Looking for advice and a new speaker system!

[Thegooseisloose]

Hello all!


I’d like some perspective on a theater/stereo upgrade I'm going to be making in my small apartment living room. I’ll start by sharing the recent start on my audiophyte path…





Things to know about me:

1. I love, and research, audio equipment; but I do not proclaim to be an audiophile
2. My room is a regular, untreated living space and I have to keep my speakers close to the wall.
3. My living room equipment is as following: a) KEF LS50 speakers. b) ELAC sub. c) Nuprime integrated amp/dac (Right now I watch tv as 2.1).
4. My headphone setup: a) Focal Elear. b) RME ADI-2 DAC and amp.
5. I want to build a system that functions really well as a stereo system and surround for movies.
6. I have loved my ls50/Nuprime combo. I bought the speakers 6 years ago after researching and running around listening to many speakers and them falling in love with them the first time I heard them. I have never had buyer’s remorse…
7. I would probably be fine building a theater system around the KEFs, but unfortunately I have “the itch” now and am considering an upgrade if it makes sense
8. I’ve preordered one of the new Marantz cinema series to be my 2.1 and surround AV

Considerations:

1. Build a system based on the ls50. Benefits: 1. Least expensive 2. I know that I like the sound. 3. Works really well in smaller spaces because of their semi-near field style. 4. Can immediately create a 5.1.2 system. Drawbacks: 1. May not be as good if/when I move into a larger space. 2. May not have some of the dynamics and punch of some other speakers for movies. 3. (I hate to say this) may not scratch the “I want something new/better” itch.
2. Build a system based on something a little pricier/better (yes, I know it’s subjective…). Advantages: 1. better sound for music/movies. 2. Better future proofing for larger spaces. 3. Scratch my itch. Drawbacks: 1. may have to wait a little to complete a full 5.1.2 or .4 system. 2. More expensive. 3. A little risky because speakers may not work as well for my space. 4. Not a large enough upgrade…maybe just different sound?!?
3. Build a system based a much higher priced speaker. Advantages: 1. Oooo, maybe much better sound, especially with music? 2. Really feel like an upgrade, a little less sadness about letting the KEF’s go. 3. Big scratch on that itch (face-palm). Drawbacks: 1. Diminishing returns. 2. Would take even longer to create a surround system. 3. Money…

Which speakers have considered, researched and listened to?

1. These are in the highest range for me even though they are a preowned category: paradigm persona b. I heard these and was wowed!
2. Paradigm 40b: I loved these as well, but probably would have loved them more if I hadn’t heard the persona b. Just missing some of the wow factor that I heard from the much more expensive speaker. But the mind (and ears) can do some funny things…
3. Sonus Faber sonetta 2: I liked these as well, they sparkled a little more than the other 2, and there was more air in mix, but seemed a little looser and less defined in the imaging. But I still enjoyed it very much.
4. Bowers and Wilkins 705 s2: These were my least favorite. I’m pretty sensitive to speaker brightness, and I immediately heard the bright character of these, which bothered me.

Speakers I’m considering but have not yet heard: these would be in the “I’ll build the surround sound later” category

1. Q acoustics concept 300: these speakers I really want to hear! I know we have to be careful about rave reviews, but I’m only hearing good things about these. Also there is no one in a 250+ mile radius from me that has these to hear…
2. Revel performaBe m126be.
3. Adrenal Sound: these are a distant maybe, just because I’m not hearing as much praise about their quality for music and it seems near impossible to audition them before purchasing.

I am open to general ideas and perspectives about my different purchase approaches as well as any other monitors (or small towers( that you are crazy about. I like slightly warmer tonality (hence the KEFs) and struggle with to much sharpness in the higher range. I like the idea of a speaker that “disappears” and images and sound fields well. I don’t need a speaker that digs deep, because I don’t mind matching it with a sub. Right now my speakers have to sit close to the wall and my space is small, which is why I’ve been talking primarily bookshelf speakers, but I did really like paradigms smallest founders tower… so I’m open to any ideas.





Thanks for reading my rant. And thanks in advance for any advice and thoughts.

