Trade Wars

[Trell]

I think our whole Gov't needs a 'douche'

Please expand on that. I would love to be proven wrong.

 

[Mikado463]

Please expand on that. I would love to be proven wrong.

a thorough cleansing of both parties for starters, for there's definitely a foul smell about ........

 

[GO-NAD!]

OK, let's assume that the US government is actually efficient- that begs the question "Why are the other countries spending more per capita than the US?".

Why should one country spend as much as the others? Why would this be a requirement?

Look at all of the ways other countries do better than the US-

- Education- the US used to be at/near the top and now, it's ~number 28.
- Nutrition- too much food is unhealthy and people are addicted to it.
- Health care- you nailed that one and it's not lost on anyone who has had to deal with it. Another problem is the care, itself.
- Mental Health Care- it was gutted and now, it's very slow to improve. It exists, but it's far from adequate

From your arguments, it doesn't seem that you're digging very deeply into the wasteful spending by the US Federal government- Sen WIlliam Proxmire gave 'Golden Fleece Awards' for excessive/wasteful spending, starting in the late-'60s. Go deeper into some of the points I have made- I don't think you'll be as forgiving.

The other G7 countries don't spend more for its own sake. But, they all have universal health care, so that's a factor. There may be more - and more generous - social programs in the other countries. I can't say for sure.

I'm not suggesting that the US government should spend more. Each country can follow its own policies in that regard. But, it's clear that the US government doesn't spend as much per capita as the others G7 countries. The reason its debt and deficit are so high, is because it won't collect nearly enough revenue to pay for that lower spending.

There is waste and inefficiency to be found in all governments' expenditures. It's not just in the US.

Have a read about this boondoggle from my own country.

Phoenix pay system - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

I'm all for governments being careful with taxpayers' money. But, the idea that waste, inefficiency and corruption are the primary reasons for the US government debt and deficit problem comes from people with agendas to push. They know that nobody will ever find enough waste and inefficiency to eliminate the huge annual deficits. But, they don't want their taxes to go up.

 

[mtrycrafts]

Not all of them but insider trading.

Like what's his name in DOD, traded $500k a day or so before some announcement.

 

[mtrycrafts]

That's nice but it's still $36 trillion in debt. Why does it keep going up?

Simple, not enough collections from people who have it. Don't forget, corporations are people too per supreme court.

 

[mtrycrafts]

...and imposing import tariffs.

Oh, and screwing over the poor.

On the poor who buy a lot.

 

[lovinthehd]

Trump- sounds about right, sadly. Not to mention if the gov't cuts will actually go to paying off the debt.....

$0-17,000
-$940

His plan is more to simply give the tariff benefits, if they become appreciable, back to himself and his buddies via tax cuts. He's not doing reducing debt in term 47 any more than 45....

 

[mtrycrafts]

That's nice but it's still $36 trillion in debt. Why does it keep going up?

Here you go, another reason why and most likely this is not the only one:
$75 billion firm wins carve-out in tax bill after lobbying push

 

[Mr._Clark]

IMO a part of the SS and Medicare trust funds should be invested in the Total Stock Market fund similar to Thrift Savings C Fund for greater returns. Long term S&P 500 has returned 8.6% it has been up more years than down.

U.S. Stock Market Returns - a history from the 1870s to 2024 | The Measure of a Plan

Facts and figures on U.S. stock market returns from 1871 to 2024. Annual returns, likelihood of losing money, best / worst months, and more.

themeasureofaplan.com

I have a high percentage of my retirement funds in an S&P 500 index fund. Fortunately, I didn't panic and sell low and it is coming back.

The stock market is nearing a record high after cratering in April. Here's why.

Wall Street experts break down what's behind the market rebound as S&P 500 and Nasdaq approach record highs.

www.cbsnews.com

On the other hand, I have to believe the markets would be doing a h*ll of a lot better if Trump would just shut up and do nothing.

 

[Mikado463]

His plan is more to simply give the tariff benefits, if they become appreciable, back to himself and his buddies via tax cuts. He's not doing reducing debt in term 47 any more than 45....

Exactly, just like the two clowns before him, 44 & 46 .........

 

[Trell]

Exactly, just like the two clowns before him, 44 & 46 .........

That is a false equivalence, but I don't think you would understand the explanation anyhow, given that some age more gracefully than others.....

 

[lovinthehd]

Exactly, just like the two clowns before him, 44 & 46 .........

