Receiver vs integrated Amp: setting up a new system

[lreinstein]

I am pretty new to the audiophile stuff and so would appreciate all advice. I am setting up systems in two rooms ---one will be a home theater (i will post questions on that in a different thread) and one is the Living Room where my wife and I listen to music---Mostly Classical, Jazz, and Vocals. For the Music (2 channel) system I have a pair of KEF XQ40 Floor standing speakers. Our music sources will be CD's (regular, not SACD for now).

1. My audio pro is advising the purchase of an integrated amplifier, and specifically the Marantz PM7001. I am wondering if this is a good choice? Alternatively I have considered simply using an older Marantz A/V receiver that I own (SR-585) or, getting the more expensive Denon PMA 2000IVR.

I am not looking for the absolute highest end audiophile reference system, but I am interested in a very good quality sound. I also want the components to be well matched and compatible in quality.

2. I also need to decide on a CD player to go with this system. He is recommending the Marantz SA8001 which seems like an excellent, if not (for me) pricey choice. Would I be served just as well by the less expensive CD5001? Or would I really hear the difference and should go for the higher end one. What parameters are key in this decision? And, I originally thought of getting a 5CD player like the CC40001., Would this be a mistake and not serve the system well?

3. Finally, I am perplexed by all of the audiophile terminology. Like what does "soundstage" mean? Is there a good glossary for this.

Once again, i am very grateful for any of the replies and help that you all give. I know I am crazy to get started because it is clear that there is no end in sight

Larry

 

[mtrycrafts]

I am pretty new to the audiophile stuff and so would appreciate all advice. I am setting up systems in two rooms ---one will be a home theater (i will post questions on that in a different thread) and one is the Living Room where my wife and I listen to music---Mostly Classical, Jazz, and Vocals. For the Music (2 channel) system I have a pair of KEF XQ40 Floor standing speakers. Our music sources will be CD's (regular, not SACD for now).

1. My audio pro is advising the purchase of an integrated amplifier, and specifically the Marantz PM7001. I am wondering if this is a good choice? Alternatively I have considered simply using an older Marantz A/V receiver that I own (SR-585) or, getting the more expensive Denon PMA 2000IVR.

I am not looking for the absolute highest end audiophile reference system, but I am interested in a very good quality sound. I also want the components to be well matched and compatible in quality.

2. I also need to decide on a CD player to go with this system. He is recommending the Marantz SA8001 which seems like an excellent, if not (for me) pricey choice. Would I be served just as well by the less expensive CD5001? Or would I really hear the difference and should go for the higher end one. What parameters are key in this decision? And, I originally thought of getting a 5CD player like the CC40001., Would this be a mistake and not serve the system well?

3. Finally, I am perplexed by all of the audiophile terminology. Like what does "soundstage" mean? Is there a good glossary for this.

Once again, i am very grateful for any of the replies and help that you all give. I know I am crazy to get started because it is clear that there is no end in sight

Larry

Welcome Larry.

You have the KEF now; how do you power it now or it just arrived?

Try your older receiver and give that a good listening to. No need to upgrade if it is capable of driving those speakers to the desired volumes. Old doesn't mean obsolete or inferior.
Does that Marantz have a digital input, or just stereo analog?

Do you currently have a CD player?
Nothing wrong with a 5 disc carousel player or just one disc. And, you really don't need to spend much for them at all.

Try on line for audio glossary or perhaps here at AH home page.
Soundstage is the perceived presence and location of the instruments your speakers present to you at your listening seat. Speaker location and its angle facing you will determine soundstage as well as what was recorded.

 

[lreinstein]

**I really would like your take on the differences between the high-end CD player and the "only good" CD player. It is tempting to want a 5CD turntable (convenience), but I am being told that since I have bought (not yet arrived) such high quality speakers, that I am cheating myself and not getting its full potential if i dont get a very high quality CD player. There are 3 players by Marantz under consideration--their best single play, their one step down single play, and their 5CD model.

Do you think I would be able to tell the difference on these speakers between the integrated amp and the receiver? and, if so what would it be?

Since CD Players have digital (optical) outputs, and the Receiver has a digital input, is this an advantage? The Amp does not have a digital input, so am I correct in thinking it is a question of which unit (the CD player or the Receiver) has the best DAC?


ANOTHER QUESTION AND CONSIDERATION:

For casual listening I have purchased the Squeezebox and intend to listen to my digitized music this way. Eventually I will re-rip my CD's in a lossless format... I wonder whether I will be able to tell the difference between the Squeezebox playing a lossless digitized CD, versus the CD player itself? Any opinions? Again, is this simply a matter of which unit (in this case Squeezebox3 or the CD player ) has the best Digital to Analog Converter? Anyone tried this ?

Thanks

Larry

 

[mtrycrafts]

**I really would like your take on the differences between the high-end CD player and the "only good" CD player. It is tempting to want a 5CD turntable (convenience), but I am being told that since I have bought (not yet arrived) such high quality speakers, that I am cheating myself and not getting its full potential if i dont get a very high quality CD player. There are 3 players by Marantz under consideration--their best single play, their one step down single play, and their 5CD model.

Do you think I would be able to tell the difference on these speakers between the integrated amp and the receiver? and, if so what would it be?

Since CD Players have digital (optical) outputs, and the Receiver has a digital input, is this an advantage? The Amp does not have a digital input, so am I correct in thinking it is a question of which unit (the CD player or the Receiver) has the best DAC?

