Bi ampable speakers

[jared555]

With speakers that can be bi amped like the axiom m80v2's, What happens when you are NOT using two amplifiers and a crossover? Does it affect the sound at all, or do the mids/woofers have high/low pass filters to prevent problems?

Also, if they do have filters, wouldn't that eliminate some of the benefits people seem to desire of eliminating the internal crossover when bi amping?

 

[mtrycrafts]

With speakers that can be bi amped like the axiom m80v2's, What happens when you are NOT using two amplifiers and a crossover? Does it affect the sound at all, or do the mids/woofers have high/low pass filters to prevent problems?

Also, if they do have filters, wouldn't that eliminate some of the benefits people seem to desire of eliminating the internal crossover when bi amping?

Unless a multi way speaker is self powered, it would have passive crossover networks in there to send the signals to the right speakers. So, you don't have to worry with just one amp per channel

 

[TLS Guy]

With speakers that can be bi amped like the axiom m80v2's, What happens when you are NOT using two amplifiers and a crossover? Does it affect the sound at all, or do the mids/woofers have high/low pass filters to prevent problems?

Also, if they do have filters, wouldn't that eliminate some of the benefits people seem to desire of eliminating the internal crossover when bi amping?

You scored a hole in one! Passive biamping through the speakers passive crossovers is a waste of time, unless the crossover happens to be in the area of 400 Hz, then you can double amplifier power. However it would be no different than using an amp of a power twice each one of the amps used in the biamp set up.

To get any benefit from biamping you need custom active crossovers.

 

[jared555]

What I am wondering about though is the ones that have the two sets of banana jacks, but normally have a piece of metal in between them... http://www.axiomaudio.com/gallery_display2.html?image=cable_inputs.jpg&title=M80 - Cable Inputs

How are they set up internally to allow the two different configurations?

 

[TLS Guy]

What I am wondering about though is the ones that have the two sets of banana jacks, but normally have a piece of metal in between them... http://www.axiomaudio.com/gallery_display2.html?image=cable_inputs.jpg&title=M80 - Cable Inputs

How are they set up internally to allow the two different configurations?

I tried to upload a crossover circuit, but it exceeds 100 KB. I find this 100 KB limit ridiculous and frustrating. Either look up some crossover circuits, or PM me with your Email and I will send you one. If you look at a circuit, the answer to your question is obvious.

In essence the filters stand side by side, and can be driven separately or paralleled.

 

[Sheep]

I tried to upload a crossover circuit, but it exceeds 100 KB. I find this 100 KB limit ridiculous and frustrating. Either look up some crossover circuits, or PM me with your Email and I will send you one. If you look at a circuit, the answer to your question is obvious.

In essence the filters stand side by side, and can be driven separately or paralleled.

I find people that avoid www.photobucket.com rediculous and frustrating.

SheepStar

 

[TLS Guy]

I find people that avoid www.photobucket.com rediculous and frustrating.

SheepStar

Using photo sites is a pain, as you have to convert files to photo form and then up load. I use Smugmug which I far prefer to photobucket.

In future I will post technical files on my website and post a link. Here is the circuit the OP needs.

http://www.drmarksays.com/ Click on the circuit link.

 

[Haoleb]

Somehow i get the feeling if he doesnt know how it works internally, looking at a schematic wont make a bit of sense anyhow.

Think of it this way. If you disconnect the metal strap, There is one crossover inside the speaker that is for the midrange and tweeter drivers. It will filter out the bass frequencies so that the drivers do not get that part of the signal. And then there is another crossover that does the exact opposite which is for the woofers.

The metal strap is just there so that when your using just one set of speaker cables you will be getting a signal to both sets of binding posts.

The majority of people who biamp their speakers do not use an outboard crossover, Instead they rely on the passive crossover that is built into the speakers. In which case all you would need is two amplifiers.

What amplifier or amplifiers in specific were you thinking of powering the M80's with? From the sound of your post, to me it sounds like you have been reading all the "biamping doesnt make a difference unless you use an outboard crossover and blah blah blah..." posts which seem to be more hearsay than anything else. Not that I am saying that its not ideal or whatever but one person with some weight around here says something and everybody else says the same thing from then on...

If you already have a powerful amplifier to run the M80's on I think you'll be quite pleased with them that way without venturing into biamping and so on.

