Didn't believe I could get that sound...

[Guangui]

I like all kinds of music from latin rythms like Salsa to Classical, and almost everything in between. My CD and vinyl collection is a hodgepodge of almost every genre there is, including music from around the world, not bought as reference, mostly bougth because I liked it.

What I like about my PSB T45's and B25's is that they play very well most music, but I've never been able to get them to sound right with Heavy Metal, and/or Album Rock. Don't know exactly what it is, but I find there is something missing, and they become somewhat harsh with this type of music.

Well, the other day I rented the 2-Disc DVD for Metallica's Concert with the San Francisco Symphony Orchestra. Probably it was the combination of the two, but what a great sounding DVD, just wonderful.

Finally, I was able to enjoy HM in a whole different way. The T45's were at their best with this DVD. Tried the B25's, same experience though a little muddy, not in a way that it is a concern.

I am glad I decided for the PSB Image Series, great speaker at a very reasonable price.

 

[Seth=L]

I am glad you are enjoying them. I saw a pair of mint PSB Image t5s (the predacessor to the t55) for $150. I about died, because I had no money.

 

[3db]

I like all kinds of music from latin rythms like Salsa to Classical, and almost everything in between. My CD and vinyl collection is a hodgepodge of almost every genre there is, including music from around the world, not bought as reference, mostly bougth because I liked it.

What I like about my PSB T45's and B25's is that they play very well most music, but I've never been able to get them to sound right with Heavy Metal, and/or Album Rock. Don't know exactly what it is, but I find there is something missing, and they become somewhat harsh with this type of music.

Well, the other day I rented the 2-Disc DVD for Metallica's Concert with the San Francisco Symphony Orchestra. Probably it was the combination of the two, but what a great sounding DVD, just wonderful.

Finally, I was able to enjoy HM in a whole different way. The T45's were at their best with this DVD. Tried the B25's, same experience though a little muddy, not in a way that it is a concern.

I am glad I decided for the PSB Image Series, great speaker at a very reasonable price.

How loud were you playing them when they got edgy? Mine did too but I was cranking 90+ dbs and I think it was more on the receivers side and room acoustics that caused that instead of the speakers.

 

[Guangui]

How loud were you playing them when they got edgy? Mine did too but I was cranking 90+ dbs and I think it was more on the receivers side and room acoustics that caused that instead of the speakers.

Not very loud, I'm not the kind of person who plays loud music. Room acoustics probably have to do a lot, as there is none. This is my family room, and it is solid concrete all around, 14' x 17' with a 12' ceiling, ceramic tile floors, a sofa at some 9' in front of the speakers, and two chairs to the right. Yeah, yeah; I know what you are thinking about an area carpet, this and that, etc. I can give you the Commander In Chief phone number, and you can try to explain to her how you would redecorate with acoustical treatments the profesionally decorated family room; already had a hard time deciding on speakers that she would approve.

A dedicated HT room (man cave) is being added as part of an on-going home renovation, but won't be ready until early June. But, for that room I am seriously considering a custom set-up by Salk; just waiting on the darn blueprints with acoustical treatments and all the details to be finished, so I can send a copy to Salk.

To give you an idea of how loud, my receiver is a Marantz SR-5001 (80 WPC), and volume rarely goes past -15 dB.

 

[no. 5]

Aside from acoustics, it might be the recordings themselves that don't sound right.

I don't really have any Heavy Metal in my CD collection, and so can't offer observations on their recording quality, but I have noticed that some Rock albums that I would have liked to sound good just don't when played on a decant system.

 

[Seth=L]

What receiver or amplifier are you using? PSB speakers aren't very efficient, and they probably dip in impedance at times. At high levels the amplifier might have trouble keeping up.

 

[3db]

What receiver or amplifier are you using? PSB speakers aren't very efficient, and they probably dip in impedance at times. At high levels the amplifier might have trouble keeping up.

90-93db isn't efficient? Its not Klipsch efficient but they are sufficiently efficient.

 

[Guangui]

What receiver or amplifier are you using? PSB speakers aren't very efficient, and they probably dip in impedance at times. At high levels the amplifier might have trouble keeping up.

Doubt that it is the receiver...Marantz SR-5001 (80 WPC). At 91 dB these are pretty efficient speakers.