I would listen to your audio advisor with a grain of salt, at best
CD is not cutting edge anymore.
Initially I would recommend you try your existing receiver. Does it have the capability to convert digital to analog? Do you now have a CD player with digital out? If so, try that with your KEF speaker when it gets there. Remember, it is the speakers that you hear along with the room's acoustic characteristics, not the CD player, not your amp, and certainly not the wires connecting them.
While some think they hear audible differences between CD players, that is rarely demonstrated under bias controlled comparisons. So, If you really want the convenience of that 5 disc player and the price is reasonable, buy that, Or, another brand of 5 disc player.
Or, depending on when you will get the DVD player for the HT and which one, you may want to wait and borrow that for a bit to listen to your speakers.

CD players are mature components on the whole. Remember, we/humans, have a good imagination for things and a great belief engine to mess things up.
In the end, no need to rush things. And, perhaps your audio advisor would demonstrate those three CD players, under double blind listening conditions with levels matched. See what he has to say to that

ANOTHER QUESTION AND CONSIDERATION:
For casual listening I have purchased the Squeezebox and intend to listen to my digitized music this way. Eventually I will re-rip my CD's in a lossless format... I wonder whether I will be able to tell the difference between the Squeezebox playing a lossless digitized CD, versus the CD player itself? Any opinions? Again, is this simply a matter of which unit (in this case Squeezebox3 or the CD player ) has the best Digital to Analog Converter? Anyone tried this ?

Thanks

Larry

If you have your CDs on the squeeze box in a lossless format, there should not be a difference from that and a CD, period. Try that also with your existing receiver. Analog to digital is not rocket science.

 

[lreinstein]

What do you think of the Marantz integrated amp? Is there a better option?

 

[MUDSHARK]

You received good advice about the cd player. Differences between modest priced recent cd players and high-end models are subtle at best. Even less so if the receiver has digital inputs since you will only be using the player as a transport. However, most excellent 2 channel receivers or integrated amps eschew the whole didital connections.

You may wish to consider Outlaw's receiver ( on sale I believe) or an integrated by NAD (good value at a reasonable price). I'm not familiar with your speakers but consider the need for amplification based on the demands of your speakers (4 ohms, 6 ohms, 8 ohms and sensitivity as well). Most HT enthusiasts believe there is little difference in sound quality between receivers. However, 2-channel classical music enthusiasts take a much different opinion. Marantz is a good brand but a visit to AudioAdvisor.com would be useful in getting some different high quality companies to consider.

Consider listening to some amplifiers well above your budget such as Bryston to determine if the sound quality differences are worth it.

 

[tbewick]

I am pretty new to the audiophile stuff and so would appreciate all advice. I am setting up systems in two rooms ---one will be a home theater (i will post questions on that in a different thread) and one is the Living Room where my wife and I listen to music---Mostly Classical, Jazz, and Vocals. For the Music (2 channel) system I have a pair of KEF XQ40 Floor standing speakers. Our music sources will be CD's (regular, not SACD for now).

1. My audio pro is advising the purchase of an integrated amplifier, and specifically the Marantz PM7001. I am wondering if this is a good choice? Alternatively I have considered simply using an older Marantz A/V receiver that I own (SR-585) or, getting the more expensive Denon PMA 2000IVR.

I am not looking for the absolute highest end audiophile reference system, but I am interested in a very good quality sound. I also want the components to be well matched and compatible in quality.

2. I also need to decide on a CD player to go with this system. He is recommending the Marantz SA8001 which seems like an excellent, if not (for me) pricey choice. Would I be served just as well by the less expensive CD5001? Or would I really hear the difference and should go for the higher end one. What parameters are key in this decision? And, I originally thought of getting a 5CD player like the CC40001., Would this be a mistake and not serve the system well?

3. Finally, I am perplexed by all of the audiophile terminology. Like what does "soundstage" mean? Is there a good glossary for this.

Once again, i am very grateful for any of the replies and help that you all give. I know I am crazy to get started because it is clear that there is no end in sight

Larry

On the question of DACs, a test I've heard recommended is to play a low level sinusoidal signal on the player and check for errors. Poor quality CD players may introduce audible errors to low-level signals. A modern, good quality CD player will probably have no trouble with this test.

Mtrycrafts has commented before on how frequency response and dynamic range are good checks for CD player performance. This paper gives a detailed description of how these tests should be done:

Dunn, J. (2003). "Measurement Techniques for Digital Audio", Audio Precision Application Note #5, Audio Precision.
http://ap.com/library/technotes.htm

I couldn't find any useful performance measurements of the Marantz CD5001. Stereophile has done some tests on the 8001:

http://www.stereophile.com/hirezplayers/1007mar/index5.html

Assessing the performance of audio system components is quite complex, but the traditional tests of frequency response and dynamic range are usually quite helpful. Broadly speaking, an advantage which purely electronic devices have over tranducers is better linearity.

The two integrated amplifiers you mentioned are probably excellent. Perhaps you might be interested in the Behringer EP1500 power amplifier? Using this with your current Marantz receiver as a pre-amp, you would get much higher power output than either of the integrated amplifiers you mentioned.

http://www.behringer.com/EP1500/index.cfm?lang=ENG

 

[mtrycrafts]

What do you think of the Marantz integrated amp? Is there a better option?

Marantz makes good equipment. Is the price worth it? I have no idea.
Alternatives? Better alternatives? I am sure there must be.
Try your present older receiver/amp and see what is happening with that and your speaker first.