Surge protection advice

[cdv1831]

Tweeter is telling me to put a Panamax MFP 400 behind my new Pioneer PRO150D. I am finishing my basement now and electrcian is still around before wall board goes up next week. Is there another non Tweeter recommendation that you all could give that will not cost me $200, but gives me the protection I need? Thanks much

 

[TLS Guy]

Take a look at these.

Voltage sags also do a number on this modern high tech gear, as I found out in the system in our lower level living room. The studio systems that had UPS systems did fine. I strongly recommend UPS systems and not just surge protection.

These are in your budget range.

http://www.buyupsonline.com/collections/smart-ups

 

[fmw]

Tweeter is telling me to put a Panamax MFP 400 behind my new Pioneer PRO150D. I am finishing my basement now and electrcian is still around before wall board goes up next week. Is there another non Tweeter recommendation that you all could give that will not cost me $200, but gives me the protection I need? Thanks much

I guess that would depend on what protection you need. I haven't used a surge protector in 40 years of audio. So I have no need for it at all. You'll need to determine your need for yourself. I wouldn't let an audio salesman do that for you.

 

[unreal.freak]

sorry to jump in on your thread, but i need some advice too. Since this is on subject with what I'm needing advice on i thought i would ask in this thread instead of starting yet another Surge protection thread. I'm building a new home(drywall is going to start Monday) i have approx $300 budget for protecting my stuff. I'm going to need to protect a 46" to 52" LCD TV which is going to be located high on the wall away from everything else, i have an outlet wired for behind the TV.
Also i will have a component rack in a corner with my amp, blue-ray, sat TV, cd player. what i need is discrete protection for the TV, and seperate protection for the rack. The component rack and tv are approx 30ft apart.

Thanks
Tommy

 

[TLS Guy]

sorry to jump in on your thread, but i need some advice too. Since this is on subject with what I'm needing advice on i thought i would ask in this thread instead of starting yet another Surge protection thread. I'm building a new home(drywall is going to start Monday) i have approx $300 budget for protecting my stuff. I'm going to need to protect a 46" to 52" LCD TV which is going to be located high on the wall away from everything else, i have an outlet wired for behind the TV.
Also i will have a component rack in a corner with my amp, blue-ray, sat TV, cd player. what i need is discrete protection for the TV, and seperate protection for the rack. The component rack and tv are approx 30ft apart.

Thanks
Tommy

I would use one UPS for the system, since your walls are open. I would wire the TV outlet to wire to the UPS. That way you will also have less chance of ground loops. That is what I did.

 

[unreal.freak]

If i understand you correctly, you mean run the TV receptical outlet power off of a main UPS thats in the Amp rack? What UPS would you suggest thats in my price range? Im not totally sure how a UPS does surge protection. Maybe you or someone could help me out with an explanation, so that i may carry on an intelligent conversation about the the subject. Thanks for the reply, my experience with surge protection consists only of a power strip. It had surge protection, but apparently not enough, our house took a direct hit by lightning a year ago and it blew up my Dell XPS, all the TVs, A chest type freezer, all the telephones, and the modem+router.

Thanks,
Tommy

 

[TLS Guy]

If i understand you correctly, you mean run the TV receptical outlet power off of a main UPS thats in the Amp rack? What UPS would you suggest thats in my price range? Im not totally sure how a UPS does surge protection. Maybe you or someone could help me out with an explanation, so that i may carry on an intelligent conversation about the the subject. Thanks for the reply, my experience with surge protection consists only of a power strip. It had surge protection, but apparently not enough, our house took a direct hit by lightning a year ago and it blew up my Dell XPS, all the TVs, A chest type freezer, all the telephones, and the modem+router.

Thanks,
Tommy

UPS systems give the best protection. Surge protection only, is in fact very little protection. Also low voltage situations, all too common these days, have a deleterious effect on modern electronics.

Here are the Types of UPS.

http://www.upsforless.com/index.asp?PageAction=Custom&ID=4

I would recommend a smart UPS from APC as the way to go. They are of the line interactive type, and typically have 2ms response times. I have mine set to start support at 106 volts.

