Dolby Atmos music

[Hetfield]

Another interview thing is as you can tell based on my screen name that I just a slight Metallica fan but the DVD-Audio of the "black album" sucks. The sound is amazing but the mix sucks from Bob Rock. I do not like the way it's mixed especially Enter Sandman, I hate the way it was mixed and I don't understand what he was trying to do with it.

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[William Lemmerhirt]

I don't really understand Dolby Atmos music either. As I understand it for movies, it's for object based audio. Meaning if you are watching a movie in atmos and a plane is flying overhead, if you have atmos speakers placed correctly in you ceiling, then you are actually going to hear that plane flying over your head. Some people seem to have atmos module speakers sitting on top of say their front tower speakers or whatever. I can't see how that would give you the same effect as ceiling speakers. My receiver is capable of atmos, but I have not been inclined to run wire through my walls and put speakers in the ceiling. Lately I've been thinking about it because I got the new Roku Ultra, which seems to have a good amount of movies and shows in atmos.

But I'm confused about atmos music. Before surround sound sound I was perfectly happy with two channel music. Then I got my first surround receiver that had Pro-logic II music, and I was like wow, I like this as a change of pace. It was music in surround and it was subtle, it didn't hit you in the ears so to speak. Prologic II to seemed to take any ambience or other effects in the recording and send it to the surrounds. Dolby Surround seems to do the same thing. But music coming from overhead?? Like I said I don't understand it. Would certain instruments or vocals be mixed to overhead channels? I'm not sure I would like that. Mind you I haven't heard it so I really don't know. If I did put atmos speakers in the ceiling and rerun YPAO to identify those speakers, would those overhead speakers play every time I engaged Dolby Surround on the receiver? Yikes!! And the article says that even people listening with headphones, a sound bar, or sonos would be able to hear the difference in an atmos recording? I am lost at sea here

I don’t own any Atmos music but do have an Atmos system.
My thoughts are this. Part of the appeal of Atmos is not just sound overhead, which many people think is the point of it.(and will
Say a soundtrack is bad because they’re not getting hit in the head with crazy overhead sound). While that is absolutely part of it, with helicopters and planes and second story sound effects. The best parts of Atmos for me is when it places objects IN the room, and you hear all the subtleties.
The object rendered place’s objects on XYZ axes, and when the effect is put into use by a mixer that has taken the time to craft a quality track, it’s truly amazing. I can’t stress that part enough.
Problem is too many tracks aren’t done so expertly.
My point was though, I believe that Atmos music isn’t about placing musical instruments overhead, which does sound weird and unnatural. But to put sounds into the room, and bring the listener closer to, and into the music. Kinda like how PLII did. I generally liked PLIIX, save for some odd instrument placement on occasion.

DSU imo, is also very good for music. It’s very similar to PLII. Mostly the top speakers only carry ambient sounds, and what I would say is “the room”. The effect Ime is almost always very good.
So if you engage it for music I wouldn’t be concerned with random snare drums coming out of the top speakers.
DTSnx on the other hand is more aggressive and ime will place things oddly once in awhile. Especially when watching regular TV shows, it tends to place a lot of music overhead which cool. For about 5 seconds lol.
Ok. Just a couple cents...

 

[little wing]

Sounds like some of my favorite groups are available on DTS CDs. Steely Dan and the

I don’t own any Atmos music but do have an Atmos system.
My thoughts are this. Part of the appeal of Atmos is not just sound overhead, which many people think is the point of it.(and will
Say a soundtrack is bad because they’re not getting hit in the head with crazy overhead sound). While that is absolutely part of it, with helicopters and planes and second story sound effects. The best parts of Atmos for me is when it places objects IN the room, and you hear all the subtleties.
The object rendered place’s objects on XYZ axes, and when the effect is put into use by a mixer that has taken the time to craft a quality track, it’s truly amazing. I can’t stress that part enough.
Problem is too many tracks aren’t done so expertly.
My point was though, I believe that Atmos music isn’t about placing musical instruments overhead, which does sound weird and unnatural. But to put sounds into the room, and bring the listener closer to, and into the music. Kinda like how PLII did. I generally liked PLIIX, save for some odd instrument placement on occasion.