 

[NINaudio]

How about this alternative:

Get new speakers up front and use the LS50's for surround duty. You could get a pair of Kef R5's (or 7, or 11's depending on how much you want to spend) and an R2C for your front stage.

Otherwise, the revel Performa Be and Arendals are great speakers as well.

 

[TLS Guy]

Hello all!


I’d like some perspective on a theater/stereo upgrade I'm going to be making in my small apartment living room. I’ll start by sharing the recent start on my audiophyte path…





Things to know about me:

1. I love, and research, audio equipment; but I do not proclaim to be an audiophile
2. My room is a regular, untreated living space and I have to keep my speakers close to the wall.
3. My living room equipment is as following: a) KEF LS50 speakers. b) ELAC sub. c) Nuprime integrated amp/dac (Right now I watch tv as 2.1).
4. My headphone setup: a) Focal Elear. b) RME ADI-2 DAC and amp.
5. I want to build a system that functions really well as a stereo system and surround for movies.
6. I have loved my ls50/Nuprime combo. I bought the speakers 6 years ago after researching and running around listening to many speakers and them falling in love with them the first time I heard them. I have never had buyer’s remorse…
7. I would probably be fine building a theater system around the KEFs, but unfortunately I have “the itch” now and am considering an upgrade if it makes sense
8. I’ve preordered one of the new Marantz cinema series to be my 2.1 and surround AV

Considerations:

1. Build a system based on the ls50. Benefits: 1. Least expensive 2. I know that I like the sound. 3. Works really well in smaller spaces because of their semi-near field style. 4. Can immediately create a 5.1.2 system. Drawbacks: 1. May not be as good if/when I move into a larger space. 2. May not have some of the dynamics and punch of some other speakers for movies. 3. (I hate to say this) may not scratch the “I want something new/better” itch.
2. Build a system based on something a little pricier/better (yes, I know it’s subjective…). Advantages: 1. better sound for music/movies. 2. Better future proofing for larger spaces. 3. Scratch my itch. Drawbacks: 1. may have to wait a little to complete a full 5.1.2 or .4 system. 2. More expensive. 3. A little risky because speakers may not work as well for my space. 4. Not a large enough upgrade…maybe just different sound?!?
3. Build a system based a much higher priced speaker. Advantages: 1. Oooo, maybe much better sound, especially with music? 2. Really feel like an upgrade, a little less sadness about letting the KEF’s go. 3. Big scratch on that itch (face-palm). Drawbacks: 1. Diminishing returns. 2. Would take even longer to create a surround system. 3. Money…

Which speakers have considered, researched and listened to?

1. These are in the highest range for me even though they are a preowned category: paradigm persona b. I heard these and was wowed!
2. Paradigm 40b: I loved these as well, but probably would have loved them more if I hadn’t heard the persona b. Just missing some of the wow factor that I heard from the much more expensive speaker. But the mind (and ears) can do some funny things…
3. Sonus Faber sonetta 2: I liked these as well, they sparkled a little more than the other 2, and there was more air in mix, but seemed a little looser and less defined in the imaging. But I still enjoyed it very much.
4. Bowers and Wilkins 705 s2: These were my least favorite. I’m pretty sensitive to speaker brightness, and I immediately heard the bright character of these, which bothered me.

Speakers I’m considering but have not yet heard: these would be in the “I’ll build the surround sound later” category

1. Q acoustics concept 300: these speakers I really want to hear! I know we have to be careful about rave reviews, but I’m only hearing good things about these. Also there is no one in a 250+ mile radius from me that has these to hear…
2. Revel performaBe m126be.
3. Adrenal Sound: these are a distant maybe, just because I’m not hearing as much praise about their quality for music and it seems near impossible to audition them before purchasing.

I am open to general ideas and perspectives about my different purchase approaches as well as any other monitors (or small towers( that you are crazy about. I like slightly warmer tonality (hence the KEFs) and struggle with to much sharpness in the higher range. I like the idea of a speaker that “disappears” and images and sound fields well. I don’t need a speaker that digs deep, because I don’t mind matching it with a sub. Right now my speakers have to sit close to the wall and my space is small, which is why I’ve been talking primarily bookshelf speakers, but I did really like paradigms smallest founders tower… so I’m open to any ideas.





