and especially lung cancer is grim, however it is one of the most preventable of cancers, that is the good news.

It is very sad you are having to go through this with your mother.

 

[majorloser]

I have lost too many close friends and family to cancer. Last week a good friend's wife died of breast cancer. She was in her mid 30's.

 

[speakerman39]

Yes he is right! Your state has the highest lung cancer rate of any state, and the highest cancer rate overall for the lower 48. Your colon cancer incidence is also worryingly high. The only areas were it is not high is breast cancer. This latter may reflect that it is a state with a high poverty index and hormone replacement therapy was not as widely available as other states.

I was not impressed with the site of your State Health Council. As far as I can tell you do not have a proper state health department, but a political image department, and a not very informative web site. They do however get good marks for data reporting to national data banks.

I think you need a vigorous state smoking cessation program. You need to stop smoking in all public places including bars if you haven't already.

You are right, cancer and especially lung cancer is grim, however it is one of the most preventable of cancers, that is the good news.

It is very sad you are having to go through this with your mother.

Yeah, Kentucky has many problems. Just recently a large winter storm merely crippled my state. I was fortunate enough to only lose my power for about 24-hours. Many are still w/o power even today. As such, I am forever grateful to all of the people from out of state that has come to Kentucky to help restore power. Kudos to all of you!!! Lastly, thank you for your kind words regarding my Mother. To be honest, I am scared to death for her. She is hanging in there though as my Mom has never been a quitter.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[speakerman39]

I have lost too many close friends and family to cancer. Last week a good friend's wife died of breast cancer. She was in her mid 30's.

Oh bummer. She was way too young to die. I will, however, say a prayer for her and her family. I am also very sorry you have had to deal with this as well. Perhaps, one day the good Lord will give us the tools needed to put a stop to this very dreadful disease. I will also keep you in my prayers.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[majorloser]

Oh bummer. She was way too young to die. I will, however, say a prayer for her and her family. I am also very sorry you have had to deal with this as well. Perhaps, one day the good Lord will give us the tools needed to put a stop to this very dreadful disease. I will also keep you in my prayers.

Cheers,

Phil

I feel for my friend. He now has a 5 year old daughter to raise by himself.

 

[speakerman39]

I feel for my friend. He now has a 5 year old daughter to raise by himself.

I feel for him too. The same holds true for his 5-year old daughter. One way to remember your close friend is to look after her. Kind of like an Uncle. I wouldn't doubt that you are already planning on doing so. Just thought I would mention it. Once again, I will keep all of you in my prayers.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[Tomorrow]

I am posting this less there are any other members from Arizona that might be alarmed. They can be reassured that Arizona is below the mean.

I apologize that I don't have the time right now to find links to the following...perhaps later when I get back home...

Maricopa and Puma counties (and others in AZ and NV linked by prevailing wind patterns) had, over the last few decades, a much higher incidence of a variety of cancers, including many forms of leukemia. There is, in fact, a trail of such cancers documented in testimony involving lawsuits against the U.S. Government and the downwind release of tons of nuclear material from top secret nuclear weapons testing in Nevada. Thank you, U.S. Gov't. Virtually all of my wife's family, raised in Phoenix, has died of some form of cancer (not that that is in any way statically meaningful).

I don't think it applies to the Sierra Vista area, though, Matt.

 

[TLS Guy]

I apologize that I don't have the time right now to find links to the following...perhaps later when I get back home...

Maricopa and Puma counties (and others in AZ and NV linked by prevailing wind patterns) had, over the last few decades, a much higher incidence of a variety of cancers, including many forms of leukemia. There is, in fact, a trail of such cancers documented in testimony involving lawsuits against the U.S. Government and the downwind release of tons of nuclear material from top secret nuclear weapons testing in Nevada. Thank you, U.S. Gov't. Virtually all of my wife's family, raised in Phoenix, has died of some form of cancer (not that that is in any way statically meaningful).

I don't think it applies to the Sierra Vista area, though, Matt.

I can find no credible data to back up what you are saying. Lawsuits are not credible data. Maricopa county still has cancer rates a little below the national average, but higher than the rest of Arizona, but not by much.

There was a good survey on health status in Maricopa county from 2001.

 

[Tomorrow]

I can find no credible data to back up what you are saying. Lawsuits are not credible data. Maricopa county still has cancer rates a little below the national average, but higher than the rest of Arizona, but not by much.