You need to add up your loads and get one of appropriate power. On your budget you will need a refurbished unit, but they are fine. I have four of them now.

http://www.upsforless.com/?gclid=CInT3YSq6ZECFSOCGgod4lPKfw

Here is another vendor of good APC refurbs

http://www.refurbups.com/Catalog/Smart-UPS-Rack;jsessionid=ac112b6c1f435525cea6437d4788844785ec175fe48a.e3eTaxiMa38Te34Pa38Ta38Rchb0

I have used both outfits with good results. You will need a rack mount. Here is a picture showing a couple of mine installed.

http://mdcarter.smugmug.com/gallery/2424008_RKGvb#127077469

I hope this helps.

 

[stratman]

If i understand you correctly, you mean run the TV receptical outlet power off of a main UPS thats in the Amp rack? What UPS would you suggest thats in my price range? Im not totally sure how a UPS does surge protection. Maybe you or someone could help me out with an explanation, so that i may carry on an intelligent conversation about the the subject. Thanks for the reply, my experience with surge protection consists only of a power strip. It had surge protection, but apparently not enough, our house took a direct hit by lightning a year ago and it blew up my Dell XPS, all the TVs, A chest type freezer, all the telephones, and the modem+router.

Thanks,
Tommy

You know FPL installs whole house surge protection. They install it at the power meter, go to their web site and check it out.

 

[TLS Guy]

You know FPL installs whole house surge protection. They install it at the power meter, go to their web site and check it out.

That's OK for catastrophic surge, but will do nothing for other ills, especially low voltage and other nasties. With modern gear, it should be UPS every time.

 

[Rickster71]

With you living in the Lighting Capitol of the USA, a few lighting rods on the roof wouldn't hurt.
Though, you really need both of the things Stratman and TLSguy mentioned.
You don't have to be hit directly with lighting; the induced voltages, from strikes that are blocks away, are enough to destroy electronics.
The whole house surge systems I've installed, also facilitate the routing your phone and cable lines through it, and as Strat mentioned, they install at the main meter and panel.

 

[mudrummer99]

TLS,
I noticed you posted links to APC power supplies, but on that link it didn't show these models:BX900R, BX1300LCD, and BX1500LCD. What do you think of these? My main reason for looking at these in particular is that I work at BB and get a substantial discount on them. I would like to get 1 for the HT system and 1 for the computer/music room (home recording equip, keyboards, etc.) Would there be advantages/disadvantages of going with these (including monetary) over getting one of the others online or is APC a solid UPS company across the board with their equipment. Thanks for all the help.

Mike

 

[jostenmeat]

Hey TLS,

what do you think of the Belkin Pure AV units? I have one feeding my projector (just for the bulb's sake), but Im curious about the prospect of feeding it to the audio as well.

TIA

 

[TLS Guy]

Hey TLS,

what do you think of the Belkin Pure AV units? I have one feeding my projector (just for the bulb's sake), but Im curious about the prospect of feeding it to the audio as well.

TIA

I have never used them. As far as I can tell they are not a UPS. I cut me teeth on this when in addition to my medical duties the president of our health system appointed me building and capital budget chairman. One of the first things I attended to was curbing the dreadful equipment attrition rate. All I can tell you is, you have to worry as much about low as high voltage and devices that don't have batteries, inverters and quick response times are virtually useless. I had many years of experience at this. I just think you can use UPS designed for IT and hospital equipment for HT and audio. Refurbs are good value for money. These units are cost effective and do the job. That's my recommendation and I'll stick to it. APC are the most reliable and best thought out, I think.

 

[majorloser]

If you don't want to spend the money on a new UPS system, take a look at the APC Factory Outlet Store. The refurb stuff has a warranty from APC, too. Not some other company:

http://buy.apc.com/commerce/storefronts/factoryoutlet/default.aspx?StorefrontCode=apcfo&CountryCode=us&tsk=z181x

You can usually pick up a good deal. The inventory changes often, so it's worth checking. Try to stay with the Smart-UPS line. They have much tighter specs compared to the Back-UPS line.

