Newbie Question on Projector in Office with Lights On

[culrich]

We're setting up a small currency trading room and want to have charts up on the walls all day. I don't want to go the LCD/Plasma route - even a 50" is too small for someone sitting 20 feet away. I'm looking to use projectors.

We're looking for something reasonably priced (say under $1500 ideally under $1000) that is bright enough to be seen well in an office environment where flourescent lights will be on.

I'm also looking for higher resolution than 1024x768 if possible.

And if I'm out of my mind and this is a pipe dream please let me know and give me a good alternate option, if there is one.

I've looked at a few via B&H website, some are sub $600 for 1024x768 @ 2500 lumens (optoma EP749. ASK A1200). Personally, I'm still a fan of the 10 year old Epson I have - at around 1500 lumens and 800x600 it kicks over the Panasonic we bought 2 years ago that is 1024x768 and 2500 lumens, so I know all lumens aren't created equal...

Thank you !

 

[BMXTRIX]

In a board room under normal lighting you want no less than 50 post calibrated lumens per square foot of screen space as an absolute minimum. I typically double that, so a 6'x8' screen (48 square feet) would get no less than about 3,500 lumens.

You can do this, but at your budget, you are really talking about a 1024x768 projector as standard. You also need to keep in mind that these projectors are not rated for 24/7 usage, and the lamps will likely blow at any point above 1,000 hours. Budget for it! 8 hours a day, 5 days a week = as many as 2 lamps a year.

I don't think you'll get higher resolution, but you should be able to get a pretty bright image. Just don't go to big.

 

[culrich]

... so if I go with a screen 80 wide x 45 high (and don't expect to fill it completely) ...

80 x 45 = 3600 sq in / 144 sq in = 25 sq ft, so a 2500 lumen projector (DLP with "Brilliant Color") should do the job, right?

Any opinion on the ASK A1300 Projector / InFocus IN2106 (same projector, different label, 1 yr longer warranty on ASK) for this job?

From what I've read, DLP runs about 15% dimmer than LCD. A sales rep (ahem) told me that the "Brilliant Color" on the InFocus should make up for that difference. True or not, going by the 50 lumens/sq foot and doubling for good measure, does this seem reasonable?

Thanks !!!!!!

 

[BMXTRIX]

I would generally recommend against DLP for business presentation due to the 2x color wheel and chance of rainbow artifacting that increases significantly with a slower color wheel. Headaches can be common in this scenario. Throw into the mix that contrast doesn't matter if you add lights to a room. Lumens become more and more important as room ambient light rises.

The projector you listed, in theory could hit the numbers you are after, but it really is a scraping the bottom of the barrel product vs. a quality install piece. I think that at your price point you simply are dealing with immediocrity. There's just nothing that's a real stand out product for the money. About 100 different projectors exist that are around that price, and around that quality. It's not horrible, it's not great, and there are no notable standouts.

I think you get a good idea with this list...
http://www.projectorcentral.com/projectors.cfm?mfg_id=any&res_id=12&ar=0&td=&is=&bll=1875&bul=any&cll=any&cul=any&wll=any&wul=any&prll=any&prul=any&an=0&sp_id=0&dvi=-1&trig=1

Lots of similar qualities without any real standouts in either DLP or LCD, but I think DLP is detrimental for any environment with extended viewing and a 2x color wheel.

 

[culrich]

Thank you.

I hate to ask the annoying newbie question, but what would you recommend?

Let me start broadly ...

Would a 2,500 lumen LCD cut it or do I need to go 3,000 ?

Is there a manufacturer or specific model that would do the job at these levels that's also a good price value?

Thanks again

 

[BMXTRIX]

I think I would lean more towards this list of XGA projectors...
http://www.projectorcentral.com/projectors.cfm?mfg_id=any&res_id=3&ar=0&td=0&is=0&bll=3000&bul=any&cll=any&cul=any&wll=any&wul=any&prll=any&prul=4000&an=0&sp_id=0&nodlp=1&dvi=-1&sort=sp&trig=1

The first few include a Sanyo and a Canon, both of which I would rate towards the top of a buying list. I would avoid some of the smaller manufacturers for sure, but there are just to many 'generic' entires at this price point and you simply don't have the budget for anything to stand out as better.

