How good of an audio setup do you need to be able to hear a difference between FLAC and MP3 320kbps?

[mono-bloc]

LOL good grief entry level to what...idiotic audiophilia nonsense?

Unfortunately you have no concept of the world market, when it comes to the better things in life. Asian and some European country's have a wealth you would find it hard to understand. Residency in the UAE, pay zero taxes, So if the ashtray;s full in the Ferrari, simply buy another Ferrari. As for high end audio, Look at the costs of MBL, Soulution, Gryphon, etc Or the latest Magico M9, at a very reasonable $850.000 us, which is made in your country, But the order books full for Asian buyers Dealers like Extreme Audio in Istanbul, Turkey deal with these products all the time Your problem is you live / exist in Trump's hicksville, and are under the strange illusion that what you have is all that's available.

 

[-Jim-]

I once ripped a song from CD as a .wav, 320K .mp3, and .flac and listened to all 3 in succession. Could tell no difference at all.

The main thing that sucks about MP3 is that most players can't do gapless transition between songs (especially annoying when listening to classical). I feel like an older version of Windows Media Player could do it but that's been so long ago now.

Of course "audiophiles" claim they can hear the difference. They also claim they can hear the difference between fuses, power cords, bags of magic rocks, etc.

Sir, arguing about what someone else can, or cannot hear is like arguing about politics or religion. It's futile. If you can't hear the difference then good for you. But science can demonstrate there is a difference between Lossy & Lossless Codecs even if you personally can't hear it. Same goes for fuses, power cords, tube connectors, interconnect cables, speaker cables, and the like. In those cases there's a lot of snake oil being spread around and science supports that conclusion. (I haven't seen any research on a Bag of Magic Rocks so I won't comment on them.) I won't argue the point as it's like trying to show a blind man the difference between red and blue. He just can't see it.

 

[Trell]

I'm comparing it to a the cost of mid range Integrated amp, for example Primare [ all pricing in aus dollars ] $7000,. Hegel $9000, Pas-Labs 150 $10600. These are considered entry level. If you go to the European models / manufacturers it's a hole new ball game

So these	are entry	level?
			Hey!
				I
					can	use
							"Insert table" as well	for text!
								Pretty dumb	usage of tables. For normal text.

 

[Trell]

Unfortunately you have no concept of the world market, when it comes to the better things in life. Asian and some European country's have a wealth you would find it hard to understand. Residency in the UAE, pay zero taxes, So if the ashtray;s full in the Ferrari, simply buy another Ferrari. As for high end audio, Look at the costs of MBL, Soulution, Gryphon, etc Or the latest Magico M9, at a very reasonable $850.000 us, which is made in your country, But the order books full for Asian buyers Dealers like Extreme Audio in Istanbul, Turkey deal with these products all the time Your problem is you live / exist in Trump's hicksville, and are under the strange illusion that what you have is all that's available.

	And you
		think you do?
			Look at me Mama! A table inside a table!

 

[lovinthehd]

Unfortunately you have no concept of the world market, when it comes to the better things in life. Asian and some European country's have a wealth you would find it hard to understand. Residency in the UAE, pay zero taxes, So if the ashtray;s full in the Ferrari, simply buy another Ferrari. As for high end audio, Look at the costs of MBL, Soulution, Gryphon, etc Or the latest Magico M9, at a very reasonable $850.000 us, which is made in your country, But the order books full for Asian buyers Dealers like Extreme Audio in Istanbul, Turkey deal with these products all the time Your problem is you live / exist in Trump's hicksville, and are under the strange illusion that what you have is all that's available.

Sure I do....was in international logistics for my career so quite aware. Just because someone spends silly amounts of money doesn't mean much except that they can ...doesn't mean they are making good decisions.....so hoew did you get rich....inheritance?

 

[highfigh]

I'm comparing it to a the cost of mid range Integrated amp, for example Primare [ all pricing in aus dollars ] $7000,. Hegel $9000, Pas-Labs 150 $10600. These are considered entry level. If you go to the European models / manufacturers it's a hole new ball game

You can't buy anything below $7K? You need better marketing companies.

