Should I Bi-amp or Bi-wire?

[am74Gibson]

I just bought a new Denon AVR 4308ci which I will be setting up over the next couple of days. I also bought a pair of PSB IMAGE T55's for my mains. I may end up getting something better (more expensive) later, but I got these cheap and I like the looks. They are also Bi-amp and/or Bi-wireable. And they have a higher sensitivity than some, so my reciever should drive it them with no problems. So I will keep them for a while at least. I have two M&K v125 subs ...bass won't be a problem ...and Infinity es250 surrounds and Infinity TSScenter4000 or Infinity Alpha 37c center (haven't decided which one to keep yet.)

So I am reading that I should utilize the Bi-amp/wire feature since my speakers and receiver are capable. I haven't had a chance to play around with the reciever yet to try to understand what my options are. If anyone is familiar with it, perhaps you can suggest the best combination.

I will only be using 5.1. So that frees up the two surround back channels which you can "amp assign". The receiver also has a separtate "amp assign" for zone 2 (I think) . Does it matter which one I use? I woul prefer to use the surround back, because I have a pair of wireless advent speakers I may want to run off of the zone 2.

I assume Bi-Amping is preferable to Bi-wiring? Am I wrong, or is bi-wiring basically just putting more copper between your amp and speaker?

If someone can advise, I would appreciate it. It would help a lot of trial and error if I could just set it up right to start with.

Thanks

 

[rnatalli]

Don't waste your time with bi-wiring; it's useless. Bi-amping does provide benefits depending what's being used. You can try bi-amping as it won't do any harm, but I don't think you'll notice any improvements using a receiver.

 

[The Chukker]

Clint addressed this issue here:
http://www.audioholics.com/education/frequently-asked-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring

I too bi-wire but only because it looks cool >embarrassed<

 

[chadnliz]

Bi-Wire and Bi-Amping both have benefits in proper situations given you have equipment that will reveal changes you have made, now if it is worth it TO YOU is a whole other story. My speakers come with an active outboard cross-over so I have to run Horizontal Bi-amp and shot gun Bi-Wire, in the past I have Bi-wired 3 sets of speakers, only 1 of which I could not detect any change in sound. Are you wondering of Vertical (amp for each speakers) or Horizontal (seperate amp for lows and highs)....vertical only gives you more power.
If you are thinking of the latter you need matching amps or the ability to control gain or the most likely wont match up.

 

[Brett A]

I Bi-wire. I hear a difference and it is one I prefer. Try A/B-ing with one, and then two sets of inexpensive cables run shotgun (two separate sets of speaker cables for each channel stacked on the amp posts) . It can't hurt and it might be fun.

At the risk of stating the obvious: Don't forget to remove the jumpers when you bi-wire.

Some measurements:
http://www.geocities.com/jonrisch/page7.htm

 

[mike c]

if you bi-wire, why do you need to remove the jumpers?

(i understand that if you bi-amp, you really need to remove the jumper)

 

[chadnliz]

You remove the jumper because if you leave it in then you are defeating the use of bi-wire............if both contacts are connected by the jumper it is the same as one common wire.

 

[Brett A]

if you bi-wire, why do you need to remove the jumpers?

If you bi-amp, you really need to remove the jumper)

Same reason. If you don't remove the jumpers, you're effectively running one cable and that would defeat the purpose of the exercise.

 

[mike c]

Same reason. If you don't remove the jumpers, you're effectively running one cable and that would defeat the purpose of the exercise.

what about people's argument that with or without the jumpers, the "power/signal" comes from the same binding post anyway. so there's actually no "separation" of signal of highs and lows (because there is no active crossover)

 

[Brett A]

what about people's argument that with or without the jumpers, the "power/signal" comes from the same binding post anyway. so there's actually no "separation" of signal of highs and lows (because there is no active crossover)

I don't know definitively. I continue to read up on that argument--there's so much about it online--at the same time trying different configurations at home.

My experience is that bi-wiring delivers a consistent difference in my system. Single wiring delivers a more two-dimensional soudstage. Bi wiring perceptibly deepens it.

I like to try different configs with cables I have on hand. (DIY CAT 5 and some $0.60/ft four conductor in wall cable from my local hifi store) It's a way to pass the time and engage with the hobby. I encourage everyone to to the same especially if there is little or no cost.

Eventually when I am ready to commit real money to speaker cables, my thinking today is that they'll be bi-wire.

 

[Swerd]

what about people's argument that with or without the jumpers, the "power/signal" comes from the same binding post anyway. so there's actually no "separation" of signal of highs and lows (because there is no active crossover)

When a speaker comes with two sets of binding posts, the crossover circuit boards inside the cabinet are wired so that the tweeter's circuits are electrically separate from the woofer's. In a 2-way speaker, one pair of posts goes to the tweeter, through the tweeter's crossover, and the other pair goes to the woofer, through the woofer's crossover.

If the two pairs of posts are joined with the jumpers, then one speaker wire is all you need to send signal to both the woofer & tweeter.

If you remove the jumpers, you need to attach separate wires to both pairs of posts.

These are passive crossovers. They do their job with or without the jumpers.

If you want to use external active crossovers, you must bypass or remove these passive crossovers.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

Biwiring has no audible effect whatsoever. As in zip, nada.
Biamping can have some slight benefit in some situations.

 

[Brett A]

Biwiring has no audible effect whatsoever. As in zip, nada.
Biamping can have some slight benefit in some situations.

I'm learning to ignore the bait questions and statements, thanks.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

I'm learning to ignore the bait questions and statements, thanks.

As in the bait question that the OP asked and the bait statement that you made?

 

[fmw]

I'm learning to ignore the bait questions and statements, thanks.

That's good. Those of us who have actually done the bias controlled testing have also learned to ignore the flights of fancy engaged in by those who do not understand their own perceptual hearing. I guess that leaves a level playing field.

 

[Brett A]

It's getting dark in here.....

 

[mttam]

I have my speakers bi-wired. I originally didn't bother because I didn't know how to and I thought the speakers sounded great. I had read that the speaker manufacturer recommended Bi-wiring, so I looked into it. I realized it was a simple process, so I bi-wired. It made a big difference. My speakers sound much better bi-wired.

 

[Joe Schmoe]

Here is a diagram comparing biwiring and single-wiring:View attachment Wiring.pdf
Notice that the only difference is the location of junctions "a". It is not merely that biwiring does not make a difference, but that it cannot.

 

[yettitheman]

bi-wiring; verb:
1: to double wire
2: useless
3: see "electricity follows shortest path, no matter if it's one wire or 9000"

 

[mtrycrafts]

It's getting dark in here.....

But some try to turn on the light for the others to see and still claim to be in the dark