Advice for patio sound

[blk00ss]

Hoping someone sees this response. Wasn't sure if I should start a new thread.

I managed to find my wiring path from the receiver out to the patio. Ordered my speakers and they should be here tomorrow I believe. Last night I became curious about something I hadn't thought of...Zone 2 sound quality. Is it safe to expect similar quality in Zone 2 as what we currently receive in Zone 1? I've seen posts saying Zone 2 sound being muddy and not clear. Not necessarily using the same receiver I have, but in general amongst a few different brands. After reading several threads about this, I'm concerned the sound quality will be poor and all this effort will be just to add some background music to my patio. That isn't what I want. I would like to get good clean sound from Zone 2 if possible. As a refresher, I have a Denon avr x1200w

 

[lovinthehd]

I haven't seen such complaints about sound quality in zone 2, have you got some specifics? No complaints in my use nor would I particularly expect any.

 

[blk00ss]

I haven't seen such complaints about sound quality in zone 2, have you got some specifics? No complaints in my use nor would I particularly expect any.

Nothing in particular. I just saw some people talking about how their Zone 2 speakers sounded muddy with no high/ low adjustment, just sound, even distorted in some cases. As if to imply that maybe the "amp" handling of zone 2 isn't as good as zone 1 like zone 2 is kind of an afterthought.

But while on the subject, this may be a stupid question, but can you "tune" zone 2 like you can zone 1. I realize most modern receivers don't have an actual EQ to play with, but in Denon's case it does use Audyssey for the 7.1. Can you manipulate zone 2 like you can zone 1? Maybe it isn't necessary since they're 2 way speakers only using 2 channels? I might be overthinking this.

 

[lovinthehd]

People say a lot of things that aren't rooted in reality Many do poor comparisons. Sounds like they're talking about broken systems, but maybe its just their zone 2 speakers or that they are simply outside and don't have room reinforcement....hard to know.

Should be the same amps in any case. I suppose the dac could be different but where it's an audible difference....probably not. You could use an external amp if worried or if you're taxing your amp in the main zone.

Many modern avrs do have built in graphic eq like your Denon but on mine that doesn't extend to zone use. Audyssey I don't think is offered for zone use yet, at least not in mine. For my zones I have bass/treble control and a high pass filter setting, along with a mono/stereo setting and level adjust and volume limits/power on settings.

I wouldn't worry about it much in any case, hook up your speakers and see....

 

[BMXTRIX]

...saw some people talking about how their Zone 2 speakers sounded muddy...

There are any number of reasons why this may happen. Tons of reasons really.

One of the biggest reasons is that they use really crappy speakers for their zone 2 setup. While they invested properly for their surround system, they bought low end stuff for zone 2, then expected it to sound 'the same'. WHAT? That doesn't even make sense.

I recently had a client who complained her speakers in zone 2 needed to be replaced. Zone 2 went from the AVR to a amp, then to a speaker selector/volume control unit.
All of the gear was made by Pyle.
I swapped out the Pyle stuff with a Rolls 4-zone volume control/splitter, then into a multi-channel amplifier. The jump in clarity and volume was extraordinary. Like, it completely got rid of all of the muddiness, the crappy tone and weak sound and not only were the speakers way more impactful, they could be driven much harder without any issues at all. Not a speaker issue, but a equipment issue.

I don't expect either of these issues to be your problem. You will be driving zone 2 directly from the AVR, so the amplification of those speakers will be the same quality as that which drives your main speakers. There is no reason to expect anything short of high quality audio at the outdoor speakers, but be aware that you are in a completely different space and generally zone 2 should be consider auxiliary, not main. You can rock out to those speakers, but it isn't inside in your controlled theater space. It will sound a fair bit different.

 

[blk00ss]

There are any number of reasons why this may happen. Tons of reasons really.

One of the biggest reasons is that they use really crappy speakers for their zone 2 setup. While they invested properly for their surround system, they bought low end stuff for zone 2, then expected it to sound 'the same'. WHAT? That doesn't even make sense.

I recently had a client who complained her speakers in zone 2 needed to be replaced. Zone 2 went from the AVR to a amp, then to a speaker selector/volume control unit.
All of the gear was made by Pyle.
I swapped out the Pyle stuff with a Rolls 4-zone volume control/splitter, then into a multi-channel amplifier. The jump in clarity and volume was extraordinary. Like, it completely got rid of all of the muddiness, the crappy tone and weak sound and not only were the speakers way more impactful, they could be driven much harder without any issues at all. Not a speaker issue, but a equipment issue.

I don't expect either of these issues to be your problem. You will be driving zone 2 directly from the AVR, so the amplification of those speakers will be the same quality as that which drives your main speakers. There is no reason to expect anything short of high quality audio at the outdoor speakers, but be aware that you are in a completely different space and generally zone 2 should be consider auxiliary, not main. You can rock out to those speakers, but it isn't inside in your controlled theater space. It will sound a fair bit different.

You're right....my listening experience outside in the open won't sound anything like what my zone 1 sounds like. I have not got my outdoor speakers installed yet. Its been well over 100 for the past few days. I ended up going with the below. I did hook them up to my receiver zone 2, indoors just to see how they sound. I have to admit, I'm impressed. I do have to run the volume up on them higher than I would if I were listening to my 5.1 zone 1, but I suspect that's because its 2 speakers versus 5 + sub.