Thanks for reading my rant. And thanks in advance for any advice and thoughts.

First off I think you have a good ear. The speakers you have, I have heard, and they are excellent small speakers, and fine for a small apartment.

I think the only thing I would upgrade right now is the sub. That will improve things now, and work in your new surroundings. Personally I would leave other speaker purchases to when you actually make your move.

 

[shadyJ]

Revel PerformaBe M126Be are solid speakers, can't go wrong with those. Arendal is good, but pretty overkill for a small apartment living room. However, if you don't mind overkill, some 1723 THX Monitors would be killer. One speaker that does not get nearly enough love is the RBH Sound PM-8. Since you have a sub, look at some Sigberg SBS.1s, they will have a more neutral sound than the LS50s but many times the dynamic range. The only caveat is that they leave all the bass to the subs. You are within reaching distance of some Perlisten R4b speakers as well, but those would also require a sub.

 

[NINaudio]

I'd also suggest looking at some of the Salk offerings: BMR monitor, Veracity ST monitor, SS6M, etc.

 

[Thegooseisloose]

How about this alternative:

Get new speakers up front and use the LS50's for surround duty. You could get a pair of Kef R5's (or 7, or 11's depending on how much you want to spend) and an R2C for your front stage.

Otherwise, the revel Performa Be and Arendals are great speakers as well.

Thanks! I’ve read some reviews that say the KEF r series looses some musicality when compared to the Ls50s and are sharper in the mid high range, do you find this to be true? A would they feel like in upgrade to music listening? That’s part of what I’m looking for..

 

[Thegooseisloose]

First off I think you have a good ear. The speakers you have, I have heard, and they are excellent small speakers, and fine for a small apartment.

I think the only thing I would upgrade right now is the sub. That will improve things now, and work in your new surroundings. Personally I would leave other speaker purchases to when you actually make your move.

Thanks for the recommendation! Any suggestions for a good musical/value sub?

 

[Thegooseisloose]

Revel PerformaBe M126Be are solid speakers, can't go wrong with those. Arendal is good, but pretty overkill for a small apartment living room. However, if you don't mind overkill, some 1723 THX Monitors would be killer. One speaker that does not get nearly enough love is the RBH Sound PM-8. Since you have a sub, look at some Sigberg SBS.1s, they will have a more neutral sound than the LS50s but many times the dynamic range. The only caveat is that they leave all the bass to the subs. You are within reaching distance of some Perlisten R4b speakers as well, but those would also require a sub.

Thanks for the reply! I’m looking forward to auditioning the revels in the next week or 2. I’ll definitely look up the RBHs which I havnt researched yet. And I’m fine with a sub…

 

[Thegooseisloose]

I'd also suggest looking at some of the Salk offerings: BMR monitor, Veracity ST monitor, SS6M, etc.

I’ll check them out. Thanks!

 

[lovinthehd]

Thanks! I’ve read some reviews that say the KEF r series looses some musicality when compared to the Ls50s and are sharper in the mid high range, do you find this to be true? A would they feel like in upgrade to music listening? That’s part of what I’m looking for..

Musicality in gear is just a dumb term.

 

[TLS Guy]

First off I think you have a good ear. The speakers you have, I have heard, and they are excellent small speakers, and fine for a small apartment.

I think the only thing I would upgrade right now is the sub. That will improve things now, and work in your new surroundings. Personally I would leave other speaker purchases to when you actually make your move.

The usual suspects, SVS, Rhythmic and HSU. I think HSU are a particular value.

 

[lovinthehd]

Musicality in gear is just a dumb term.

@Thegooseisloose glad you see the humor in such a dumb term. This is repoduction, not production....

 

[Thegooseisloose]

@Thegooseisloose glad you see the humor in such a dumb term. This is repoduction, not production....

Ya, I see some humor in any kind of obsession, . I take all of this with a grain of salt. That’s why I followed my emotional response and got the ls50s after I heard them once. They spoke to me regardless of what I had or hadn’t read. I try to not get lost to much in the techno language… but sometimes I still do. But I accept the feedback!

