subwoofer opinions by mike c

[mike c]

the smallest room i tried the PB10 in was 2600-2700 cubic feet.
that's where i got the PB10 to sound sloppy ... it was pretty nearfield too.
but then, it will depend on your listening taste on how loud you play a subwoofer.
asking me: PB12 or PB10 is like asking me if i want 200 bucks or 100 bucks

seriously though, i would ALWAYS recommend the bigger subwoofer. not only will it keep you future proof, but a subwoofer playing at its limits will always be trumped by a subwoofer just coasting along. (to answer your question: yes you will reap the benefits)

oh, and when you point the subwoofer to the couch, leave a gap in between, preferrably 6" in distance.

 

[speakerman39]

playing near max outputs, the PB12 sounded much better than the PB10. i had the wife and a family of friends listening at the time. we weren't talking while we were listening, just switching ... and most pretty much came out to say that the PB12 sounded the best.

i can conclude though that it's because the PB10 shouldn't be playing near max outputs/excursion because it starts to lose control, the PB12NSD sounds much better with HT too as compared to the 25-31

Mike, I am referring to when both are playing at normal listening levels. More specifically, I am focusing on the quality of the tone versus quantity. I am fully aware the PB12 has much more output over-all especially down deep. The difference is nothing huge, but imho it was noticeable nonetheless. My room basically was right at 3000 ft.^3.I found it amazing how SVS could get that much performance both in terms of quality as well as output from the PB10-NSD. There is no doubt the PB12 takes it to the next level. Just wish I could hear the newer improved version.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[mike c]

looking at the new 12NSD tests, it would seem SVS are "concentrating" on the more important 25hz up frequencies, the low end slope of the new amp i guess would give quite a few db's of headroom in the upper frequencies, whereas the previous tests would show that the 12NSD was 'flatter' to the teens, thus cutting into the headroom.

as to the "near max output" levels of the PB10 ... i had to listen to my "normal" listening levels, and at those levels, the 12NSD sounded much better than the 10NSD. but if i had to guess, in a 2k or less room, the 10NSD would sound the same.

 

[speakerman39]

looking at the new 12NSD tests, it would seem SVS are "concentrating" on the more important 25hz up frequencies, the low end slope of the new amp i guess would give quite a few db's of headroom in the upper frequencies, whereas the previous tests would show that the 12NSD was 'flatter' to the teens, thus cutting into the headroom.

as to the "near max output" levels of the PB10 ... i had to listen to my "normal" listening levels, and at those levels, the 12NSD sounded much better than the 10NSD. but if i had to guess, in a 2k or less room, the 10NSD would sound the same.

Hmmmmmmm very interesting. Maybe it is just the differences between our rooms. I noticed it right off. However, if I had to choose between the two, it would be the PB12-NSD. Especially so, since it has been improved. Still amazed at how SVS gets so much performance out of the PB10 driver. Personally, I had a hard time believing it was only a 10" driver.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[mike c]

Hmmmmmmm very interesting. Maybe it is just the differences between our rooms. I noticed it right off. However, if I had to choose between the two, it would be the PB12-NSD. Especially so, since it has been improved. Still amazed at how SVS gets so much performance out of the PB10 driver. Personally, I had a hard time believing it was only a 10" driver.

Cheers,

Phil

i agree. i think it's the best 400+USD sub i've ever heard

 

[speakerman39]

i agree. i think it's the best 400+USD sub i've ever heard

No doubt. I have to agree on this one. Thanks for sharing your impressions with us Mike.

Cheers,

Phil

 

[mike c]

what a slowdown - the multiple ultra purchases has cut down on playtime with new subwoofers.

I expect to be able to ORDER a new sub(s) within 4 months.

HSU ULS-15 or dual AV123 MFW-15 or DUAL DIY malestrom-x

hmmm

 

[mike c]

SVS PCi 25-31 added

 

[jehanzeb]

Hi Mike,

Do you still have the Velodyne DLS-5000R?

If so, how does it compare to an equally priced SVS?

 

[mike c]

Hi Mike,

Do you still have the Velodyne DLS-5000R?

If so, how does it compare to an equally priced SVS?

not anymore. i never did A/B comparisons between the DLS-5000R and the SVS entry level units.

it depends on how much the DLS-5000R is over there.
i bought mine for around 800-900USD each.

but i can safely say the DLS-5000R's goals is NOT low frequency extension, but maximum output at the higher frequencies. so if you want max SPL the velo wins, if you want extension any of the SVS units win.

 

[cbraver]

Is your Bag End INFRA on order? haha j/k

In all seriousness, there are plenty of professional reviews with measurements and fancy talk about performance, but these reviews are, in my opinion, far more functional for the typical consumer.

 

[jehanzeb]

not anymore. i never did A/B comparisons between the DLS-5000R and the SVS entry level units.

it depends on how much the DLS-5000R is over there.
i bought mine for around 800-900USD each.

but i can safely say the DLS-5000R's goals is NOT low frequency extension, but maximum output at the higher frequencies. so if you want max SPL the velo wins, if you want extension any of the SVS units win.

