Separate amplifier (s) or internal?

[av_phile]

But I definitely fail to understand your anal retentive attitude with specs in general and your venom towards the Japanese, particularly the Z-9. Do I detect a tinge of envy when you see that your mega buck Euro amp has given you so little for what you paid but the Z-9 gives you so much more.

Dont worry, we all suffer from the dreaded sour grapes syndrome, I have a surefire cure, put your high specced junk on eBay and pray that some sucker pays you 50% of what you paid and then conjure up all your financial resources and rush to your nearest Yamaha/Denon/Marantz dealer and put your money down for their flagship and hear what you have been missing apart from the specs.

Oh, just to enlighten you on my set-up, I currently use an old multichannel ROTEL RSP960 for my preamp mated to a stereo ACURUS A250 and a 3-ch 200X3 power amps conservatively rated with all channels driven at 250 and 200 watts continuous, respectively, into 8 ohms to form a 5 channel config. And they deliver 350 watts, and 300 watts continuous into 4 ohms, resepctively. If I have to upgrade, it certainly won't be to any flagship japanese receiver or integrateds out there. There's none that can even it match it. I have graduated from using an Onkyo P308 preamp and an M308 stereo power amp to go back. The latter is rated at 310 watts into 6ohms at 1Khz DIN, and the Acurus beats it by a mile. For those who understand, they can see what I mean.

Oh and I've checked Ebay, you may be interested to get a brand new Z9 being auctioned off at $2,999.95. There's so far only 1 bid and there's just 5 days left to go. I think that is the right price for this.

 

[Ross]

Zip,
...and you called me crazy in my predictions of what these types of "discussions" turn into back in that other thread...



Play nice fellas...

 

[Yamahaluver]

Having used Krell, ADCOM, HK,B&K and other so-called esoterica including Parasound or Parasite sound, my current crop of Yamaha MX-830/1000 and MX-1 thrashes them in every department including power output and sonic character. I have heard power amps from Denon as well as Marantz like their PA series and can tell you that the Japanese power amps are among the most neutral, none of them leave any mark on the signals the so-called Esoteric $$$$ garbage do and isnt that what music is all about. Sadly few will get to know or hear a Pioneer Elite or SONY ES Legato Linear amp in the US as the Japanese learnt that prejudice is a hard thing to counter with, no matter what the quality is.

The Yamaha handsomely drives 1000W into 1ohms and therefore perfectly suited to drive their own difficult handling NS-1000 speakers. The Rotel doesnt even come close to the sonic character and only Musical Fidelity, Audio Research come close.

To make a broad banded statement that anything from Japan is hype and over rated goes to show the narrow mindness and bias and sadly there is no cure on earth for malady of this kind.

 

[Ross]

"my current crop of Yamaha MX-830/1000 and MX-1 thrashes them in every department including power output and sonic character."

"Japanese power amps are among the most neutral, none of them leave any mark on the signals the so-called Esoteric $$$$ garbage do and isnt that what music is all about"


Just remember that these are all 100% subjective opinions that you put forth. There's no right or wrong subjective opinions, but they are still subjective nonetheless.


"The Yamaha handsomely drives 1000W into 1ohms"

really...?

best,

 

[av_phile]

To make a broad banded statement that anything from Japan is hype and over rated goes to show the narrow mindness and bias and sadly there is no cure on earth for malady of this kind.

LOL. On the contrary, its your bigotrous love for your pathetic yamaha that indicts you of the same narrowmindedness and bias.

 

[av_phile]

"

"The Yamaha handsomely drives 1000W into 1ohms"

really...?

best,

He's just talking through his nose. I have yet to hear of an audiophile who upgraded from a Krell to a Yamaha. LOL

Subjective opinions are one thing. Each has his own, no arguing there It's when the technical specs say more than what the amp can realistically deliver that I find distressing.

 

[Yamahaluver]

I luckily have the receipt from my 1990 Krell purchase from Singer Audio NYC just for guys like you as this is typical response from a so-called audiophool who goes by his wallet, his ego and not by his ears. You are talking through your ego and it is apparent that it has been hurt, sad fact is that there are plenty like you who hasnt even heard the Yamaha or for that matter any good Japanese amp, you base your opinion on the country of origin and you wont even consider a Japanese amp of speaker. Open your horizons a bit and the world would be a much better place. I also downgraded to the NS-1000 from ML Quest, I know few others in this forum who downgraded to the cheaper Yamaha from their high end stuff, I wont name them but dont be surprised if they surface and tell their own stories.

BTW: if money is what you are after Yamaha Japan makes MX-10000 amp for US$15000. I doubt your bank balance is even at 1/4 of that amount. Had to drop that in since you consider that I am talking through my nose, the Krell cost me $3800 and I sold it to another audiophool like you for $2900 after using it for six months. I picked up the Yamaha from Rabsons in Brooklyn, NY for $1600 which is roughly half of what I spend on the Krell. By the way, go to www.audioreview.com and see the review for this amps, you will notice that I am not the only one who downgraded from Krell and other esoterica.

 

[av_phile]

BTW: if money is what you are after Yamaha Japan makes MX-10000 amp for US$15000. I doubt your bank balance is even at 1/4 of that amount. Had to drop that in since you consider that I am talking through my nose, the Krell cost me $3800 and I sold it to another audiophool like you for $2900 after using it for six months. I picked up the Yamaha from Rabsons in Brooklyn, NY for $1600 which is roughly half of what I spend on the Krell. By the way, go to www.audioreview.com and see the review for this amps, you will notice that I am not the only one who downgraded from Krell and other esoterica.

