Harman Kardon AVR-354 vs Onkyo TX-SR706

Alex00322

Alex00322

Enthusiast
Right now I have a Avr-247 from Hk and I need something with more power and more up to date features mainly true hd and master audio. I'm debating between getting the New Harmon kardon 354 or the Onkyo 706 anyones advice would be much appreciated. Sound quality is the main thing for me I don't care about how easy they are to use I don't have a problem with that.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Right now I have a Avr-247 from Hk and I need something with more power and more up to date features mainly true hd and master audio. I'm debating between getting the New Harmon kardon 354 or the Onkyo 706 anyones advice would be much appreciated. Sound quality is the main thing for me I don't care about how easy they are to use I don't have a problem with that.
I am very impressed with the 606 and by comparing the specs the 706 looks much better in terms of features and power. It is even rated for 4 ohms. The 354 probably will do better in power output with all channels driven but the 706 will likely do much better in 1 and 2 channel output. To me the 706 is the better choice. If the 606 had preouts I would even take the 606 over the 354.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
I am very impressed with the 606 and by comparing the specs the 706 looks much better in terms of features and power. It is even rated for 4 ohms. The 354 probably will do better in power output with all channels driven but the 706 will likely do much better in 1 and 2 channel output. To me the 706 is the better choice. If the 606 had preouts I would even take the 606 over the 354.
I seriously doubt the 354 can out gun the 706 in ACD (even though ACD is almost a pointless rating:D). The TX-SR605 from yesteryear tested over what H/K's specs are for the AVR-354 (75wpc). The TX-SR706 is a heftier receiver than the TX-SR605/606, logically it should have more power than either. Naturally it's possible that Onkyo took a dive in their amp sections (but I find this unlikely). The Only Onkyo that seems to have fallen behind is that darn TX-SR806, stupid thing lost 20 pounds to the predecessor.:confused:
 
A

armaraas

Full Audioholic
I seriously doubt the 354 can out gun the 706 in ACD (even though ACD is almost a pointless rating:D). The TX-SR605 from yesteryear tested over what H/K's specs are for the AVR-354 (75wpc). The TX-SR706 is a heftier receiver than the TX-SR605/606, logically it should have more power than either. Naturally it's possible that Onkyo took a dive in their amp sections (but I find this unlikely). The Only Onkyo that seems to have fallen behind is that darn TX-SR806, stupid thing lost 20 pounds to the predecessor.:confused:
This is pretty much pointless, but I feel obligated to ask where the 605 tested over the 354's specs. The 354 is rated 75 Watts per channel @ <0.07% THD (assuming the HK can meet its spec), I see the 605 measured here-
http://www.soundandvisionmag.com/receivers/2632/test-bench-onkyo-tx-sr605-av-receiver.html

at 80 watts into 7 channels at clipping. Correct me if I am wrong, but if the distortion was scaled back to .07 instead of clipping the watts would drop?

I would expect it may be more similar to the 606 test here-
http://ultimateavmag.com/avreceivers/608onk606/index6.html

where with distortion at .1% it's around 72 watts, less than the HK at 75 watts at .07%.

Anyway, this is all just semantics.
I think the question needs to be asked of the OP- why do you need more power exactly? And is it for 2 channel listening, or movies? What kind of speakers do you have?

HK's tend to be more conservative with 2 channels driven, so I agree you will likely get more power from the Onkyo's for 2 channel listening, and you may get more for all channels. However, keep in mind- in order to gain an additional 3 db in volume, you need to double your power. So if you're looking to go louder and are currently pushing around 60 watts, you'll need 120 for 3 more db, 240 for 6 more, etc. So if the Onkyo 706 does 100x7 it may not be much of an audible difference from the HK at 75x7 for movies.

You may be better off adding an amp for more power, depending on what you need exactly, once you get a receiver with the features you need.
If you like HK you have now, you may end up preferring the HK's over Onkyo's, you'll need to listen to them yourself to know for sure though.
 
Alex00322

Alex00322

Enthusiast
This is pretty much pointless, but I feel obligated to ask where the 605 tested over the 354's specs. The 354 is rated 75 Watts per channel @ <0.07% THD (assuming the HK can meet its spec), I see the 605 measured here-

at 80 watts into 7 channels at clipping. Correct me if I am wrong, but if the distortion was scaled back to .07 instead of clipping the watts would drop?

I would expect it may be more similar to the 606 test here-


where with distortion at .1% it's around 72 watts, less than the HK at 75 watts at .07%.

Anyway, this is all just semantics.
I think the question needs to be asked of the OP- why do you need more power exactly? And is it for 2 channel listening, or movies? What kind of speakers do you have?