If your looking for new, I think the Audioholics Store might still have an APC discount code going on.

 

[TLS Guy]

If you don't want to spend the money on a new UPS system, take a look at the APC Factory Outlet Store. The refurb stuff has a warranty from APC, too. Not some other company:

http://buy.apc.com/commerce/storefronts/factoryoutlet/default.aspx?StorefrontCode=apcfo&CountryCode=us&tsk=z181x

You can usually pick up a good deal. The inventory changes often, so it's worth checking. Try to stay with the Smart-UPS line. They have much tighter specs compared to the Back-UPS line.

If your looking for new, I think the Audioholics Store might still have an APC discount code going on.

I agree, the smart UPS is the way to go as I originally suggested. It is well worth the money. Just keep track of when it is time to change batteries though.

 

[MDS]

A whole house surge protection unit installed at the main panel is an added measure of protection but will do nothing against a direct (or even nearby) lightning strike. In fact, *nothing* can protect against that.

A whole house surge protection unit is not sufficient for protecting electronics. The let-through voltage is very high and they are meant more to protect the big appliances in your home. You always want point-of-use surge protectors/UPS for your computers and AV equipment.

I don't think the battery backup of a UPS is particularly important for HT but voltage regulation and surge protection is, as has been mentioned already. I have two UPSes for my computers and that is important because you need time to shut things down in an orderly manner. I've been sitting here when the power went out and I know they work (both are APC). For the HT, I just have one APC H10 power conditioner/surge suppressor.

 

[gus6464]

Wait so you recommend a UPS for everything? I have a 2ch system in my office that just does music so I should get a UPS for this too? I currently have a lot of these throughout my whole apartment.

http://buy.apc.com/commerce/storefronts/factoryoutlet/product.aspx?storefrontcode=apcfo&countrycode=us&tsk=z181x&product_id=PF11VNT3(APC_US)&MSCSProfile=95385A1F52DEA1A229D5B37542054464B88AAF3A35433B1BBFF69A09B9678FDCBD9542EDFFEF656FA378D1221881347D2AE03633580E9D8C2C799F61266E793F5BEF2066D4FF658266C318A4022BC0DC0C680E7F2378C48029EB848EE292D5C47EE13BFF3771E8F7B4DD3508DA656983850AB08CDEEE16521C582034CCECE72F7624B1BEFE5D4134

 

[unreal.freak]

so if i buy one of thesesmart UPC i need to basically run an in wall rated cord (behind the sheet rock) from my tv over to the rack ,30ft away? That will tie it all together in the main rack connected to one UPC. I looked up my Amp and it says Max Power consumption is 610 watts, the tv im gonna get uses 375 watts, the Blue ray is 33 watts, the Cd palyer i have is 50 watts. I guess ill need a UPC with atleast 1000 watts of power available? I dont see the amp drawing 610 watts unless its pushed to the max volume. Thank you to all who posted, im going to get it all squared away real soon. I will prolly get one of the main service surge protection devices as well.

Peace,
Tommy

 

[majorloser]

A whole house surge protection unit is not sufficient for protecting electronics. The let-through voltage is very high and they are meant more to protect the big appliances in your home.

That would depend on the unit. Most of your residential units aren't the greatest, but there are some quality industrial units out there. This is what I'm using. Not the greatest, but OK:

http://www.mtlsurgetechnologies.com/products/ac/zs.htm

http://www.mtlsurgetechnologies.com/downloads/datasheets/zonesentinel/uk-us/901-132 Rev D ZS.pdf

 

[jostenmeat]

I have never used them. As far as I can tell they are not a UPS.

Well, it has a battery inside of it that recharges, which powers the PJ when the electricity goes out. I leave the alarm on. Heavier and better looking that I assumed it would be. Numerous folks recommended it as a good affordable unit at the hi-end digital projector forum at AVS, and so I recently sprung for it.

Had this thread been created in time, I would most definitely have considered a refurbished Smart UPS from APC as you and majorloser have suggested. Perhaps the next time I need one, thanks for you responses.