receiver help - 4 ohms

[Soundman]

Most of the forum is pushing the separates route, and if I did buy a good amp to drive the fronts like the emotiva, what is a good inexpensive receiver that has all the other goodies, like HDMI stuff, for my projector?

Is there any difference with getting an inexpensive receiver that has the HDMI inputs vs. the Marantz/Rotel's? Or am I paying for the name?

By the way, I was going to get the Axiom sub, either the EP500 or two
EP350's. I have a large room (28'x18'x11').

If you do go the separates route, you don't really even need a receiver. I good processor is all you need since you won't be using it to power anything, unless of course you think you might use it if you add a couple more channels later.
If you're considering an Axiom sub, you might want to also look at SVS. Personally, I think the comparably priced SVS sub would have the edge.

 

[Rickster71]

You are absolutely right. I need to Demo these. I have a friend with a signature series paradigm set up in his HT room. I am going to order the Axiom M22's, M60 and M80 and listen to the differences.

What model in the Sig series?

Any reason why you are limiting yourself to 4-ohm Axiom speakers?
It would solve a lot of the problem, if you found an 8-ohm speaker you liked. (just a thought)

Before spending money, time, effort, sending away for speakers that you might return.
There are so many easy to drive 8 ohm speakers out there; I'd go around to audio shops and listen more. (for free)

Just off the top of my head, try listening to 8-ohm Digm Studio 100's. I'd get out there and audition different stuff. That's half the fun.

Good Luck
Rick

 

[rded]

That is right, I want an amp that can comfortably handle the load.

For just the receiver, my budget is $1-2k. Any recommendations on a specific Denon, Marantz and Rotel receiver?

I currently have a Denon 2805. could I use this to power the fronts and then get an amp to power the rest of the 7.1?

thanks!

In Axiom's website, they have this AVR http://www.axiomaudio.com/sherwood_r872.html
Its the Sherwood Newcastle. I've been eying this receiver for a year now but not quite sure if its been released as sherwood takes forever to release their products. This I'm told is a very capable receiver and can handle 4ohm loads.
Now I'm pretty sure that you want hdmi 1.3 capabilities in your receiver. The new NAD receiver should be able to do so without any problems.

BTW, I have Dynaudio Contour 3.4s and sc center and Focus 110s for rears;hich are 4Ohm speakers and my denon 3808CI has no problems handling them.

 

[parinshah]

Isn't a receiver a processor?
If i get an amplifier like the emotiva, then can someone give me some examples of processors and prices?
Would a processor be able to upconvert and have HDMI inputs?
The emotiva would drive my 2 fronts, though, not my 7.1, right? I thought I would need a receiver to help do the rest of the system

 

[Soundman]

Isn't a receiver a processor?
If i get an amplifier like the emotiva, then can someone give me some examples of processors and prices?
Would a processor be able to upconvert and have HDMI inputs?
The emotiva would drive my 2 fronts, though, not my 7.1, right? I thought I would need a receiver to help do the rest of the system

There's alot of different things you could do. The XPA-5 I recommended has 5 discrete channels of power. If you're going to do 7.1, then you could get a receiver to power the back 2 channels and have the XPA-5 do the rest, if that interests you. Or you could get a 2-channel amp to power the back. There's alot of possibilities.
As for a processor or pre-amp. It's basically just like a receiver, but there isn't much of an internal amp in it. The idea is to let you amp(s) do the powering and let the pre/pro do all the processing and decoding, etc. Here's an example, but it's not quite here yet:

UMC-1 Audio/Video Processor
currently in testing phase - expected price: $699
Twin Cirrus® 32 bit dual core DSP’s for uncompromised high resolution HD audio decoding

Decoding support for Dolby Digital, Dolby Digital EX, Dolby Digital Plus, Dolby Digital True HD, Dolby PLIIx, DTS, DTSES, DTS HD, DTS Master Audio, DTS Neo 6, SPDIF, PCM 8 channel (note: some audio formats only supported via HDMI)

Genesis® Torino high performance video scaling engine with full Faroujda DCDi® processing

10 bit video resolution

Automatic Emo-Q™ multi channel room correction and automatic loudspeaker setup. Calibrated measurement microphone included.

Quadruple bass manager with independently selectable high and low pass frequencies from 40hz – 160hz

All legacy video inputs can be scaled and output over HDMI at up to 1080p

HDMI sources can be format converted to component video up to 1080i

Full color graphical OSD over live video, including HDMI

All inputs are assignable and feature input labeling, selectable decode modes, selectable triggers, etc.

Independent graphic EQ and bass and treble controls

0.5dB level trims

High voltage, low impedance main analog outputs (7 VRMS)

5 - HDMI inputs and 1 HDMI output.

3- composite video inputs (RCA)
3 - S-video inputs (S-video mini DIN)

3 - component video inputs (RCA)

1 - component video output (RCA)

4 - stereo analog audio inputs (RCA)

1 - 7.1 analog input set (RCA)

1 - 7.1 analog output set (RCA)

4 - coaxial digital inputs, (RCA)

4- optical digital inputs (Toslink)

1- coax digital audio output (RCA)

1- optical digital audio output (Toslink)

1 - Stereo or 2 channel analog multi channel mix down output for fixed level monitoring (RCA)

1- stereo analog variable and independent Zone 2 output (RCA)

1 - stereo analog fixed level record output (RCA)

High performance AM/FM tuner with 24 FM and 6 AM presets

3 - assignable trigger outputs Movie/Music/Amp (3.5mm mini)

1- IR input (3.5mm mini)

1 - IR output (3.5mm mini)

1. Microphone input (3.5mm stereo mini)

1- USB data input (for software upgrades only)

That should have everything you need. As far as features go, I can't imagine you needing anythig else for a while.