I think for a bit more money you get a fairly big overall jump if you want a bit more resolution from this...
http://www.projectorcentral.com/projectors.cfm?mfg_id=any&res_id=12&ar=0&td=0&is=0&bll=2500&bul=any&cll=any&cul=any&wll=any&wul=any&prll=any&prul=3000&an=0&sp_id=0&nodlp=1&dvi=-1&trig=1

But, nothing is going to be 'great' and nothing is really going to be lousy. The days of lousy are over, but to get great it's simply going to run some more $$$.

 

[culrich]

Thank you - I will look at those.

I was researching this AM and found a Panasonic PT-FW100NTU for about $2100 street price, 3000 lumens, LCD. A larger unit (around 15lbs) but it is to be ceiling mounted & out of the way.

Sorry - not high enough level to post link to Panasonic's site

I don't see it on the list and haven't been able to find anything on the forums about it. Any thoughts?

 

[jostenmeat]

culrich, you are in very good hands here, but I can assume you will get an appropriate screen? FWIW, I use a high power screen (2.8x gain) which is really meant for scenarios like yours. The problem is that healthy off-axis viewing has a dramatic drop-off in brightness. If most/all viewers are within 20 degrees viewing angle, its something to check out. Quite affordable too.

 

[culrich]

Some could be at a 10-45 angle at worst. The point of the screens is that charts will be running there. Traders will look at their own displays most of the time; the projected screens are to highlight particular topics, so it may be viewed for a couple of minutes at a clip.

If we do extended presentations, I would anticipate people "moving back" who are seated too close to the screen anyway; that's an issue with the layout of the room, which we cannot change.

Envision a 20' wide x 24' deep room with desks against the wall on the sides and a row of facing desks down the middle, all running the "deep" direction. The screens will be in the "aisles":

    S         S
[]     [] []     []
[]     [] []     []
[]     [] []     []
[]     [] []     []
[]     [] []     []

People at outer desks are facing "out", people on inner desks face each other. Screens run with charts on them and, as we point things out, people turn to look. So those people seated closest to the screen are at a bad angle, but that is unavoidable. As long as they can see, even if it is not perfect, it should be "good enough" for a couple of minutes of viewing before they return to their own LCD montiors.

That said, it sounds like screen selection is an important criteria I had not considered. Does a "high power screen" accommodate higher lumens, does it "reflect" better from different angles? Is it a brighter white or are there other criteria that make it "higher power" ?

Thanks

 

[jostenmeat]

That said, it sounds like screen selection is an important criteria I had not considered. Does a "high power screen" accommodate higher lumens, does it "reflect" better from different angles? Is it a brighter white or are there other criteria that make it "higher power" ?

Thanks

HP does reflect better at certain angles, being no angle! There is a fast drop off at about 20 degrees or so. Otherwise, on-axis, take your foot lamberts calculated from choice of pj and screen size, then simply multiply that figure by the "gain" of chosen screen technology. All levels will be raised, not just particular whites or something.

I use this screen:
http://www.dalite.com/products/product.php?cID=9&pID=231

which I ordered from Projector People. Great competitve pricing. In fact, I helped a guy out a lot at another forum in choosing his audio stuff for his HT and BR stereo. He installs commercial PJ systems for a living. He was going to pass his accomodations to me, but the savings were very negligible compared to PP, and so I went with the flexibility/peace-of-mind of an established vendor. I had mine custom ordered in black for just a tad more, but that is now pointless since it is covered at this point...

The tech uses emulsified glass beads in order to get the high power gain. I'm sure your little diagram is not to scale, but if it was, I bet it would work fine, outside of perhaps the persons that are right next to it.

For more in-depth discussion, check out this review:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=773065

Hope that helps. BMXTRIX might have some words of caution for you; perhaps issues that I am totally unaware of...