new a/v receiver frustration

[1BadGnx]

Hi, I am new to the forum, and i hope you all can help me out with a my lack of understanding todays technology. I used to think i knew what i was doing when it came to hooking up my componets, but after buying a new receiver i guess i was wrong. I don't have a lot of money to spend on this stuff like most of you, but i wanted to have a respected brand at an affordable cost i thought i found it. I just bought a Denon avr-787 to replace my sony str-de835 which nothing is wrong with, i just wanted something new with more decoding and sound fields. Well to cut right down to the problem, i hooked up my speakers, my dvd player, and cd player, turned on the denon and was expecting it to really rock, well it did not!!!! I had to turn the volume up to at least 45db to hear any sound, thats like almost all the way up, is it not? With my sony, i did not even have my volume up 1/4 and it was 10x louder than the denon, plus, the subwoofer was not even giving off any bass with the denon. Now before anybody say's i'm stupid, i did hook up every thing to there proper inputs, after all i did hook up that sony and it rocks harder and louder than this denon. What could be wrong, and why is the preformance not what i expected from such a well respected company like Denon??
thank you all for your time in reading this, i hope you will be able to help me out.

 

[Adam]

Welcome to the forum, 1BadGnx!

Sorry to hear that you're running into this. Sure can be frustrating, as you say. I'll try to download the owners manual to look into some possible issues.

First, let me ask if you level matched your speakers. Also, does that Denon have an auto set-up feature? If so, did you run it?

Settings on one volume knob don't necessarily relate well to the settings on a volume knob from a different manufacturer, so I wouldn't worry too much about that. Let me look into the manual, and I'll get back to you.

Adam

 

[Adam]

I downloaded the manual. I see that it does have an auto set-up. If you haven't run it, then I'd say go ahead and do that. It should do a good job of level-matching the speakers. Once that is done, a setting of "0dB" on the volume will probably be equal to an output of about 70dB. So, if your volume says "-45dB" then it really isn't that loud (and happens to be just about where I normally listen to things).

One thing that those auto set-ups seem to do, regardless of manufacturer, is set all speakers to "large." You mentioned a sub, so it's probable that is the reason that the sub is not as loud with the new receiver. You'll want to go in a manually change the speaker settings to "small" (assuming that you're running bookshelves and/or have a nice sub). Also, make sure that it's set up to output sound to your sub. After that, you'll probably notice a lot more volume from the sub.

Please let us know if this helps out and if you need anything else. Thanks.

Adam

 

[1BadGnx]

Yes denon does have an auto set up and i did not run it. No i did not do any level match with the speakers. I guess i was expecting the denon to do what the sony did when i turn it on, just be loud! Thanks again Adam, hope to hear back from you.

 

[avaserfi]

I downloaded the manual. I see that it does have an auto set-up. If you haven't run it, then I'd say go ahead and do that. It should do a good job of level-matching the speakers. Once that is done, a setting of "0dB" on the volume will probably be equal to an output of about 70dB. So, if your volume says "-45dB" then it really isn't that loud (and happens to be just about where I normally listen to things).

One thing that those auto set-ups seem to do, regardless of manufacturer, is set all speakers to "large." You mentioned a sub, so it's probable that is the reason that the sub is not as loud with the new receiver. You'll want to go in a manually change the speaker settings to "small" (assuming that you're running bookshelves and/or have a nice sub). Also, make sure that it's set up to output sound to your sub. After that, you'll probably notice a lot more volume from the sub.

Please let us know if this helps out and if you need anything else. Thanks.

Adam

Adam is dead on with this. Running the auto set-up with the Denon will set speaker levels and delays. He is also right that you will probably want to go through and set your speakers back to small after the run. One thing I would add to his recommendation is go through and look at the crossover settings after you run the auto set-up. Likely they aren't set correctly, I would recommend setting the crossover at 80Hz for all your speakers. This will get your speakers playing down to 80Hz and your sub playing 80Hz and below which will allow for less localization of the lows as it should be.

Also, as Adam pointed out many receivers start at a negative volume for example my Denon goes from -80 all the way up to I think 30. My regular listening volume for movies is around -15.

With all this done you will likely have far better sound than you did with your Sony as everything will be set up properly!