 

[highfigh]

I once ripped a song from CD as a .wav, 320K .mp3, and .flac and listened to all 3 in succession. Could tell no difference at all.

The main thing that sucks about MP3 is that most players can't do gapless transition between songs (especially annoying when listening to classical). I feel like an older version of Windows Media Player could do it but that's been so long ago now.

Of course "audiophiles" claim they can hear the difference. They also claim they can hear the difference between fuses, power cords, bags of magic rocks, etc.

Have you used Audacity?

 

[highfigh]

You have to be joking, your suffering some sort of delusion, This forum while good , and does serve a purpose, it's more of a home theater board, and on a par with Whirlpool. But it's a long way from being a Hi Fi forum. I've yet to see a discussion on any serious products. Of cause you will bring in the old argument about high overpriced costs and audiophoolery.
So lets get into a in-depth discussion on some american brands A Boulder 3060, or a Luxman, or may-be some Pass-Labs. Or a good start would be the introduction of "The Gryphon" and it's effect on the American market.

As mentioned, Luxman isn't and never has been, an American company. They were distributed by Alpine Electronics until the market for Luxman was seen as too small to continue, but the link shows a Japanese address. Nice stuff, though- I still have one of their CD players from the late 1980s.

COMPANY | LUXMAN | Seeking higher sound quality

www.luxman.com

 

[kmidst]

Looks like this thread got a little spicy.
There were some very rational and provable points in here. The difference between different mp3 bitrates and lossless does appear to be noise. Look at this video where he subtracted the audio data so only the difference between them was audible:

As the mp3 bitrate lowered, it only added some noise who's volume got louder as the bitrate decreased. That explains why one poster was saying mp3 sounded harsh when played at high volumes as compared to lossless.
So maybe there is a difference, but it's noticeable at high volumes with lower bitrate mp3's versus lossless.

As to the guy saying that $9000 gear or whatever is "entry level". That's ridiculous and you know it. There are diminishing returns in audio quality for gear quality and throwing thousands more at your system doesn't increase the audio quality without bound. You can get reference-level audio quality in a complete system for less than five figures.

 

[mono-bloc]

the market for Luxman was seen as too small to continue,

Luxman have become quite trendy, but for a better word if you can find a M 900u, grab it. These mostly never seem to hit the showroom floor, and are snapped up on "back" order lists. Currently a a Luxman M 900u retails for close to $20.000 us The Pre-amp C 900u is around the same price.

YOu can't buy anything below $7K? You need better marketing companies.

Things cost what they cost. Buy a mazda at a low price, Buy a Maserati it might just cost a bit more. Or to put it another way you could buy a 6 bed room house on acres, or buy a shipping container, and tell yourself your happy. It all comes down to what your prepared to spend.

 

[mono-bloc]

was in international logistics for my career

Dreaming again are we ???
As for me I'm a retired drug dealer.

 

[mono-bloc]

As to the guy saying that $9000 gear or whatever is "entry level". That's ridiculous and you know it.

The question of what's available is an interesting one... Firstly we have to consider the scale of the product, and the cost factor. Your obversely not looking at the same price scale as I am. Probably because you have no understanding of the high-end audio market To you a bookshelf speaker is worth a couple of hundred dollars, which is your level of expenditure. The high-end market is the stuff on display at audio show's like Munich. Where the very rich and sometimes famous like to dangle there cheque books or wave a Mastercard So lets consider a couple of examples of high-end entry level audio gear, firstly speakers, Martin Logan CLX $49.000. Tannoy Westminsters $80.000. YG Acoustics Carmel $38.800 Magico A3 [very entry level ] $27.050 Magico S3 $66.600. Do you get the picture,, and all prices are in Aussie dollars So please don't insult my intelligence with statements about product prices you have no knowledge off. Just as a matter of interest look up the price range of your own USA made Boulder Amp's. and be sitting down when you do so.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

Sir, arguing about what someone else can, or cannot hear is like arguing about politics or religion. It's futile. If you can't hear the difference then good for you. But science can demonstrate there is a difference between Lossy & Lossless Codecs even if you personally can't hear it. Same goes for fuses, power cords, tube connectors, interconnect cables, speaker cables, and the like. In those cases there's a lot of snake oil being spread around and science supports that conclusion. (I haven't seen any research on a Bag of Magic Rocks so I won't comment on them.) I won't argue the point as it's like trying to show a blind man the difference between red and blue. He just can't see it.

