tsl guy can you help?

[kicknsupra]

well i got some 6.5 mid bass drivers well i got about 40 of them
the case them came in say bsg labs on it will post pic soon
but i found these on the net http://www.miscospeakers.com/SpeakerDetail.cfm?SpeakerID=232
and they look like them big time
the power rateing and sensitivity seem about right i have some in the doors of my work truck and they have nice kick bass and go low for what they are
i was woundering if you could look at the spec and see what you think
i was think about makeing some mid bass towers maybe 8 in each with a range from 50 -120hz

ps sorry for spelling your name wrong

 

[TLS Guy]

well i got some 6.5 mid bass drivers well i got about 40 of them
the case them came in say bsg labs on it will post pic soon
but i found these on the net http://www.miscospeakers.com/SpeakerDetail.cfm?SpeakerID=232
and they look like them big time
the power rateing and sensitivity seem about right i have some in the doors of my work truck and they have nice kick bass and go low for what they are
i was woundering if you could look at the spec and see what you think
i was think about makeing some mid bass towers maybe 8 in each with a range from 50 -120hz

ps sorry for spelling your name wrong

You won't get much joy with those. They are obviously auto sound speakers designed for open baffle.

They could be in a sealed enclosure, but F3 is 77Hz. Enclosure volume is reasonable at 3.7 cu ft. QTc is an excellent 0.78.

These drivers are not suitable for reflex (ported) loading. The optimal box is 10 cu.ft, and there is 7db of ripple. If you make the box smaller and put Fs at 44hz then the ripple is 10 db!

Not a sensible project I'm afraid.

The sealed alignment.

Name: LC62MB-4A
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Misco
No. of Drivers = 8
Mounting = Standard
Wiring = Series-Parallel
Fs = 55 Hz
Qms = 11.2
Vas = 9.3 liters
Cms = 0.143 mm/N
Mms = 400 g
Rms = 1.804 kg/s
P-Dia = 165 mm
Sd = 213.8 sq.cm
Qes = 0.84
Re = 3.7 ohms
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 5.8 Tm
Pe = 100 watts
Qts = 0.78
no = 0.178 %
1-W SPL = 85 dB
2.83-V SPL = 87.99 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Closed Box
Shape: Prism, square
Vb = 3.663 cu.ft
Qtc = 0.78
QL = 14.75
F3 = 76.77 Hz
Fill = heavy

Ported.

Name: LC62MB-4A
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: MISCO
No. of Drivers = 8
Mounting = Standard
Wiring = Parallel
Fs = 55 Hz
Qms = 11.2
Vas = 9.3 liters
Cms = 0.143 mm/N
Mms = 400 g
Rms = 1.804 kg/s
P-Dia = 16 mm
Sd = 214 sq.cm
Qes = 0.84
Re = 3.7 ohms
Z = 4 ohms
BL = 5.8 Tm
Pe = 100 watts
Qts = 0.78
no = 0.178 %
1-W SPL = 85 dB
2.83-V SPL = 87.99 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Vented Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 10.02 cu.ft
Fb = 39.47 Hz
QL = 5.037
F3 = 31.44 Hz
Fill = minimal
No. of Vents = 4
Vent shape = round
Vent ends = two flared
Dv = 4 in
Lv = 4.368 in

 

[kicknsupra]

hey thank you for taking your time i kind of had the feeling you say that
they do sound really good in the doors of my work truck i think i am going to put 4 in each door soon

so if i wanted to build them anyways just for fun and to freshin up my wood working skills
you say a seald box about 3.6cu for 8 of them will be the best i can get out of them?
i got them cheap so i want to try anyways

 

[TLS Guy]

hey thank you for taking your time i kind of had the feeling you say that
they do sound really good in the doors of my work truck i think i am going to put 4 in each door soon

so if i wanted to build them anyways just for fun and to freshin up my wood working skills
you say a seald box about 3.6cu for 8 of them will be the best i can get out of them?
i got them cheap so i want to try anyways

That is correct. A car environment is very different to home. That speaker I would not think worth the trouble. However you can Eq a sealed box. The xmax of those drivers was not specified, so I don't have clue as to the power response. However with 8 drivers it is likely significant. You could add an equalizer and boost at 12 db per octave below 80 Hz. As Gilbert Briggs used to say if you build a speaker that is no good, you are only out time and wood!