 

[Soundman]

pre/pro

The only problem for you is that that pre/pro hasn't been released yet.

 

[parinshah]

If I get the Emotiva XPA, what processor/pre-amp has been released now that would do the trick?

 

[rded]

Isn't a receiver a processor?
If i get an amplifier like the emotiva, then can someone give me some examples of processors and prices?
Would a processor be able to upconvert and have HDMI inputs?
The emotiva would drive my 2 fronts, though, not my 7.1, right? I thought I would need a receiver to help do the rest of the system

Yes, a receiver can be a processor if it has pre-outs. All you need are interconnects then your set. Going with true separates is going to be very expensive. There are 3 pocessors or pre/pros that I know of that has hdmi 1.3- the Denon 6-7K and the Simaudio 20K and the sunfire pre 7K
My advice is, get the receiver 1st and if you feel that its underpowered, then get an amplifier like the emotiva. The Denon and Sherwood shouldn't have any problems handling 4 ohm loads on their own.

 

[parinshah]

That may be a good idea. Keep it simple. One product to worry about and if i need more power i can get an amp.

Seems like the Denon 3808 is a winner. I looked at the 2809 Denon, and its very similar...little less power, no internet...seems like a better baragin. For the average consumer, would I miss out on much with the 2809? I can always add on the Emotiva.

 

[Soundman]

Yes, a receiver can be a processor if it has pre-outs. All you need are interconnects then your set. Going with true separates is going to be very expensive. There are 3 pocessors or pre/pros that I know of that has hdmi 1.3- the Denon 6-7K and the Simaudio 20K and the sunfire pre 7K
My advice is, get the receiver 1st and if you feel that its underpowered, then get an amplifier like the emotiva. The Denon and Sherwood shouldn't have any problems handling 4 ohm loads on their own.

Yes, this is very true. Maybe I wasn't very clear. Yes, you can use your receiver just like a preamp and not use the built in amp. It probably would be more practical right now to use your pre-outs for your main channels and use the receiver's amp for the surrounds. You could always add another amp later. Over time, the dedicated pre/pro's (with the new features) will go down in price, especially once the Emotiva one comes out. It's suppose to retail for $699, very very reasonable for what you get. Or like Rred said, just use a receiver for now.

 

[rded]

That may be a good idea. Keep it simple. One product to worry about and if i need more power i can get an amp.

Seems like the Denon 3808 is a winner. I looked at the 2809 Denon, and its very similar...little less power, no internet...seems like a better baragin. For the average consumer, would I miss out on much with the 2809? I can always add on the Emotiva.

The Denon 3808 has more power(not necessarily better/clean current) and better Audyssey EQ than the 2909CI. It really depends on your budget.Whether to go with the 3808 or 2909. FYI, did you know that Sherwood actually builds receivers for Denon? Just something to consider. You can simply add the Emotiva amp later say an XPA 3 for $499 and still be within budget of 2k range. Take note that you're better off with similar amplification for the front 3 LCR speakers and the rears can just be handled by the receiver.

 

[parinshah]

Does the 2809 have pre-outs in case i want to add an amp?

 

[Midcow2]

Google "Denon 2809"

Does the 2809 have pre-outs in case i want to add an amp?

Google "Denon 2809" and you get http://www.usa.denon.com/productdetails/4484.asp

then you look down the page and woolah you see:

Pre-Amp Outputs All (8)

 

[parinshah]

Sorry...must have glossed over it on the site.

Looks like we got a keeper! Denon 2809, and add on an amp if need be.

now time to start listening to some speakers!

Thanks for everyone's help...and patience.

 

[Pyrrho]

I apologize for my ignorance, but if I have a good receiver why do I need to get an extra amp? Again, I don't blare music...

It is a question of what the receiver is designed to work with, and what speakers you are going to use. Lower impedance speakers put extra stress on an amplifier (either built into a receiver or separate), at all volumes, though obviously, if you are pushing it harder, it will be worse. However, I guarantee that you can put too low of an impedance on just about any receiver even at low volumes. 4 ohms, however, is probably not going to be too low, assuming that that is a proper rating for the speaker (speakers actually vary in impedance according to the particular frequency, and the "nominal" rating is supposed to represent what you can pretend it is overall for matching with an amplifier, though some speaker manufacturers basically lie about this, rating their speakers higher in order to sucker people into buying them when they don't have an amplifier that can handle the actual impedance).

 

[Pyrrho]

Isn't a receiver a processor?
If i get an amplifier like the emotiva, then can someone give me some examples of processors and prices?
Would a processor be able to upconvert and have HDMI inputs?
The emotiva would drive my 2 fronts, though, not my 7.1, right? I thought I would need a receiver to help do the rest of the system

No, a receiver is not a processor; a surround receiver contains a processor. A surround receiver is many things in one box. It is a tuner (radio), preamp/control amplifier (the stuff with the basic controls, like balance and volume, switch between inputs, etc.), a surround processor, and power amplifiers (to drive the speakers). These things can all be purchased in one box, or in more boxes.

(A non-surround receiver is all of the above except excluding the surround processor, and will have fewer power amplifiers built in, as one typically uses one power amplifier per channel.)

If you have a receiver with preamp outputs, you can use it for all the parts above except for the power amplifiers, for which you can use a separate amplifier(s) for one or more channels if you wish.