 

[Seth=L]

PSB defects from their trend of hard to drive speakers, I stand corrected regarding efficiency. What about impedance?

 

[3db]

PSB defects from their trend of hard to drive speakers, I stand corrected regarding efficiency. What about impedance?

Its all over the map amonst the series but within a series, very linear.

PSB's new Synchron line are all 4 ohms but their impedance doesn't dip much bellow 4 ohms across the entire frequency range. Its not the 1st time PSB has done that apparently acording to another poster from another forum. The Platinum line are nominal 4ohms, Image series is 6 ohms nominal, and the Alpha series I think is 8 ohms.

 

[Guangui]

PSB defects from their trend of hard to drive speakers, I stand corrected regarding efficiency. What about impedance?

Image T45 Tower Specifications
Frequency Range
On Axis @ 0° ±1.5dB 48-20,000 Hz
On Axis @ 0° ±3dB 35-23,000 Hz
Off Axis @ 30° ±1.5dB 48-10,000 Hz
Lf Cutoff -10dB 30 Hz
Sensitivity
1w (2.83V) @ 1m, IEC-filtered Pink Noise, C-weighted
Anechoic Chamber 90 dB
Typical Listening Room 93 dB
Impedence
Nominal 6 Ohms
Minimum 4 Ohms
Input Power
RMS, Clipping < 10% of the Time
Recommended 10-150 Watts
Program 100 Watts
Acoustic Design
Tweeter (Nominal) 1" (25mm)
Aluminium Dome with Ferrofluid
Woofer (Nominal) 2 x 5 1/4" (133mm)
Injection Molded
Metalized Polypropylene Cone
Crossover 2,200Hz, B3; 500Hz, LR4
Internal Volume Design Type 1.20 cu ft (33.6 liter)
Bass Reflex
2 x 2" Front Port
Video Shielded

 

[Soundman]

Aside from acoustics, it might be the recordings themselves that don't sound right.

I don't really have any Heavy Metal in my CD collection, and so can't offer observations on their recording quality, but I have noticed that some Rock albums that I would have liked to sound good just don't when played on a decant system.

This is very possible. There was an Audioholics article posted a while back talking about compression and music. It mentioned the new Metalica CD and how it sounded terrible. It also mentioned that the audio quality of some local band sounded better. I wish I could remember which article it was. Anyway, this could have something to do with your experience.

 

[am74Gibson]

It's all in the name!!

Not trying to be a smart@$$ here, but doesn't the term heavy METAL mean it is supposed to sound harsh? I thought that is where they coined the name.

Anyway, I just bought a pair of the PSB T55's I just set up today. I have a new Denon 4308ci also. I will test the speakers out in a the next few days and let you know what I think. I have a Some Disturbed, Nine Inch Nails, etc. Not sure if you consider this heavy metal, but it is close as I have.

With this new system, I just replaced a Marantz SR9300 (140w THX) and Infinity RS6 Kappa speakers. The Infinity tweeters have some sort of crazy upper range of 45,000khz. And yes, I though my Heavy Metal Cd's were a bit harsh. But I wrote it off to the tweeters, the nature of the music, and that I had my tone set for more mainstream music.

HOWEVER, while researching my new Denon receiver, I read more than one post that said Marantz receivers were harsh.... I was happy with mine when I was using it...I guess ignorance is bliss...but After just one day, I can tell I like my new setup better. Maybe just the Marantz/PSB combo is not well suited.

 

[Guangui]

Anyway, I just bought a pair of the PSB T55's I just set up today. I have a new Denon 4308ci also. I will test the speakers out in a the next few days and let you know what I think.

What do you mean with "will test speakers out in the next few days"??? What kind of misguided life you live???

You receive speakers, you immediately set-up speakers, ten seconds after you have to play music or a movie, then you let us know what you think...

There is no such thing as "in a few days", so get your a$$ back to where your speakers are, play them (enjoy them), then let us know what you think.

Hate people who don't have their priorities straight...

 

[am74Gibson]

I have no life!!

What do you mean with "will test speakers out in the next few days"??? What kind of misguided life you live???

You receive speakers, you immediately set-up speakers, ten seconds after you have to play music or a movie, then you let us know what you think...