DSU imo, is also very good for music. It’s very similar to PLII. Mostly the top speakers only carry ambient sounds, and what I would say is “the room”. The effect Ime is almost always very good.
So if you engage it for music I wouldn’t be concerned with random snare drums coming out of the top speakers.
DTSnx on the other hand is more aggressive and ime will place things oddly once in awhile. Especially when watching regular TV shows, it tends to place a lot of music overhead which cool. For about 5 seconds lol.
Ok. Just a couple cents...

Thanks a lot William. I really appreciate you insight and information! It helps me understand atmos music much better.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Another interview thing is as you can tell based on my screen name that I just a slight Metallica fan but the DVD-Audio of the "black album" sucks. The sound is amazing but the mix sucks from Bob Rock. I do not like the way it's mixed especially Enter Sandman, I hate the way it was mixed and I don't understand what he was trying to do with it.

Sent from my Pixel 4 XL using Tapatalk

I’d love to hear the DVD-A version you speak of. I also love the sound of the black album, so I’m curious as to what you mean.
Your post reminded me of this video I saw the other night. As much as I love Metallica in the studio, it reminds me of why I wish they would have fired Lars after the master of puppets tour.

 

[nathan_h]

supersede stereo? sure, just like quad, sacd, and dvd-a (and dts music disks).....all of which have great examples of what the surround format can do for music....none of which broke into the mainstream. i cannot imagine atmos will be any different.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Sounds like some of my favorite groups are available on DTS CDs. Steely Dan and the


Thanks a lot William. I really appreciate you insight and information! It helps me understand atmos music much better.

I hope that I could provide something useful. FWIW, I am a proponent of Atmos in general. Iirc, you’re geared more towards music than films? So while I enjoy the upgrade, it might be less beneficial for you. Problem is, it’s kind of a trial by fire where you have to do it, or don’t. And I totally agree with the upfiring Atmos enabled modules. It’s not impossible to get them to work, but they are quite fussy, and I don’t think are nearly as good.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

supersede stereo? sure, just like quad, sacd, and dvd-a (and dts music disks).....all of which have great examples of what the surround format can do for music....none of which broke into the mainstream. i cannot imagine atmos will be any different.

Agreed. The likelihood of mainstream acceptance as very low. This has been true through most of the life of HI-FI. I feel like it’s gonna be worse now that everyone thinks they can have 11.4.6 sound from a soundbar and 5” “sub”.
Ugh.....

 

[cpp]

Agreed. The likelihood of mainstream acceptance as very low. This has been true through most of the life of HI-FI. I feel like it’s gonna be worse now that everyone thinks they can have 11.4.6 sound from a soundbar and 5” “sub”.
Ugh.....

You are so spot on. Just think we might even see pople attemtping to use Velcro to attach their speakers to the ceiling etc...

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

You are so spot on. Just think we might even see pople attemtping to use Velcro to attach their speakers to the ceiling etc...

ROFL!!!
Actually, now that you mention it... recently I saw a post where someone tried 3m two sided tape.(iirc)
Should’ve tried Gorilla glue spray!

 

[Meticulous G]

I found this article and wanted to some opinions on this guy's take the Dolby Atmos music is going to supercede stereo.

An audio engineer explains why Dolby Atmos Music is “definitely going to supersede stereo”

Dean St Studios' Jan 'Stan' Kybert, who’s worked with Paul Weller and Oasis, on why Atmos could succeed where others have failed

www.musicradar.com

I know I'm verry late to the party, but it took me this long to have enough of an interest in atmos music to seek opinions from peers

In the article, the "128 positions for sounds to be" sounds erroneous to me. From my understanding of atmos, there can be up to 128 different sounds, being moved through the 3D listening space at the same time (kinda like individual tracks)

"Reproduces up to 128 simultaneous audio objects in a mix for rich, realistic, and breathtaking sound" (see link below)