No, 44 and 46 did better jobs by far at that (especially not the tax cut for the wealthy)

 

[Dude#1279435]

That is a false equivalence, but I don't think you would understand the explanation anyhow, given that some age more gracefully than others.....

I can't think of an equivalent to the MAGA cult and Trump evangelicals.

 

[Trell]

I can't think of an equivalent to the MAGA cult and Trump evangelicals.

Krugman is comparing Trump and MAGA to the Mao’s Cultural Revolution and Maoists.

>>>...
If you want a model for what’s happening to America, think of Mao’s Cultural Revolution.

But wait, wasn’t Mao hard left while America has been taken over by the hard right? Well, why do you think there’s a big difference between the two? I’m a believer in horseshoe theory, which says that the extreme left and the extreme right are more like each other than either is like the political center.
...
Once you’ve seen the parallel between what MAGA is trying to do and China’s Cultural Revolution, the similarities are everywhere. Maoists sent schoolteachers to do farm labor; Trumpists are talking about putting civil servants to work in factories. ...
<<<

Trump’s Cultural Revolution

The first thing we do is we kill intellectual inquiry

paulkrugman.substack.com

 

[Dude#1279435]

MSN

>>>The researchers found that prices on the imported goods in their study increased by roughly 3% between the first wave of tariffs in early March and the end of June. At the same time, categories of domestic goods that typically compete with imports saw price increases of around 2%.

The data indicates that domestic goods that don't typically face significant competition from imports, like most food and beverage categories, have not seen a corresponding increase in price.

And although goods from China saw the largest increase in prices in the study, the increase was far below the tariff rates that have vacillated between 10% and 145% on imports from that country during the timeframe.

The researchers said the timing of price increases suggests uncertainty among companies about how the tariffs will play out, given recent changes. Another possible explanation for these smaller, broader price increases on both imported and domestic goods is that they offer retailers a way to pass the cost of tariffs along across a portfolio of products rather than hiking prices on imports alone.<<<

 

[Trell]

MSN

>>>The researchers found that prices on the imported goods in their study increased by roughly 3% between the first wave of tariffs in early March and the end of June. At the same time, categories of domestic goods that typically compete with imports saw price increases of around 2%.

The data indicates that domestic goods that don't typically face significant competition from imports, like most food and beverage categories, have not seen a corresponding increase in price.

And although goods from China saw the largest increase in prices in the study, the increase was far below the tariff rates that have vacillated between 10% and 145% on imports from that country during the timeframe.

The researchers said the timing of price increases suggests uncertainty among companies about how the tariffs will play out, given recent changes. Another possible explanation for these smaller, broader price increases on both imported and domestic goods is that they offer retailers a way to pass the cost of tariffs along across a portfolio of products rather than hiking prices on imports alone.<<<

Thanks for that link.

So the domestic producers of goods that have imported competition are increasing their prices, who would've guessed that would happen? The same happened with the price of US steel in the first Trump administration with the Trump steel tariffs.

From your linked article we've the following graph:

 

[lovinthehd]

He's back to claiming making deals....err, threats.

 

[Dude#1279435]

Thanks for that link.

So the domestic producers of goods that have imported competition are increasing their prices, who would've guessed that would happen? The same happened with the price of US steel in the first Trump administration with the Trump steel tariffs.

From your linked article we've the following graph:

View attachment 74011

I think you can make the argument for wanting more American goods produced (and less China control), but will it equate to a lower price.......... also like you said that the domestic price will come just under the import price. So in the end Trumpists might be waving their flags cause it feels better, but with our higher standard of living.....

 

[Trell]

It's worth noting that all the trade "deals" that Trump is frantically trying to force on others, including the latest with a deadline August 1st, are not passed by Congress as a law but by executive orders. Any such proposed law will not pass the filibuster in the Senate either, with perhaps some exceptions to very restrictive ones that are targetted towards specific countries and sectors.

This means that the next administration can undo them in whole or in part, especially if it's a Democratic one.

 

[Trell]

I think you can make the argument for wanting more American goods produced (and less China control), but will it equate to a lower price.......... also like you said that the domestic price will come just under the import price. So in the end Trumpists might be waving their flags cause it feels better, but with our higher standard of living.....

Sure, there are arguments for tariffs. As an example, punitive tariffs have been used to combat state subsidies or price dumping. For instance, EU has a 45% tariff on EV from China for this reason since last October.

Getting all those manufacturing jobs back to USA will not happen, and the onshoring that happens will use robots and automation to reduce the number of unskilled workers needed.