 

[jared555]

Somehow i get the feeling if he doesnt know how it works internally, looking at a schematic wont make a bit of sense anyhow.

Think of it this way. If you disconnect the metal strap, There is one crossover inside the speaker that is for the midrange and tweeter drivers. It will filter out the bass frequencies so that the drivers do not get that part of the signal. And then there is another crossover that does the exact opposite which is for the woofers.

The metal strap is just there so that when your using just one set of speaker cables you will be getting a signal to both sets of binding posts.

Thanks for confirming this for me.

 

[AVRat]

Here’s some light reading that may also help:

http://sound.westhost.com/bi-amp.htm
http://sound.westhost.com/bi-amp2.htm

 

[jonnythan]

Tinypic.com is a great place to quickly toss up a picture without having to register and all that nonsense.

 

[fredness]

speakers without dual binding posts

My speakers only have one set of binding posts. Can I use the biamp feature on my Pioneer VSX-1014TX (7x110w) without causing damage?

On the BESL 5MT, Phil Bamberg uses the SEAS Nillenium tweeter and the 7" magnesium W18EX-001. The sensitivity is only 83db. They do have great detail and could benefit from more power.

Unfortunately I can't post the link because I have less than 5 posts.
bambergaudio dot com s5mt.shtml
bambergaudio dot com s5mt_xo.shtml crossover notes

Thanks.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

So you would prefer the hassle to be on our end and not yours....

Using photo sites is a pain, as you have to convert files to photo form and then up load. I use Smugmug which I far prefer to photobucket.

In future I will post technical files on my website and post a link. Here is the circuit the OP needs.

http://www.drmarksays.com/ Click on the circuit link.

 

[Midcow2]

Frustration

I find people that avoid www.photobucket.com rediculous and frustrating.

SheepStar

What is frustrating about using photobucket ?

Good point Sheep

 

[TLS Guy]

So you would prefer the hassle to be on our end and not yours....

I don't see where the pain is. All you need to do is click on this link, and you can run off pdfs of models for a lot of useful drivers.

You are very limited in the data you can load to this site. It is easier just to link to my site. Where is the pain factor?

 

[ParadigmDawg]

I prefer to see the picture within the post. I mean, if we were the type that didn't mind clicking more than one button then we wouldnt need fancy remotes and we might even get off the couch.

I don't see where the pain is. All you need to do is click on this link, and you can run off pdfs of models for a lot of useful drivers.

You are very limited in the data you can load to this site. It is easier just to link to my site. Where is the pain factor?

 

[TLS Guy]

What is frustrating about using photobucket ?

Good point Sheep

Nothing. Smugmug works the same way. The issue is that converting Box Pro and Crossover Pro files to pdf, and loading to my site is much easier than converting the graphs to photos and loading them to a photo site. I have done it both ways, and it is much easier to print the design as a pdf and load to my website. Trust me it is far quicker. I have used Smugmug for years and it is an excellent service. Just click on my signature to see what I mean.

 

[Midcow2]

Picture of TLSs crossover circuit

Using photo sites is a pain, as you have to convert files to photo form and then up load. I use Smugmug which I far prefer to photobucket.

In future I will post technical files on my website and post a link. Here is the circuit the OP needs.

http://www.drmarksays.com/ Click on the circuit link.

TLS's crossover circuit

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Ok, I clicked on your picture and it kind of hurt my finger but I see your point.

Everytime I see your set up the same things come to mind;

1. I really like the way it looks.
2. I would like to hear it and see for myself if you are really ok without a sub.
3. I wonder why your display is the size of my GPS.
4. I wish I could find more Docs with an interest in HT as it would make my job easier.

Nothing. Smugmug works the same way. The issue is that converting Box Pro and Crossover Pro files to pdf, and loading to my site is much easier than converting the graphs to photos and loading them to a photo site. I have done it both ways, and it is much easier to print the design as a pdf and load to my website. Trust me it is far quicker. I have used Smugmug for years and it is an excellent service. Just click on my signature to see what I mean.

 

[TLS Guy]

TLS's crossover circuit

That one was just posted as a quick example. There is a LOT more data in the modeling pdf. and presented I think in the best fashion, and that is the way I will do it. Saying it is hard to click one link is ridiculous.