 

[lovinthehd]

Ya, I see some humor in any kind of obsession, . I take all of this with a grain of salt. That’s why I followed my emotional response and got the ls50s after I heard them once. They spoke to me regardless of what I had or hadn’t read. I try to not get lost to much in the techno language… but sometimes I still do. But I take the feedback!

There's lots of experiences to be had...personally I'd find the LS50s to just simply be too lightweight but no experience either, just going on what I've read about them. I prefer higher performance capabilities even if only used occasionally....but the design of the concentric drivers may have advantages in some placement situations and not so much in others, let alone spl capabilities.

 

[Thegooseisloose]

Anyone have experience with the Q acoustics concept 50 smaller tower speakers?

 

[Swerd]

Like the others who've already responded (NINaudio, TLS Guy & shadyJ), I also believe you have a good ear for speakers – you like KEF LS50s, and don't like the B&Ws you mentioned. I've heard LS50s in my home and got to compare them to speakers I have and know well. I think they're a good choice, especially if you have a smaller room. Expanding with more LS50s is not a bad idea.

In particular, I agree with NINaudio's suggestion about looking into Salk speakers. When I heard the LS50s, I thought they sounded roughly as good as Salk SongSurround I speakers. They are among the least expensive speakers Salk makes. Because you mentioned liking "a speaker that 'disappears' and images and sound fields well" I think you would also like the Philharmonic Audio BMR Monitor speakers. Both Salk and Philharmonic Audio speakers share the same designer who values the very sound qualities you like.

I also believe you're going about audio sensibly. You seem to realize that speakers are where the rubber hits the road. Many of those new to audio focus too much on the electronics and not the all important speakers. That said, you only briefly mentioned your NuPrime integrated amp. Is it the NuPrime IDA-8? It's a 2-channel integrated amp, with 100 wpc class D output power, and a built-in DAC. I'm not interested in buying one, but we get plenty of new buyers who are interested in these or other new (non-traditional) models. What's your experience with it? And how did you come to know it?

 

[Thegooseisloose]

Like the others who've already responded (NINaudio, TLS Guy & shadyJ), I also believe you have a good ear for speakers – you like KEF LS50s, and don't like the B&Ws you mentioned. I've heard LS50s in my home and got to compare them to speakers I have and know well. I think they're a good choice, especially if you have a smaller room. Expanding with more LS50s is not a bad idea.

In particular, I agree with NINaudio's suggestion about looking into Salk speakers. When I heard the LS50s, I thought they sounded roughly as good as Salk SongSurround I speakers. They are among the least expensive speakers Salk makes. Because you mentioned liking "a speaker that 'disappears' and images and sound fields well" I think you would also like the Philharmonic Audio BMR Monitor speakers. Both Salk and Philharmonic Audio speakers share the same designer who values the very sound qualities you like.

I also believe you're going about audio sensibly. You seem to realize that speakers are where the rubber hits the road. Many of those new to audio focus too much on the electronics and not the all important speakers. That said, you only briefly mentioned your NuPrime integrated amp. Is it the NuPrime IDA-8? It's a 2-channel integrated amp, with 100 wpc class D output power, and a built-in DAC. I'm not interested in buying one, but we get plenty of new buyers who are interested in these or other new (non-traditional) models. What's your experience with it? And how did you come to know it?

Hello! Thank you for your thoughtful response! To answer your question: that is the precise dac/amp ida-8, yes. It’s amazing, but to be honest it was my initial step into the the hifi world and the only thing I have paired my ls50s with, so I would say this is my reference point (and I don’t have anything to compare it to…). But for 5-6 years it’s been a great mate to my speakers, the sound is lovely. I’m wondering how the Marantz will sound in comparison… I’m not sure if I’ll keep it or sell it once I get a new setup, same with the ls50s.

 

[Teetertotter?]

@Thegooseisloose
Are the walls for your apartment well insulated to keep disturbance down? Dolby movies sound best with higher volume, especially syfy. lol How about a 7.1 AVR for your new system and would want to consider a nice center channel for movies and surrounds. Music will sound great too, with an AVR. Then a subwoofer. Keep reading and what your budget can afford. Good Luck