Denon X3800h vs X4800h?

P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
Does the 2021 batch AVR-X3700H model which I bought in June of last year have the same chip as I had read somewhere it didn't use the original AKM chip?
The last five digits of its SN are 73157.
In my case, as in its preamp mode the outputs will never reach close to 1 volt, am I right in saying that it's performance should not affect its SQ?
Take a read of this thread: Denon Replaces AKM AK4458 DAC IC in X4700H and X6700H | Page 24 | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum

Good chance you have the PCM5102A IC/
If your pre out requirement is less than even 1.5 V, SQ will not suffer even if you don't use preamp mode.

Based on the curve:

You can expect better than 90 dB SINAD, that is 0.003% THD+N, in real world use and is way better than your power amp's THD+N anyway, let alone the speakers. All those complaints over on ASR are academic, though in principle D+M should not be encouraged to downgrade a major part at will, regardless of audible effects or not.


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lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Take a read of this thread: Denon Replaces AKM AK4458 DAC IC in X4700H and X6700H | Page 24 | Audio Science Review (ASR) Forum

Good chance you have the PCM5102A IC/
If your pre out requirement is less than even 1.5 V, SQ will not suffer even if you don't use preamp mode.

Based on the curve:

You can expect better than 90 dB SINAD, that is 0.003% THD+N, in real world use and is way better than your power amp's THD+N anyway, let alone the speakers. All those complaints over on ASR are academic, though in principle D+M should not be encouraged to downgrade a major part at will, regardless of audible effects or not.


View attachment 58397
What do you think is the root cause of the change in measurements for the avrs with the secondary chip? The chip itself or the implementation for that chip originally planned for ?
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
What do you think is the root cause of the change in measurements for the avrs with the secondary chip? The chip itself or the implementation for that chip originally planned for ?
Definitely the chip itself, and it is not what I think, it is a know fact. The chip itself has SINAD spec of 93 dB, vs the original AKM chip's 107 dB. So that's a drop of 14 dB. Amir's measurements that he said he ran it by Denon, shows a 10 dB drop in SINAd. That tells me implementation is actually very good.

By the way, implementation is of course important but imo, is often overrated, likely due to manufacturer's marketing ploy to spread such talks, used as excuse for not using better (unfortunately more expensive) chips.

It typically goes like this:

Some forum members: Why did XYZ use this chip instead of a better one?
Manufacturer: People often look at the wrong thing, the DAC chip itself is not that important, it is implementation that matter. If not implemented well, it doesn't matter which chip is used.

See the fraud in the manufacturer's argument (straw man?)..
 
Trell

Trell

Audioholic Spartan
All those complaints over on ASR are academic, though in principle D+M should not be encouraged to downgrade a major part at will, regardless of audible effects or not.
And a substantial price increase on top of that. Some posters fails to recognize this particular point of what Denon did.
 
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O

Oggaaaa

Audioholic Intern
Im also deciding between these two recievers. I have a 5.2 setup currently with SVS Ultra Towers, Center, Bookshelves and 2x PC-4000 subs. Im currently powering them with a Yamaha RXV-779 from 2015 and it does a pretty good job i think, aside from YPAO which doesnt eq the subs. Do i need the extra power from the x4800 and how much difference will it be compared to my Yamaha?
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Im also deciding between these two recievers. I have a 5.2 setup currently with SVS Ultra Towers, Center, Bookshelves and 2x PC-4000 subs. Im currently powering them with a Yamaha RXV-779 from 2015 and it does a pretty good job i think, aside from YPAO which doesnt eq the subs. Do i need the extra power from the x4800 and how much difference will it be compared to my Yamaha?
The difference between the power per ch works out to about 1.2 dB advantage to the Denon. Generally not significant. I think your YPAO does do some eq on subs, not as much as Audyssey in the Denon can, tho. Do you really need to change avrs, tho?
 
O

Oggaaaa

Audioholic Intern
The difference between the power per ch works out to about 1.2 dB advantage to the Denon. Generally not significant. I think your YPAO does do some eq on subs, not as much as Audyssey in the Denon can, tho. Do you really need to change avrs, tho?
I see! Its mostly for HDMI 2.1, Atmos and Dolby Vision support. Also i hope that the independent sub outs with better room correction will make my frequency response more even.
 
panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
Having a ton of amplifiers in a very small box with inadequate cooling is not good.
I've got the older version, 4300h, and haven't ever had an issue with it. Runs hot, but it always has. I need to put fans on it for piece of mind since it's in a smaller space now.

In my rack there is tons of space for the 4800, so cooling isn't an issue.
 
Trell

Trell

Audioholic Spartan
I've got the older version, 4300h, and haven't ever had an issue with it. Runs hot, but it always has. I need to put fans on it for piece of mind since it's in a smaller space now.

In my rack there is tons of space for the 4800, so cooling isn't an issue.
I got the 4200 model with just seven amplifiers with me using only five of them. :)

About five/six years ago I put some fans on top, though.
 
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