Title of thread:

"How good of an audio setup do you need to be able to hear a difference between FLAC and MP3 320kbps?"

No one is questioning whether there's a technical difference.

By all means show me the studies that prove one power cord or fuse sounds better or measures differently across the audio band than another. This isn't audiogon.

 

[highfigh]

Luxman have become quite trendy, but for a better word if you can find a M 900u, grab it. These mostly never seem to hit the showroom floor, and are snapped up on "back" order lists. Currently a a Luxman M 900u retails for close to $20.000 us The Pre-amp C 900u is around the same price.

Things cost what they cost. Buy a mazda at a low price, Buy a Maserati it might just cost a bit more. Or to put it another way you could buy a 6 bed room house on acres, or buy a shipping container, and tell yourself your happy. It all comes down to what your prepared to spend.

Yeah, $20K. I'll get right on that.......

 

[lovinthehd]

The question of what's available is an interesting one... Firstly we have to consider the scale of the product, and the cost factor. Your obversely not looking at the same price scale as I am. Probably because you have no understanding of the high-end audio market To you a bookshelf speaker is worth a couple of hundred dollars, which is your level of expenditure. The high-end market is the stuff on display at audio show's like Munich. Where the very rich and sometimes famous like to dangle there cheque books or wave a Mastercard So lets consider a couple of examples of high-end entry level audio gear, firstly speakers, Martin Logan CLX $49.000. Tannoy Westminsters $80.000. YG Acoustics Carmel $38.800 Magico A3 [very entry level ] $27.050 Magico S3 $66.600. Do you get the picture,, and all prices are in Aussie dollars So please don't insult my intelligence with statements about product prices you have no knowledge off. Just as a matter of interest look up the price range of your own USA made Boulder Amp's. and be sitting down when you do so.

Who cares about the high end market particularly? Other than you.....

 

[lovinthehd]

Dreaming again are we ???
As for me I'm a retired drug dealer.

Dreaming? 'tis you who dreams about that silly high end of the market. You don't seem smart enough to have been a successful drug dealer....

 

[Trell]

Dreaming? 'tis you who dreams about that silly high end of the market. You don't seem smart enough to have been a successful drug dealer....

Perhaps snorting too much of her own wares?

 

[kevintomb]

Sir, arguing about what someone else can, or cannot hear is like arguing about politics or religion. It's futile. If you can't hear the difference then good for you. But science can demonstrate there is a difference between Lossy & Lossless Codecs even if you personally can't hear it. Same goes for fuses, power cords, tube connectors, interconnect cables, speaker cables, and the like. In those cases there's a lot of snake oil being spread around and science supports that conclusion. (I haven't seen any research on a Bag of Magic Rocks so I won't comment on them.) I won't argue the point as it's like trying to show a blind man the difference between red and blue. He just can't see it.

We all know that technically MP3 is NOT lossless.

Many "Audiophiles" claim they can easily hear it, but never back it up with anything concrete and often refuse to do the well made online tests.

In other words, a lot of hot air for the most part.
I have done extensive A/B/X tests and it is (even on very decent phones) VERY hard to tell the better MP3 codecs at higher bit rates from lossless audio. I felt I was mostly guessing.

 

[-Jim-]

We all know that technically MP3 is lossless.

Sir, this is nonsense and 100% false. I suggest you find another forum to post in if you wish to continue with this meaningless gibberish.

 

[lovinthehd]

We all know that technically MP3 is lossless.

Eh?