Redirecting presence and back surround

[Anglofun]

Gents!

I have a Yamaha aventage a4a. I want to know if I can redirect the presence speakers and rear surround to ceiling speakers creating an Atmos effect? If I can, how?

Cheers,

Steve

 

[TLS Guy]

Gents!

I have a Yamaha aventage a4a. I want to know if I can redirect the presence speakers and rear surround to ceiling speakers creating an Atmos effect? If I can, how?

Cheers,

Steve

No you can't.

 

[Anglofun]

Thanks for the reply.

So if I want to do in ceiling speakers, can I use in ceiling for presence and for back surround?

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

No reason not to, but it won't be Atmos Atmos is discrete signals, just like the center, front left and right, etc.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[Anglofun]

No reason not to, but it won't be Atmos Atmos is discrete signals, just like the center, front left and right, etc.

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

Thank you.

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks for the reply.

So if I want to do in ceiling speakers, can I use in ceiling for presence and for back surround?

You can, wouldn't be ideal.

 

[Trebdp83]

Gents!

I have a Yamaha aventage a4a. I want to know if I can redirect the presence speakers and rear surround to ceiling speakers creating an Atmos effect? If I can, how?

Cheers,

Steve

The A4A can power seven speakers for a 7.1 or a 5.1.2 speaker configuration. Some wire up nine speakers and the A4A will switch between the Front Presence Speakers and Surround Back Speakers according to the input signal and selected DSP mode. If wanting height effects using Front Presence Speakers, they can be mounted on the front wall(Front Height), in the ceiling(Overhead) or placed on top of the Front Speakers using up firing modules(Dolby Enabled SP).

 

[Anglofun]

The A4A can power seven speakers for a 7.1 or a 5.1.2 speaker configuration. Some wire up nine speakers and the A4A will switch between the Front Presence Speakers and Surround Back Speakers according to the input signal and selected DSP mode. If wanting height effects using Front Presence Speakers, they can be mounted on the front wall(Front Height), in the ceiling(Overhead) or placed on top of the Front Speakers using up firing modules(Dolby Enabled SP).
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Thanks for this info, I did download the manual and saw this but I got confused. In my case where to install surround backs (according to dolby or DTS)at the right height is almost impossible ; what do you suggest? I need it in the ceiling.

Where do I put the presence ( I can't put them on front wall), if in ceiling, where do I put the surround back, in ceiling?

Struggling to clear this morning! I hope it is clear.

 

[Trebdp83]

The Surround Back speakers are meant to be at ear level with the Front, Center and Surround Speakers. Again, when playing Dolby Atmos or DTS:X tracks or when using the Dolby Surround or DTS Neural:X up mixers, the A4A cannot use both the Front Presence speakers and the Surround Back Speakers at the same time.

Just to clarify, are you talking about Surround or Surround Back speakers? There are no Surround Back speakers in the pics I posted from the manual. Those are the Surround Speakers. If you cannot place the Surround Speakers at ear level, things become even more complicated for you. You would then leave Front Presence and Surround Back Speakers out and configure the receiver for 5.1 and place the Surround Speakers in the ceiling just behind the listening position. This is not an entirely unknown practice as some simply cannot accommodate Surround Speakers at ear level in their room.

 

[Anglofun]

The Surround Back speakers are meant to be at ear level with the Front, Center and Surround Speakers. Again, when playing Dolby Atmos or DTS:X tracks or when using the Dolby Surround or DTS Neural:X up mixers, the A4A cannot use both the Front Presence speakers and the Surround Back Speakers at the same time.

Just to clarify, are you talking about Surround or Surround Back speakers? There are no Surround Back speakers in the pics I posted from the manual. Those are the Surround Speakers. If you cannot place the Surround Speakers at ear level, things become even more complicated for you. You would then leave Front Presence and Surround Back Speakers out and configure the receiver for 5.1 and place the Surround Speakers in the ceiling just behind the listening position. This is not an entirely unknown practice as some simply cannot accommodate Surround Speakers at ear level in their room.

I have been in the world of audio, 2 channel and multi channel for 25 years. Let go of multi channel for the last 6-7 years and finding my way back is quite something!!!

So if I understand this correctly, I won't gain much, if anything, by adding in ceiling speakers as presence and (it is back surround I am talking about) back surround in the ceiling. This will not give me a wanna be atmos effect. And if I understand it won't give me an ideal situation for DTS or Dolby.

Kind of a bummer !

 

[Anglofun]

Thinking ot loud here and thank you for your patience!

So, when looking at the drawings of the manual, Prresence can be aligned with the mains in the ceiling or just in front of the listening position. Which one is ideal?

 

[Eppie]

Thinking out loud here and thank you for your patience!

So, when looking at the drawings of the manual, Presence can be aligned with the mains in the ceiling or just in front of the listening position. Which one is ideal?