There was a good survey on health status in Maricopa county from 2001.

Careful reading is important. I didn't say that the lawsuit was credible data. I said documentation resided within the lawsuits. I agree, currently Maracopa is only slightly above the national average, but again, I was referring to the last several decades.

I still don't have much time to go hunting up links, but here are a couple to start with:
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/i-131/nci-reports (for a series of NCI reports)

http://www.state.nv.us/nucwaste/yucca/impactreport.pdf

This is an interesting article...check out the bibliography ... http://www.yuccamountain.org/julie.htm which includes the Federal Compensation Bill information to "downwinders".

That cancer clusters occurred as a result of the NTS nuclear detonations is fact and is no longer an issue of debate. Compensation has already been awarded to thousands of families in the NTS downwind counties.

EDIT...TLS Guy, I apologize for not coming up with the actual maps and lawsuit(s) documentation. Some of this data is quite old and I am strapped for time. As I get some, I'll try to find the original presentation for you...and the interesting results!!

 

[Tomorrow]

I just clipped this from the USDOJ website. It does not include Maricopa County, I believe because of the enormous cost involved in compensating that large population. Some counties were accidentally or purposely left off the original (since modified) compensation bill.

"Downwinders. A payment of $50,000 is available to an eligible individual who was physically present in one of the affected areas downwind of the Nevada Test Site during a period of atmospheric nuclear testing, and later contracted a specified compensable disease.

A. Exposure. The claimant must have lived or worked downwind of atmospheric nuclear tests in certain counties in Utah, Nevada and Arizona for a period of at least two years during the period beginning on January 21, 1951, and ending on October 31, 1958, or, for the period beginning on June 30, 1962, and ending on July 31, 1962. The designated affected areas are: in the State of Utah, the counties of Beaver, Garfield, Iron, Kane, Millard, Piute, San Juan, Sevier, Washington, and Wayne; in the State of Nevada, the counties of Eureka, Lander, Lincoln, Nye, White Pine, and that portion of Clark County that consists of townships 13 through 16 at ranges 63 through 71; and in the State of Arizona, the counties of Apache, Coconino, Gila, Navajo, Yavapai, and that part of Arizona that is north of the Grand Canyon.

B. Disease. After such period of physical presence, the claimant contracted one of the following specified diseases: leukemia (other than chronic lymphocytic leukemia), multiple myeloma, lymphomas (other than Hodgkin's disease), and primary cancer of the thyroid, male or female breast, esophagus, stomach, pharynx, small intestine, pancreas, bile ducts, gall bladder, salivary gland, urinary bladder, brain, colon, ovary, or liver (except if cirrhosis or hepatitis B is indicated), or lung."

Here is the cancer compensation figures as of yesterday...totaling $1,379,000,000:
http://www.usdoj.gov/civil/omp/omi/Tre_SysClaimsToDateSum.pdf

 

[TLS Guy]

I just clipped this from the USDOJ website. It does not include Maricopa County, I believe because of the enormous cost involved in compensating that large population. Some counties were accidentally or purposely left off the original (since modified) compensation bill.

"Downwinders. A payment of $50,000 is available to an eligible individual who was physically present in one of the affected areas downwind of the Nevada Test Site during a period of atmospheric nuclear testing, and later contracted a specified compensable disease.

A. Exposure. The claimant must have lived or worked downwind of atmospheric nuclear tests in certain counties in Utah, Nevada and Arizona for a period of at least two years during the period beginning on January 21, 1951, and ending on October 31, 1958, or, for the period beginning on June 30, 1962, and ending on July 31, 1962. The designated affected areas are: in the State of Utah, the counties of Beaver, Garfield, Iron, Kane, Millard, Piute, San Juan, Sevier, Washington, and Wayne; in the State of Nevada, the counties of Eureka, Lander, Lincoln, Nye, White Pine, and that portion of Clark County that consists of townships 13 through 16 at ranges 63 through 71; and in the State of Arizona, the counties of Apache, Coconino, Gila, Navajo, Yavapai, and that part of Arizona that is north of the Grand Canyon.

B. Disease. After such period of physical presence, the claimant contracted one of the following specified diseases: leukemia (other than chronic lymphocytic leukemia), multiple myeloma, lymphomas (other than Hodgkin's disease), and primary cancer of the thyroid, male or female breast, esophagus, stomach, pharynx, small intestine, pancreas, bile ducts, gall bladder, salivary gland, urinary bladder, brain, colon, ovary, or liver (except if cirrhosis or hepatitis B is indicated), or lung."