I paid right around that price (800$) as these subs never go on sale.

So far I am loving it's massive output, as you mentioned, but sometimes I get curious as to how does 18hz really *feel* so maybe an SVS is in my future.

Btw, did you ever try out the JL Audio F113 ?

From what I have read, this is one of the best balanced subs available (great for music AND movies). Like to see what you think of it.

 

[bandphan]

Btw, did you ever try out the JL Audio F113 ?

From what I have read, this is one of the best balanced subs available (great for music AND movies). Like to see what you think of it.

JL makes great subs, bur for the dollar 2 ultras or 2 conquest or 6 mfw15 or .... Yes JL subs are nice, but i bet mike wants this one

 

[mike c]

I paid right around that price (800$) as these subs never go on sale.

So far I am loving it's massive output, as you mentioned, but sometimes I get curious as to how does 18hz really *feel* so maybe an SVS is in my future.

Btw, did you ever try out the JL Audio F113 ?

From what I have read, this is one of the best balanced subs available (great for music AND movies). Like to see what you think of it.

i've never heard the JLF113, but since some people say the JL has the DD18 performance in a smaller enclosure, i never felt the "need" to try it out. (of course the high price tag is enough to keep me away)

regarding 18-20hz, yes you really can "feel" the difference between 18hz and the Velo's 30hz.

JL makes great subs, bur for the dollar 2 ultras or 2 conquest or 6 mfw15 or .... Yes JL subs are nice, but i bet mike wants this one

if I sold my boy ... maybe i could afford the rotary hardware (no design and installation, etc.) but alas, i did email Bruce Thigpen and he said he did not sell the hardware apart from his "software" therefore, it's not available overseas. whew! good news for my wallet ... and my boy

 

[EJD]

Coming to this thread a bit late - but wanted to say Thanks Mike! This is exactly the type of info I'm looking for.

Couple of questions I wanted to get your take on since I'm considering the SVS cylinder subs:

1) You mention that you wish the PCi 25-31 were tuned lower like the PB12NSD. Do you think that the PCi 20-39 (or even tuning the 25-31 a bit lower) would accomplish that and not sacrifice anything?

2) Your thoughts on what the PC-plus line would bring over the PCi line?

Thanks

 

[mike c]

Coming to this thread a bit late - but wanted to say Thanks Mike! This is exactly the type of info I'm looking for.

Couple of questions I wanted to get your take on since I'm considering the SVS cylinder subs:

1) You mention that you wish the PCi 25-31 were tuned lower like the PB12NSD. Do you think that the PCi 20-39 (or even tuning the 25-31 a bit lower) would accomplish that and not sacrifice anything?

2) Your thoughts on what the PC-plus line would bring over the PCi line?

Thanks

thanks for reading! yes a bit late, as i'm about to retire from this "almost" endless subwoofer chase.

1) the pci20-39 should be more efficient than a 2531 tuned to 20hz because they are amp limited. but yeah, i feel even a 20-31 would be an improvement over the 25-31. in short, i would probably have the 2039, 2031, 2231 before going with the 2531.

it has always been my motto to get the lowest tuned sub i can get. because if you have problems with SPL, add a second one, or third, or 4th ... but if you want a lower extension and don't have it, you're gonna have to "upgrade" your sub because no matter how many subs you have, the low end extension isn't going to improve.

2) the only plus driver i had was the SB12 Plus, but even in that small sealed enclosure the Plus had way more excursion than the NSD driver. i'd say the ported pluses are at least twice as loud as the ported NSD based subs. (guesstimate)

 

[croseiv]

--seems to draw quite a bit more power from the wall and capable of fluctuating my voltage regulators

Not surprising. I know the amp is capable of doubling its wattage under demand, so you're looking at essentially 1500 W! That will cause lights to dim especially if running more than one.

 

[WmAx]

if I sold my boy ... maybe i could afford the rotary hardware (no design and installation, etc.) but alas, i did email Bruce Thigpen and he said he did not sell the hardware apart from his "software" therefore, it's not available overseas. whew! good news for my wallet ... and my boy

Mike... you can still wait out and score Phoenix Gold Cyclones on eBay. These provide flat high output down to about 10Hz, no problem, and they are not huge.

Imagine 4 of them added as sub-sub woofers in your system. You can probably fidget an F3 around 6 or 7 Hz out of them with some DCX processing. Normally, I would consider such pursuits unusual - but in your case - it would surprise me for you NOT to do it.....

-Chris

 

[mike c]

Mike... you can still wait out and score Phoenix Gold Cyclones on eBay. These provide flat high output down to about 10Hz, no problem, and they are not huge.

Imagine 4 of them added as sub-sub woofers in your system. You can probably fidget an F3 around 6 or 7 Hz out of them with some DCX processing. Normally, I would consider such pursuits unusual - but in your case - it would surprise me for you NOT to do it.....

-Chris

everytime i google "Phoenix Gold Cyclones"

i get sports teams

are those subwoofer drivers?

 

[Warpdrv]

They are another version of the Rotary type sub... like the thigpen
http://www.audiojunkies.com/product/1006/phoenix-gold-cyclone-reviews