It's actually both. From left to right, the spacing typically lines up with the front speakers. From front to back, the positioning is just in front of the seating area. We're assuming that your surrounds are at ear level and that you are planning 5.1.2. If you're only surround speakers get mounted in the ceiling behind the seating area, then in-ceiling ATMOS / Presence is not recommended. Then you are better to stick with 5.1 or mount the presence speakers as Front Height above the mains. Angled speakers like SVS Prime Elevation are good for that purpose.

 

[Trebdp83]

Thinking ot loud here and thank you for your patience!

So, when looking at the drawings of the manual, Prresence can be aligned with the mains in the ceiling or just in front of the listening position. Which one is ideal?

Both pics of the ceiling speakers are meant to show them just ahead and above the listening position. Getting very near the optimal placement will fine as many have to make do with different ceiling and furniture layouts.

There are those with eleven channel systems that contain seven speakers at ear level and four height speakers for a 7.1.4 speaker configuration. The A4A processes and powers just seven channels. So, for Dolby Atmos or DTS:X and mixing signals using Dolby Surround or DTS:X, the optimal speaker configuration is 5.1.2 with the Front Presence Speakers mounted on the ceiling just ahead of the listening position.

Information meant for the Surround Back Speakers in some multichannel signals will be sent to the Surround speakers when using a 5.1.2 speaker configuration. Additionally, Yamaha receivers feature VSBS. When turned ON, the receiver will attempt to place Surround Back channel information accordingly using Virtual Surround Back Speakers when actual Surround Back Speakers are not present.

 

[Trebdp83]

There is much to gain by using Front Presence Speakers in the ceiling for Height effects. Using in ceiling Surround Back Speakers would not be advised as they should be placed at ear level along with the Front, Center, and Surround Speakers. Again, when using Front Presence Speakers, the Surround Back Speakers, if equipped, would not receive a signal when decoding Dolby Atmos and DTS:X or when using the Dolby Surround and DTS Neural:X up mixers.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

So if I understand this correctly, I won't gain much, if anything, by adding in ceiling speakers as presence

Welcome to your life....

I would install the "ATMOS" presence speakers in the ceiling directly above your seats and the "Surround" speakers in the ceiling behind your seat level (as far back as you can).

Might not be the "best possible", but still get you some good sounds, especially those ATMOS ceiling speakers directly above you.

Also turn the speaker levels for the ATMOS speakers +3dB to +6dB above all the other speakers' levels since many sound mixers tend to keep the ATMOS speaker levels on the low side.

Will be very cool when you hear sounds like helicopters above you like in the movie "Civil War".

4K - 8K Resolution and/or Dolby Atmos/DTSX Content Reviews

https://abcnews.go.com/GMA/Culture/jeff-bridges-returning-grid-tron-ares/story?id=109759257

forums.audioholics.com

 

[Anglofun]

This was very informative, level of knowledge is top notch here! So, in ceiling I shall do.

5.2.4
Surrounds are just above my ears. With a major PITA I could get them exactly at ear height. The Yamaha YPAO can compensate?

I have my eyes set on a pair of in ceiling speakers that are inclined at 45 degrees. So I would put the presence a bit ahead and the back surround for when they will play (depending on the mix) behind me 3-5 feet angled at 45?

Sounds right?


Then I adjust Only the presence "atmos" speakers will be +3 or 6 db tuned by ear.

 

[Trebdp83]

You just don't need the Surround Back Speakers and putting them in the ceiling with Front Presence Speakers while using Surround Speakers at or near ear level is just not a good way to go. Running a 5.1.4 configuration means using 5 ear level speakers, no Surround Back Speakers, and four Height speakers. You would need to move up to the RX-A6A to process and power nine channels for a proper 5.1.4 speaker configuration that will improve the Dolby Atmos and DTS:X presentation over 5.1.2.

 

[Anglofun]

Good evening,

Circling back here on the presence speakers. Looking at the info that Yamaha provides and Dolby Atmos (that seems to be mostly .4 and not my .2, I have a dilemma.

I bought POLK in ceiling speakers, but they are angles at about 45 degrees I would say. If Yamaha says to put them just above the listening when down firing, what distance would you say would be right for 45 degree speakers? 2-3 feet?

Being a bit anal here I know! But it isn't a joy making multiple holes in the ceiling.

Thanks so much!

 

[Eppie]

Good evening,

Circling back here on the presence speakers. Looking at the info that Yamaha provides and Dolby Atmos (that seems to be mostly .4 and not my .2, I have a dilemma.

I bought POLK in ceiling speakers, but they are angles at about 45 degrees I would say. If Yamaha says to put them just above the listening when down firing, what distance would you say would be right for 45 degree speakers? 2-3 feet?

Being a bit anal here I know! But it isn't a joy making multiple holes in the ceiling.

Thanks so much!

You want the drivers pointed at your head, basically. The on axis response is typically the same within 15 degrees, so you have a 15 degree window to play with if you want to mount them closer to the seating position.