Why is my amplifier shutting down at high volume?

[Rgaret]

I just added an Emotiva BasX A3 to my Onkyo TX-RZ730. I really like the results. However, when I crank the volume way up near the max, the amp shuts down and goes into protection mode. I have a pair of Polk R700 towers and a Csi A4 for my center. Any suggestions on his to troubleshoot thus issue, or should I simply return the Emotiva?

 

[lovinthehd]

If the Emotiva shuts down and not the Onkyo, yes, I'd return it (but check all your wires/connections carefully first). Or does it shut down the Onkyo? What kind of spl are we talking about, tho?

 

[flippo]

You are Pushing the amp to hard. if you are setting it to max you're hearing is probably being damaged also!

 

[3db]

You are Pushing the amp to hard. if you are setting it to max you're hearing is probably being damaged also!

And the tweeters from the signal being clipped.

 

[Rgaret]

If the Emotiva shuts down and not the Onkyo, yes, I'd return it (but check all your wires/connections carefully first). Or does it shut down the Onkyo? What kind of spl are we talking about, tho?

The Onkyo stays on the whole time. Not sure about the SPL, but it is extremely loud. My speakers are good, per Polk to 300 Watts so I'm not maxing them out.

 

[3db]

The Onkyo stays on the whole time. Not sure about the SPL, but it is extremely loud. My speakers are good, per Polk to 300 Watts so I'm not maxing them out.

But you are maxing out your amp which then clips the signal and a clipped signal is what destroys tweeters in short order.

 

[Rgaret]

But you are maxing out your amp which then clips the signal and a clipped signal is what destroys tweeters in short order.

So, would the solution be a better AVR?

 

[Replicant 7]

The Onkyo stays on the whole time. Not sure about the SPL, but it is extremely loud. My speakers are good, per Polk to 300 Watts so I'm not maxing them out.

Send that Emo amp back, before the 30 day money back guarantee runs out.

 

[Replicant 7]

So, would the solution be a better AVR?

That RZ730 is a nice AVR. It's not that old, what 3 years old maybe?

 

[Rgaret]

That RZ730 is a nice AVR. It's not that old, what 3 years old maybe?

Not even 3 years old. I just wanted more power and a better sound stage. And I get all of that until the Emo cuts off.

 

[Replicant 7]

Not even 3 years old. I just wanted more power and a better sound stage. And I get all of that until the Emo cuts off.

Yeah I just checked, it was released in 2018, but it's not a discontinued unit. I'd send the amp back, maybe pick up Outlaw's 5 channel amp?

 

[ski2xblack]

So, would the solution be a better AVR?

If the AVR is not the problem, then why would you think replacing it would correct your problem?

That AVR already has stout amplification if it's explicit 4 ohm rating is legit. The AVR may even drive your particular speakers better than the Emo. That Emo amp, in terms of power, is within a fraction of a db of the Onkyo. Generally, you use external amps if and only if the AVR is insufficient, in which case it makes more sense to get an amp considerably more powerful, not one with negligible difference from the AVR.

And so you got an external amp of similar power anyway, and it shuts down when you blast it. You should probably just 86 the Emo and just use the AVR. If you want to use the Emo, go through some basic troubleshooting. It could be a stray strand of wire, so double check the speaker wires both at the amp and the speakers. If that's all good and it still shuts down, it's something else (e.g. maybe the Emo is less capable into the load presented, triggering thermal protection).

 

[lovinthehd]

The Onkyo stays on the whole time. Not sure about the SPL, but it is extremely loud. My speakers are good, per Polk to 300 Watts so I'm not maxing them out.

Not with that amp perhaps, seems speaker has higher quitting point....then again maxing out the speakers can still happen depending on source level, perhaps how you set the amp up with avr....

 

[3db]

Not even 3 years old. I just wanted more power and a better sound stage. And I get all of that until the Emo cuts off.

Change your speakers if you want a better soundstage. More volume isnt going to open soundstage after reaching 60 db

 

[lovinthehd]

Amps don't do "sound stage". That's your speakers/positioning and the recording itself. Or you mean something else by soundstage....

 

[Rgaret]

If the Emotiva shuts down and not the Onkyo, yes, I'd return it (but check all your wires/connections carefully first). Or does it shut down the Onkyo? What kind of spl are we talking about, tho?

Today, I recconected the front and center channels directly to the Onkyo. When I cranked the volume to 82 (THX Ref) level, the Onkyo shut down, and restarted. It went into diagnostic mode, and reported a "check Sp Wire" error. I restarted it and all was good. Since this is now also a problem with the AVR itself, are there any ideas as to why this happened? I'm thinking either my AVR got too hot, but that's just a guess. Any help is much appreciated.