HK's tend to be more conservative with 2 channels driven, so I agree you will likely get more power from the Onkyo's for 2 channel listening, and you may get more for all channels. However, keep in mind- in order to gain an additional 3 db in volume, you need to double your power. So if you're looking to go louder and are currently pushing around 60 watts, you'll need 120 for 3 more db, 240 for 6 more, etc. So if the Onkyo 706 does 100x7 it may not be much of an audible difference from the HK at 75x7 for movies.

You may be better off adding an amp for more power, depending on what you need exactly, once you get a receiver with the features you need.
If you like HK you have now, you may end up preferring the HK's over Onkyo's, you'll need to listen to them yourself to know for sure though.
I'm using the new Klipsch Vf-36's in the front and back with the new klipsch center they get plenty loud now but my current receiver doesn't have all the bells and whistles that current day ones do and like I said it's mostly about sound quality power is a bonus I don't want my speakers getting undercut and not getting what they need.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
I would expect it may be more similar to the 606 test here-
http://ultimateavmag.com/avreceivers/608onk606/index6.html

where with distortion at .1% it's around 72 watts, less than the HK at 75 watts at .07%.

Anyway, this is all just semantics.
The fact is HK did not spec the 354 for 75X7 .07% either. It does say 75W with 2 channel driven. They used to give the ACD rating but for some reason not any more, not for the 354 anyway. For the older model, e.g. the 347, the specs are:

70W 2 channel
55W ACD at 0.07% THD

As you said, this is all just semantics.
 
A

armaraas

Full Audioholic
The fact is HK did not spec the 354 for 75X7 .07% either. It does say 75W with 2 channel driven. They used to give the ACD rating but for some reason not any more, not for the 354 anyway. For the older model, e.g. the 347, the specs are:

70W 2 channel
55W ACD at 0.07% THD

As you said, this is all just semantics.
Wow, ok, I didn't realize HK changed their rating system so much. I have an HK receiver, but its 4 years old (235). It would be nice to see the new ones benched to see how they perform.

Anyway, Alex, I think you'll be fine with either receiver looking at your speakers sensitivity- 97.5db, that's pretty high. The speakers will be easier to drive (not require a lot of power). Between the 2 receivers, does either one have any feature the other doesn't that you would want?

And it sounds like you may by using a blu ray, if so, which player? I've heard of some people having issues with the newest HK's with their ps3. Their expecting a firmware update to address them, not sure if it's out yet, but it might be something to keep in mind.

If you haven't already, it maybe worthwhile to check out avsforum.com in their audio/receivers section to read up on peoples experiences with these receivers. HK is typically known for their sound quality and usually seem to have fewer bells and whistles on their receivers.
 
Alex00322

Alex00322

Enthusiast
Thanks for all of your input but I actually decided to go with the VSX-01TXH out of nowhere people kept bashing on the new Hk's and the Onkyo just didn't compare to the Pioneer after hooking it up and listening for a little while it definitely out performs my old receiver so I'm happy plus it has everything I was looking for
 
Adam

Adam

Audioholic Jedi
Excellent choice, IMO. If I were pressed to buy a new receiver today, I'd buy the VSX-01THX. I really like my VSX-1015TX.

If you'd be willing to, please let us know how you like it after a few days. I'd sure like to read about it. Thanks!

EDIT: BTW, did you buy it online or locally?
 
Alex00322

Alex00322

Enthusiast
I bought it locally at a store called Audible Elegance They lowered the price down to 650 which I figured was pretty fair. I also got to listen to some Martin Logan and Macintosh speakers which were amazing
 
A

armaraas

Full Audioholic
Congratulations, I'm sure that receiver will work great for you. I did have the 03 in house for a while, and I did like it and had no issues with it. However I didn't get as good of a discount as you did and ended up not keeping it. The 01 wasn't an option for me as they had it at $850 to begin with. If I had been able to get it for the price you did it probably would have been a keeper. Congrats again.
 
Alex00322

Alex00322

Enthusiast
So after a day or so of listening to the receiver I notice a larger difference in sound than I was expecting. The main difference is the base it honestly sounds like I have a sub hooked up which I don't the second largest thing is that the surround speakers seem to be putting out a much higher quality of sound as well. Another great thing this receiver has that my last didn't is the upconversion of 1080p I realize it doesn't come close to actual 1080p but it has made a pretty big difference on the standard def channels. Another great thing are the new sound modes I get while I'm watching Blu Ray's I think I finally got my sound up to par with the picture of my television. Overall I'm really happy with my buy it was a simple set up lots of functions and performs well at all volume levels.
 

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