Dolby Atmos for the Home - Dolby Professional

Set up your Dolby Atmos home theater system for a powerful, moving audio experience. Discover recommended speaker placements for the perfect home cinema setup.

professional.dolby.com

Aand "object based sound" makes me feel that the difference from
5, 7, 9, 11.1/2 etc, and atmos, is instead of "discrete" sound information from each voice, instrument, etc, being given a channel or channels to come out of (and sometimes move to)
...each sound's origin can be plotted/placed within an xyz grid, then moved through that space in whatever manner the mixer wants, by processing that assigns which speakers work together to give the effect...but I could be wrong

Due to my long time favorite band (The Orb ((UK ambient/electronic)
employing unique production/mastering technics from their start in the late 80's (their stereo music was recorded in a way where massive amounts/layers/numbers of sounds create a 3D effect & would all seem to be different places and depths...some, even making the listener get up and look out the window, not joking) I'm no stranger to listening to music in multichannel, 'cause when I got my 1st marantz receiver with all channel stereo...it became my standard for listening to Orb

With this music where just plain stereo seemed 3D, playing those recordings in all ch. stereo made it seem like the music was a (fractal) tube that i was inside of, aand soaring through...totally tubular

PL II and and such would dilute the music to a point, where it lost its character, so those were all no go for me

Aand now I'm having the same experience as PL II with atmos (haven't found any orb available in atmos yet)

This is what caused me to seek audiophile opinions on it. Just having noises coming from all around me, doesn't make it better than stereo, if it looses its imaging, "heft"/presence, etc

My experience with atmos music so far has been that the sub is left to produce all the low end, which gives the heartiest music, very diluted character (the very reason that I went from bookshelves with a large sub, to towers with dual 10's, and the large sub) as my home theater matured through the late 90's (Orb had faaaar superior bass than everything else back then, aand in most cases...still does today)

It seems to me that it's probably possible to mix it in a way where the mains (or all channels) still produce a stereo image, then aspects/parts of the mid and upper ends of the recordings can be made to move around through the surrounds and elevation channels

...or at the very least, all channels should participate full time in the mid to lower registers of the rhythm portion of the music, perhaps...imo

Btw, I HIGHLY recommend The Orb (who are credited for pioneering ambient house, which is house music w/o the mindless, repetitive bass beat) to any and all music and sound lovers, and I recommend starting from their earlier days

Adventures Beyond the Ultraworld
U.F. Orb
Orb Live '93
Orbvs Terrarvm
Orblivion
Etc

There's also ton of live shows on YouTube, which, aside from the lower quality sound...is them at their best

Just my 79 cents...thx

I found this article and wanted to some opinions on this guy's take the Dolby Atmos music is going to supercede stereo.

An audio engineer explains why Dolby Atmos Music is “definitely going to supersede stereo”

Dean St Studios' Jan 'Stan' Kybert, who’s worked with Paul Weller and Oasis, on why Atmos could succeed where others have failed

www.musicradar.com

 

[ben_]

I think The Orb really benefits from good headphones or even listening in the car. You're right, the stereo mixes on those albums really are unique.

 

[Meticulous G]

I think The Orb really benefits from good headphones or even listening in the car. You're right, the stereo mixes on those albums really are unique.

Ya, true...you mean because ya get a better sense of immersion?

If that's the case, I mostly agree, but I did put my stereo/HT together specifically around listening to 120dB+ orB (much more difficult 25 yrs ago, than today, but my setup has also evolved)
...so listening on my main setup has never left me wanting

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I think The Orb really benefits from good headphones or even listening in the car. You're right, the stereo mixes on those albums really are unique.

I could see maybe the car. But checking out the orb right now in 7.3.4 with Dolby surround on(will also try DTSnx). Very very good!
I am lucky to have 14hz in room response, and between that and the immersive(atmos) speaker setup I don’t think headphones would be nearly as good. Sooner or later I’ll find out of course. If you like this type of music, I’d recommend Booka Shade, and Yello. They have albums in Atmos and damn they’re so good. Another one I go back to is infected mushroom. @lovinthehd turned me on to them.