 

[astrodon]

Yes, follow the recommendations of the earlier posts. And to confirm what avaserfi said, when using my Sony ES receiver in my living room, my volume knob is typically set at -40 dB to get a volume that I think is appropriate. Yet my Denon receiver in my home theater has to be set typically to -25 dB (a higher number) to get an appropriate volume out. The dB settings on receivers from different vendors are arbitrary for the most part.

 

[Seth=L]

The -45dB is not very loud. I am assuming the Sony had Absolute volume where as the Denon has relative volume. If you continue adjusting the volume up the number will become smaller until it hits 0 and then maybe it will continue up to +10 to 20 as the max volume. 0 is considered reference level, which I don't really ever have the need to be at reference level. -20 usually does me just fine.

 

[bigbangtheory]

you will probably want to go through and set your speakers back to small after the run!

I am curious why you want them set to small, wouldn't that just take away some of the freq range to the speakers? Or does it actually control volume levels? I only ask because I have my mains set to large, and used to have my surrounds set to small - but I changed the surrounds to large, thinking I'd get a wider freq range sent to them.

 

[avaserfi]

I am curious why you want them set to small, wouldn't that just take away some of the freq range to the speakers? Or does it actually control volume levels? I only ask because I have my mains set to large, and used to have my surrounds set to small - but I changed the surrounds to large, thinking I'd get a wider freq range sent to them.

Large speakers: Loudspeakers that can reproduce flat full range (approx. 20Hz – 20kHz) undistorted frequencies.

Small speakers: Loudspeakers that cannot accurately reproduce full range (approx. 20Hz – 20kHz) frequencies and which would need a subwoofer to compliment lower frequency response.

Source.

If you have a full range speaker there isn't a big deal setting to large, but if you don't running speakers set to large runs the risk of ruining the speaker in a variety of ways. If you are listening to loud you could blow the speaker (ask Greg Gable about pure direct which lacks bass management, similar to large setting, and his speakers ) or you will be adding distortion/noise to your sound because the speakers will try to play lower than they can and the driver could break up (lose uniformity) or bottom out.

In general, even with speakers that can play lower like towers I still recommend setting speakers to small especially if a competent sub is involved.

 

[bigbangtheory]

Large speakers: Loudspeakers that can reproduce flat full range (approx. 20Hz – 20kHz) undistorted frequencies.

Small speakers: Loudspeakers that cannot accurately reproduce full range (approx. 20Hz – 20kHz) frequencies and which would need a subwoofer to compliment lower frequency response.

Source.

If you have a full range speaker there isn't a big deal setting to large, but if you don't running speakers set to large runs the risk of ruining the speaker in a variety of ways. If you are listening to loud you could blow the speaker (ask Greg Gable about pure direct which lacks bass management, similar to large setting, and his speakers ) or you will be adding distortion/noise to your sound because the speakers will try to play lower than they can and the driver could break up (lose uniformity) or bottom out.

In general, even with speakers that can play lower like towers I still recommend setting speakers to small especially if a competent sub is involved.

AH! Thanks! I get it. I will make the adjustment to small as well, which will be even better once the new sub comes into the system.

Jeez, I hope Greg didn't blow his speakers!

 

[avaserfi]

AH! Thanks! I get it. I will make the adjustment to small as well, which will be even better once the new sub comes into the system.

Jeez, I hope Greg didn't blow his speakers!

No problem .

Actually he blew a driver a while back, but they went to the hospital and got fixed up so now they are all better all under warranty I believe!

 

[ParadigmDawg]

Leave me out of it; I was drunk

If you have a full range speaker there isn't a big deal setting to large, but if you don't running speakers set to large runs the risk of ruining the speaker in a variety of ways. If you are listening to loud you could blow the speaker (ask Greg Gable about pure direct which lacks bass management, similar to large setting, and his speakers ) or you will be adding distortion/noise to your sound because the speakers will try to play lower than they can and the driver could break up (lose uniformity) or bottom out.

.

 

[bigbangtheory]

*insert east Texas twang* I tell hue whahht. I cain't hep it!!

Drunk learning experiences. Been there. Done that. Thankfully, not so much working with av gear.

 

[Davemcc]

Yes denon does have an auto set up and i did not run it. No i did not do any level match with the speakers. I guess i was expecting the denon to do what the sony did when i turn it on, just be loud! Thanks again Adam, hope to hear back from you.

This Denon will do just about anything you want it to, but you will have to acquaint yourself with it's features and setup menus to get the most out of it.