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[lovinthehd]

You're right....my listening experience outside in the open won't sound anything like what my zone 1 sounds like. I have not got my outdoor speakers installed yet. Its been well over 100 for the past few days. I ended up going with the below. I did hook them up to my receiver zone 2, indoors just to see how they sound. I have to admit, I'm impressed. I do have to run the volume up on them higher than I would if I were listening to my 5.1 zone 1, but I suspect that's because its 2 speakers versus 5 + sub.

Home

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That's what I use on my deck for almost 8 years now....I like 'em. They're not particularly sensitive nor do you have reinforcement from boundaries as much outside....once in a while I'll help 'em out in good weather and put a wireless sub out there....

 

[BMXTRIX]

I'm a big fan of OSD speakers, but there really are a ton of speakers for outdoors which sounds very similar to each other overall. Not huge differences at least. I've used models from Monoprice along with Niles and others. OSD seems to offer solid value for the money, but I think they've jumped a bit in price in the last couple of years.

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[blk00ss]

Got my cabling ran and speakers installed this past Saturday. Man am I impressed with the sound. The whole family enjoys it, but....this receivers Bluetooth is awful. and the Denon remote app...wow, its so bad.

Sunday I managed to get the app to work the majority of the day since we were outside a lot. But just like its always done...I go to use it today, app doesn't see the receiver. It sees other pieces of equipment, but not the receiver. I can get my phone and the AVR pair'd, but when I go to the app, it doesn't see the AVR at all. I have deleted and installed the app probably 10 times, I've re-paired probably 20 times, I've rebooted my phone repeatedly...nothing. Which really sucks because I don't wanna have to try and get the Denon remote to work through our back window to skip forward a song, or change volume. I don't know what my options are, but it would be nice to be able to use the app on my phone. I looked at the HEOS app (which seems to be more stable), but I guess in order to use HEOS, you have to have HEOS equipment. I "think" my receiver is HEOS able, but it requires an additional piece of equipment or something. Anyhow, loved the speakers the two days we got to use them.

 

[MissEverly]

Hey there! Have you tried reaching out to Denon's customer support for assistance? They may have some troubleshooting steps or suggestions to help get the app working properly.

 

[MissEverly]

Hey there! Have you tried reaching out to Denon's customer support for assistance? They may have some troubleshooting steps or suggestions to help get the app working properly.

BTW, have you seen the outdoor furniture options available here at Garden Furniture UK? They have a great selection of high-quality pieces that would be perfect for your backyard setup. It could be a great addition to your already impressive sound system!

 

[diwit]

We have a fairly good size patio. If I had to guess I'd say its 20ft by 10ft. I need some sound out there. Nothing crazy, just really would like to have some music, but I'm not sure how to go about powering them as I didn't wanna take up a lot of patio floor space with an outdoor cabinet for AV equipment (unless I just have to). Speaker wise I was looking at the Polk Atrium 6 and even the Atrium 8. I do have a Denon AVR-x1200w with 2 zone (no clue how to use it), but that would require me to run wire in the most difficult part of my house. I'm not even sure I can get to that part of my attic or that particular wall. I also have an old Denon AVR-683 (5.1) receiver that if I absolutely had to, I could use, but of course I'd have to get a cabinet and find a way for it to do Bluetooth since its so old. But looking for other options, ideas. I even thought about buying one of those small 2 channel amps with Bluetooth and maybe mounting it up under the eve of our patio as well check this gaminguider, but wasn't sure how well those work.

Also, if I did use the old 683...what is the best setup when using a 5.1 receiver with only 2 speakers?

I am currently using a pair of Sonos PLAY 3's for outdoor music duties however plugging them in/unplugging them and taking them indoors everytime is not the best experience so looking for some recommendations for a pair of permanent speakers that I can pair with a Rotel RA12 amp, the speakers will be mounted on a wall at ear height when sat down and approx 15ft apart (security is not an issue so not worried about some tea leaf having them away) Looking for something with the similar sound quality of B & W 685/686 but obviously designed for permanent outdoor installation. recommend away!

 

[BMXTRIX]

I am currently using a pair of Sonos PLAY 3's for outdoor music duties however plugging them in/unplugging them and taking them indoors everytime is not the best experience so looking for some recommendations for a pair of permanent speakers that I can pair with a Rotel RA12 amp, the speakers will be mounted on a wall at ear height when sat down and approx 15ft apart (security is not an issue so not worried about some tea leaf having them away) Looking for something with the similar sound quality of B & W 685/686 but obviously designed for permanent outdoor installation. recommend away!

If you are using these outdoors, then expecting the same type of acoustical treatment by mother nature as what you get in your enclosed family room is unrealistic. Outdoor audio doesn't have the reflections of indoor audio and generally, you need something built to survive the elements which will generally come at a cost in terms of raw sound quality.

While I generally listen to music outdoors as background fill, maybe a bit of partying, it is never with a critical ear and I often use speakers from Outdoor Speaker Depot, or Monoprice to fill that need. But, if I were going for more quality, I would lean towards models from a company like Sonance, that have decades of this type of experience. Their Mariner series specifically is designed for higher quality performance without falling apart in the outdoor environment....

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