There is no such thing as "in a few days", so get your a$$ back to where your speakers are, play them (enjoy them), then let us know what you think.

Hate people who don't have their priorities straight...

You are right, I have no life ... I have been having to work 3rd shift...12 hour on 12 off shifts....so I can't go home for lunch and crank them because the wife sleeps...and she needs her rest to do the houswork!

And when I get home in the morning I am beat, and have to make myself go to sleep...if I go home and start playing heavy metal...I will be up all day!! But I will be back on days in a next week so I will have plenty of opportunity.

I did play them for a couple of hours today....and I must say, they sound superb! The imaging is excellent! Much better than my old setup. I have Infinity Alpha 37c center channel and Infinity Beta ES250 surrounds which blend really nice. ( and dual MK V125 subs) I have had the Subs turned off to make sure I wasn't masking the bass of the T55's. Also, before I pass final jusdgement, I want to make sure they are "broken in" ...some people say this matters...some don't....but If these speakers start sounding any better, I won't know how I can describe them.

I bought these T55's as an Interim solution...for a year or so... until I could afford some Wharfedale Opus 2 or 3's ... now I am afraid that the Wharfedales won't sound THAT much better to justify the cost difference. These T55's are definitely worth the price!

 

[Guangui]

I bought these T55's as an Interim solution...for a year or so... until I could afford some Wharfedale Opus 2 or 3's ... now I am afraid that the Wharfedales won't sound THAT much better to justify the cost difference. These T55's are definitely worth the price!

And that's how I became a believer in the PSB Image Series...Haven't heard the Wharfadele Opus, so I cannot comment, but maybe the smartest move will be to buy a C40 or C60 center, and enjoy your setup for many years to come...Now, go and get some sleep.

 

[fmw]

What I like about my PSB T45's and B25's is that they play very well most music, but I've never been able to get them to sound right with Heavy Metal, and/or Album Rock. Don't know exactly what it is, but I find there is something missing, and they become somewhat harsh with this type of music.

.

How do you know? What is the music supposed to sound like? What is the reference? It is all amplified electronic and synthesized music.

We know what an acoustic violin or guitar is supposed to sound like. What reference do we have for heavy metal?

 

[am74Gibson]

Like I said earlier

How do you know? What is the music supposed to sound like? What is the reference? It is all amplified electronic and synthesized music.

We know what an acoustic violin or guitar is supposed to sound like. What reference do we have for heavy metal?

The term heavy metal insinuates a harsh, metallic sound...so I think this is normal. Maybe other speakers do not bring out this sound like it is supposed to be heard, and the PSB's do. I dunno, depends on your point of reference.

I have been playing all sorts of music on my t55's for a few days, and all types of music sounds great! Even heavy metal. The only slightly negative thing I have to say about these speakers ( and I have read in a couple of reviews) is that the tweeters (highs) seem a little subdued. Which if anything. would detract from heavy metal sounding harsh. Different people like different sounds, so some folks may like the tweeter subdued. I have found an easy MOD which makes mine sound perfect to me. I will start a new thread describing this tweeter mod. Look for it under the DIY forum.

Since I have done this MOD, I am sure it will be quite a while before I look at the Wharfedales!

 

[jliedeka]

How do you know? What is the music supposed to sound like? What is the reference? It is all amplified electronic and synthesized music.

We know what an acoustic violin or guitar is supposed to sound like. What reference do we have for heavy metal?

As a guitar player, I have to take issue with this. It's true that there is a staggering number of combinations of pickups, amps and effects. However, just like we can hear classical music in a concert setting, we can also hear popular music the same way and have an idea of what it is supposed to sound like. As far as I'm concerned, a Gibson played through a Marshall stack is an instrument just like a violin or nylon string guitar.

Plus, there are differences between acoustic violins and guitars. A student violin won't sound like a Stradivarius no matter how well recorded. I submit that we know as much about what metal is supposed to sound like as we do with classical music.

Jim

 

[bandphan]

while electric guitar players may have distinct syle and their sound, we still know what an accoustic guitar should sound like wheather its a martin or a washburn. That is the point trying to be made. Once any sound is amplified it has been changed and the challange will always be in reproduction. If the sound was meant to amplified in order to hear it what does one have to compare it to but another altered sound.