 

[kicknsupra]

what do tou thin about morel?
i was thing about 2 of these for the mids
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=287-032

and 4 of these for midbass
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=297-076
and for the highs
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=277-070
or these

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=277-052
i will try amp them and run a 3 way active crossover

just one of the sets i am thinking about as you can see i want high output but a nice clean sound
any ways thanks again

 

[kicknsupra]

the other set i was think about was a Scan-speak set up
2 of these for mids
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=1479&osCsid=1c3a9c8252fc9eaf54fa15383fbe0f37

4 of these for mid bass
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=929

and for the highs
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=1581

or these
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=173&products_id=1594

 

[TLS Guy]

what do tou thin about morel?
i was thing about 2 of these for the mids
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=287-032

and 4 of these for midbass
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=297-076
and for the highs
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=277-070
or these




http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=277-052
i will try amp them and run a 3 way active crossover





just one of the set i am think about as you can see i want high output but a nice clean sound
any ways thanks again

Morel drivers are excellent. They have huge motor systems.

What are you trying to achieve? What are your goals? Those driver selections make no sense. You would just need the tweeter and two of the mid bass units, no midrange. Adding a midrange will just add phase shifts, time delay and comb filtering for NO benefit.

Now whether you use passive or active crossovers, they have to be custom for the drivers. All drivers are essentially band pass devices, that is too say they roll off above and below their pass bands. They ALL roll off differently. One of the goals of the crossover is to sum the responses of the two drivers so their is no peak or null at crossover. That is a difficult task. The crossover is the heart of the speaker.

Please educate us on your goals and needs, then may be we can steer you to a practical and executable solution. We need especially to know what degree of bass extension you require. What is your budget? Details please.

 

[kicknsupra]

i want loud clear sound that way i was think about a 3 way set i only need i to go do to 50hz or so i want to buy it in parts so maybe be 300-800 for the high 800 for the mids and maybe about 1200 for the midbass
i might do i a 2 way set up so imaybe 2200 for a 2 way that good down to 100-80hz
i was think about geting maidsound to make me some crossovers
i talked to one of the tecs brian a hour or so
we came up with this set up
2 of these
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=925
and for the highs
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=173&products_id=1594
and custom crossovers

 

[kicknsupra]

what i was frist thinking about was going with this 2 way setup to up grade the drivers in my ar3s with custom cross overs
so i can reuse the boxes as they have 12inch subs and sunfire amps in them

the mids are in a seald chamber about .4cf

 

[TLS Guy]

the other set i was think about was a Scan-speak set up
2 of these for mids
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=1479&osCsid=1c3a9c8252fc9eaf54fa15383fbe0f37

4 of these for mid bass
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=929

and for the highs
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=1581

or these
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=173&products_id=1594

Again you would not need the mid. I have been doodling with that 7 inch Reveltor for a while. Again you would need no mid, and just two Reveltors, you could go to four but look at the cost and size. It would make more sense to add a sub, or use a a couple of 10 inch drivers and the mid. I would caution you against a three way for your first project. Much more can and usually does go wrong.

Now that 7 inch Reveltor in a two and half way design would need to be mated to this tweeter.

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=45_229_270_324&products_id=908

Here is the modeling I did with the 8 ohm version. As you can see the F3 is 29 Hz. I modeled this because Joe Schmoe wanted to know the lowest reach of a driver that size. Now the drivers are little power limited at 50 Hz were output is 103 db, but that is pretty loud. Above 100 Hz th spl is 111 db.

Here is the alignment. Note it takes over a 4 cu ft enclosure. So if you used four it would be over 8 cu.ft!