Ha ha ha, your limited understanding betrays you. It's so obvious it's you who speak through you're wallet not your ears. Nothing in my posts ever quotes a single price on the amps/receivers i've mentioned. Because I really couldn't care less how much they cost as long as they please me with how they sound and how they look. And reading an accurate technical power spec that allows me to expect only what it can deliver is part of my pleasure in owning one.

 

[Yamahaluver]

Ha ha ha, your limited understanding betrays you. It's so obvious it's you who speak through you're wallet not your ears. Nothing in my posts ever quotes a single price on the amps/receivers i've mentioned. Because I really couldn't care less how much they cost as long as they please me with how they sound and how they look. And reading an accurate technical power spec that allows me to expect only what it can deliver is part of my pleasure in owning one.

Yes your most exalted Mastah,

I humbly bow to thee, your knowledge and esoteric taste is far above my proletariat humble capacity. Let me and others rot with our low grade, cheap, low powered, hyped Japanese products while you bask in glory at your possesion of overrated hyped mega bucks crap.

 

[rgriffin25]

"hyped Japanese products while you bask in glory at your possesion of overrated hyped mega bucks crap."

"You are talking through your ego and it is apparent that it has been hurt, sad fact is that there are plenty like you who hasnt even heard the Yamaha or for that matter any good Japanese amp, you base your opinion on the country of origin and you wont even consider a Japanese amp of speaker." Quoted from Yamahaluver

I don't wish to get in the middle of this dispute. However I would like to ask how the country of origin became a defense stratagy? I am sure I speak for many others when I say this.. I am a bit offended when you say that ANY of us would discredit a product based on where it was produced. It is obvious just by your user name which company you are loyal to. Feel free to defend the products you love based on there performance NOT where they come from.

 

[Ross]

Guys,
We have all built up our own personal biases and preconcieved notions on A/V gear based off of ownership, experiences, reviews, rumors, image, lab tests, etc.

Lets just not let all this stuff get the best of us, and detract from why we meet in places like this in the first place...

...and if you guys have any further personal attacks to voice, please just send them to one another privately via e-mail...(especially concerning countries of origin, personal finances, and subjective opinions)...

Hopefully the moderators won't actually have to "moderate" this thread any time soon...

best,

 

[Yamahaluver]

"hyped Japanese products while you bask in glory at your possesion of overrated hyped mega bucks crap."

"You are talking through your ego and it is apparent that it has been hurt, sad fact is that there are plenty like you who hasnt even heard the Yamaha or for that matter any good Japanese amp, you base your opinion on the country of origin and you wont even consider a Japanese amp of speaker." Quoted from Yamahaluver

I don't wish to get in the middle of this dispute. However I would like to ask how the country of origin became a defense stratagy? I am sure I speak for many others when I say this.. I am a bit offended when you say that ANY of us would discredit a product based on where it was produced. It is obvious just by your user name which company you are loyal to. Feel free to defend the products you love based on there performance NOT where they come from.

Please read his earlier posts throughout the forum and you will see that he is bashing all amps of Japanese origin and just not one brand.

I openly declare my love for Yamaha but will defend other brands like Marantz, SONY ES, Pioneer Elite, Accuphase, Denon with equal fervor and I wouldn’t hesitate to back brands like Canton, Einstein, MB Quart, Sonus Farber etc. which are from Europe.

The only time he claims to have owned a Japanese brand was his Onkyo M series power amp which even I would admit wasn’t the best offering from Japan and he bases all his opinion on that one piece of equipment.

He goes to challenge my ownership of Krell just because I sold that and bought a Yamaha amp. What does all this tell you so far?

I am not accusing anyone else so I dont see the reason for you to go on the defensive or take offense for that matter, just clarifying the misinformation he is trying to propagate with his highly subjective, prejudiced views.

Anyways, my last post in this regard, I have spoken enough and leave it to others to come to their own conclusion.

 

[rgriffin25]

My only point is that your responses would have had as much impact WITHOUT Japanese this and Japanese that. That was all I was getting at. I will leave this thread now so you two may continue.

Have Fun!

 

[av_phile]

It is really amazing and often laughable to what extent these discussions have degenerated into. That my comments on amps whose power specifications are obviosly overstated and betrayed by their power consumption and weight should be taken as an afront to someon'e cherished gears is, really, an indictment of how personal preference can take on religious, if not bigotrous, dimensions. And some people just can't understand the point of your post, and would put words into your mouth to support their misplaced defensiveness. But, that's how things are in real life.

If we are interested in the truth about audio as this forum's by-word, i don't see why personal preferences should get in the way of discussing the truth behind technical specifactions.

 

[annunaki]

I also do not wish to get in the middle of this. I will say that I am not partial to where an amplifier is made, I could care less. As long as it gives me the power it claims and is as true to the source as is possible, I will take a look at it.

 

[rgriffin25]

Well that was the point that I was trying to make. I've never considered the place of origin when buying my products.

 

[supernidri]

Fanboys

OMF you two are missing the point entirely. I've owned gear from: US, Canada, Norway, Italy, Japan, even Australia. And that's a beautiful thing. To have a US front end, feeding into a Norwegian amp, powering an Italian set of speakers.. man, that's what globalisation is all about, man. Man. You guys are like a hi-fi version of the stupid PS3 vs XBOX360 fanboy debate. Grow up and enjoy the content.

 

[supernidri]

P.s.

With "you two" I meant AV_phile and Yamahaluver, of course. I concur with the moderator's opinions. Like a proper brown nose.

 

[Seth=L]

With "you two" I meant AV_phile and Yamahaluver, of course. I concur with the moderator's opinions. Like a proper brown nose.

Let me get this straight, you joined the forum to make a point on a 3 year old thread?

 

[Davemcc]

Let me get this straight, you joined the forum to make a point on a 3 year old thread?

It takes some people a long time to get up the nerve to speak up in public.