Here is the cancer compensation figures as of yesterday...totaling $1,379,000,000:
http://www.usdoj.gov/civil/omp/omi/Tre_SysClaimsToDateSum.pdf

There may have been payouts, however I don't think there is data proving cause and effect in most cases. In fact the low cancer rate for Arizona speaks against it.

There is however a known relationship to thyroid cancer from I131 fall out.

There is an issue with Strontium 90, however it requires a local dairy industry. I do not remember seeing dairy herds in Arizona, but I'm prepared to be corrected about that. The issue is that if cattle feeds on pastures that have fall out from strontium 90, it is concentrated in the milk. Strontium 90 is then taken up in the bones of individuals who drink the milk. The result is an increase in the incidence of malignant blood dyscrasias in the affected communities.

Form the careful study done Maricopa county, I would doubt that situation occurred, or if it did its effect was at a very low level.

 

[Tomorrow]

There may have been payouts, however I don't think there is data proving cause and effect in most cases. In fact the low cancer rate for Arizona speaks against it.

There is however a known relationship to thyroid cancer from I131 fall out.

There is an issue with Strontium 90, however it requires a local dairy industry. I do not remember seeing dairy herds in Arizona, but I'm prepared to be corrected about that. The issue is that if cattle feeds on pastures that have fall out from strontium 90, it is concentrated in the milk. Strontium 90 is then taken up in the bones of individuals who drink the milk. The result is an increase in the incidence of malignant blood dyscrasias in the affected communities.

Form the careful study done Maricopa county, I would doubt that situation occurred, or if it did its effect was at a very low level.

Will this do? http://www.americanscientist.org/issues/feature/fallout-from-nuclear-weapons-tests-and-cancer-risks/6

"Investigators at the University of Utah estimated radiation doses to the bone marrow for 6,507 leukemia cases and matched controls who were residents of Utah. Average doses were about 0.003 Gy with a maximum of about 0.03 Gy. Subsequently, thyroid doses were estimated to members of a cohort exposed as school children in southwestern Utah and who are part of a long-term epidemiology study. The mean thyroid dose was estimated to be 0.12 Gy, with a maximum of 1.4 Gy. Among children who did not drink milk, the mean thyroid dose was on the order of 0.01 Gy.

In response to Public Law 97-414 (enacted in 1993), the U.S. National Cancer Institute (NCI) estimated the absorbed dose to the thyroid from I-131 in NTS fallout for representative individuals in every county of the contiguous United States. Calculations emphasized the pasture-cow-milk-man food chain, but also included inhalation of fallout and ingestion of other foods. Deposition of I-131 across the United States was reconstructed for every significant event at the NTS using historical measurements of fallout from a nationwide network of monitoring stations operational between 1951 and 1958. Thyroid doses were estimated as a function of age at exposure, region of the country and dietary habits. For example, for a female born in St. George, Utah, in 1951 and residing there until 1971, the thyroid doses are estimated to have been about 0.3 Gy if she had consumed commercial cow's milk, 2 Gy if she had consumed goat's milk, and 0.04 Gy if she had not consumed milk. For a female born in Los Angeles, California, at the same time, the corresponding values would have been 0.003, 0.01, and 0.0004 Gy. (A link to these data is available in the bibliography.)

Following the publication of the NCI findings in 1997, the U.S. Congress requested that the Department of Health and Human Services extend the study to other radionuclides in fallout and to consider tests outside the U.S. that could have resulted in substantial radiation exposures to the American people. Examples of results extracted from the report (a link is available in the bibliography) are shown in Figures 7 through 9 and 11. Figure 7 shows the pattern of deposition of cesium-137 (Cs-137), a radionuclide traditionally used for reference, resulting from all NTS tests in the entire United States. Fallout decreased with distance from the NTS along the prevailing wind direction, which was from west to east. Very little fallout was observed along the Pacific coast, which was usually upwind from the NTS. Estimated bone-marrow and thyroid doses are illustrated in Figure 8. The fact that both external and internal doses were roughly proportional to the deposition density is reflected in similarities between the two figures. Estimates of average thyroid and of bone-marrow doses for the entire U.S. population are presented in Figure 11; the thyroid doses from I-131 are much higher than the internal doses from any other radionuclide and also much higher than the doses from external exposure."