Name: 18W/8531G-00
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Scan-Speak
No. of Drivers = 2
Mounting = Standard
Wiring = Parallel
Fs = 28 Hz
Qms = 5.1
Vas = 59 liters
Cms = 1.846 mm/N
Mms = 17.5 g
Rms = 0.6 kg/s
Xmax = 6.5 mm
Xmech = 11 mm
P-Dia = 138.2 mm
Sd = 150 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.0975 liters
Qes = 0.39
Re = 5.8 ohms
Le = 0.35 mH
Z = 8 ohms
BL = 6.8 Tm
Pe = 60 watts
Qts = 0.36
no = 0.32 %
1-W SPL = 87.2 dB
2.83-V SPL = 87 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Vented Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 4.245 cu.ft
Fb = 25.21 Hz
QL = 6.296
F3 = 29.37 Hz
Fill = minimal
No. of Vents = 1
Vent shape = round
Vent ends = two flared
Dv = 4 in
Lv = 10.06 in

Now I have worked up a TL for this same driver configuration. That would have second instead of fourth order roll off, and so would be only 6db down at 22 Hz!

I have the crossover worked up also. It looks excellent on the computer.

There really is nothing to be gained using active crossovers on these 2 1/2 way designs. In fact it is asking for blown tweeters.

I decided that this speaker was a little rich for most peoples blood, so I have worked up a great TL based on some SEAS prestige drivers. The F3 is 47 Hz though.

 

[TLS Guy]

i want loud clear sound that way i was think about a 3 way set i only need i to go do to 50hz or so i want to buy it in parts so maybe be 300-800 for the high 800 for the mids and maybe about 1200 for the midbass
i might do i a 2 way set up so imaybe 2200 for a 2 way that good down to 100-80hz
i was think about geting maidsound to make me some crossovers
i talked to one of the tecs brian a hour or so
we came up with this set up
2 of these
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=148&products_id=925
and for the highs
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=173&products_id=1594
and custom crossovers

I would not select that tweeter, for that bass/mid driver. I have deigned a nice crossover previoulsy. I would use two drivers and make it a 2.5 way with diffraction compensation. Here is the sealed alignment for two 8 ohm drivers. F3 is 66 Hz. That is within your specification, however I think vented or TL would be a lot better.

Name: 18W/8531G-00
Type: Standard one-way driver
Company: Scan-Speak
No. of Drivers = 2
Mounting = Standard
Wiring = Parallel
Fs = 28 Hz
Qms = 5.1
Vas = 59 liters
Cms = 1.846 mm/N
Mms = 17.5 g
Rms = 0.6 kg/s
Xmax = 6.5 mm
Xmech = 11 mm
P-Dia = 138.2 mm
Sd = 150 sq.cm
P-Vd = 0.0975 liters
Qes = 0.39
Re = 5.8 ohms
Le = 0.35 mH
Z = 8 ohms
BL = 6.8 Tm
Pe = 60 watts
Qts = 0.36
no = 0.32 %
1-W SPL = 87.2 dB
2.83-V SPL = 87 dB
-----------------------------------------
Box Properties
Name:
Type: Closed Box
Shape: Prism, square (optimum)
Vb = 0.74 cu.ft
Qtc = 0.707
QL = 20
F3 = 66.52 Hz
Fill = heavy

I think you have enough info now. You need to think reflect and study and then decide how you want to proceed.

A vented or TL with the driver combination, I have selected and my crossover , I think would be quite a speaker.

We seemed to have moved rather quickly from cheap car speakers to the exotic!

If you pm with your Email, I will send you a pdf with all the details.

 

[kicknsupra]

hey its me again what do you think about these?
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=264-700

and maybe 4 7 inch Reveltor in a tl set up?

i can live with a really big box thats kind of what i want
i have made a lot sub boxs so i am sure i can do it if i had some kind of plan just woundering what you think of line-source transducers?
i know we went from talking about cheap car speakers to high end but thats what i was going to do anyways

i want someing that will kill my energy veritas in sq and spl


any ways thanks again

 

[TLS Guy]

hey its me again what do you think about these?
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=264-700

and maybe 4 7 inch Reveltor in a tl set up?

i can live with a really big box thats kind of what i want
i have made a lot sub boxs so i am sure i can do it if i had some kind of plan just woundering what you think of line-source transducers?
i know we went from talking about cheap car speakers to high end but thats what i was going to do anyways

i want someing that will kill my energy veritas in sq and spl


any ways thanks again

I'm not sure why you want it so loud. A TL based on two Reveltor 7 inch would be a highly accurate and refined high definition speaker. It would not generate extraordinary spls. For that you need high sensitivity, high efficiency drivers.

I have Emailed you details of how to go about building a high spl speaker system.