 

[lovinthehd]

I've seen testing reports some avrs that can still send themselves into protection even with pre-outs in use at high levels. It doesn't particularly surprise me with those speakers having a minimum impedance of 3.6ohm that at reference level it may be a bit much for an avr alone. Altho I wouldn't expect that from a power amp particularly, that particular Emotiva isn't a particularly powerful amp (its more similar to avr power). How far away from the speakers are you at these volume levels? Looked at the Polk spec it says amp range 50-300W which is somewhat vague as to what they mean by that, but usually pushing a speaker to its max rating is more a damage point than anything particularly useful/good sounding.

 

[Am_P]

Today, I recconected the front and center channels directly to the Onkyo. When I cranked the volume to 82 (THX Ref) level, the Onkyo shut down, and restarted. It went into diagnostic mode, and reported a "check Sp Wire" error. I restarted it and all was good. Since this is now also a problem with the AVR itself, are there any ideas as to why this happened? I'm thinking either my AVR got too hot, but that's just a guess. Any help is much appreciated.

Repurpose the BasX for surround or height channel duties. Get a couple of these bad boys (~500 Watts/channel) for your front stage. See if you can shut them down with your volume knob...
https://summithifiusa.com/collections/tonewinner/products/ad-2500-power-amplifier

 

[TLS Guy]

Today, I recconected the front and center channels directly to the Onkyo. When I cranked the volume to 82 (THX Ref) level, the Onkyo shut down, and restarted. It went into diagnostic mode, and reported a "check Sp Wire" error. I restarted it and all was good. Since this is now also a problem with the AVR itself, are there any ideas as to why this happened? I'm thinking either my AVR got too hot, but that's just a guess. Any help is much appreciated.

You seem to me someone who lacks perspective on what speakers like yours are capable of.

Now what any manufacture says about power handling ability is just a wild guess. Generally a speaker will be damaged long before the power level quoted by the manufacturer is reached. The reason is that music is complex, and can put a lot of power in any given frequency band at any time.

If I have this correctly the EMO shuts down at high power, and now the Onkyo shuts down when previously it did not.

My strong hunch is that you have already damaged your speakers.

I suspect one or more drivers have had their voice coils overheated, so that the insulation on the wire coils has started to break down, and you now have some shorted turns, and the impedance has dropped. The most likely drivers to have suffered this are the midrange drivers. There is only one in each speaker and they cross at 340 Hz and 2,700 Hz, so those drivers are taking an awful lot of power, especially on a lot of program. Very high powered midrange drivers are very rare indeed and you will not find them is speakers in that price range.

Generally if you are designing a speakers for high power with crossover that low, then you always use two midrange drivers in MTM configuration. That is what I do.

So you need to remove all the woofers and the mids to measure their DC resistance. You will need to get the spec. from Polk. Any drivers with a DC resistance below spec. will need be reconed or replaced. If you don't then you are going to ruin your receiver or amps.

You need to have more respect for your equipment and operate it in a less cavalier manner.

 

[Rgaret]

You seem to me someone who lacks perspective on what speakers like yours are capable of.

Now what any manufacture says about power handling ability is just a wild guess. Generally a speaker will be damaged long before the power level quoted by the manufacturer is reached. The reason is that music is complex, and can put a lot of power in any given frequency band at any time.

If I have this correctly the EMO shuts down at high power, and now the Onkyo shuts down when previously it did not.

My strong hunch is that you have already damaged your speakers.

I suspect one or more drivers have had their voice coils overheated, so that the insulation on the wire coils has started to break down, and you now have some shorted turns, and the impedance has dropped. The most likely drivers to have suffered this are the midrange drivers. There is only one in each speaker and they cross at 340 Hz and 2,700 Hz, so those drivers are taking an awful lot of power, especially on a lot of program. Very high powered midrange drivers are very rare indeed and you will not find them is speakers in that price range.

Generally if you are designing a speakers for high power with crossover that low, then you always use two midrange drivers in MTM configuration. That is what I do.

So you need to remove all the woofers and the mids to measure their DC resistance. You will need to get the spec. from Polk. Any drivers with a DC resistance below spec. will need be reconed or replaced. If you don't then you are going to ruin your receiver or amps.

You need to have more respect for your equipment and operate it in a less cavalier manner.

You were right. One of the tweeters on my front left speaker is blown. No sound at all. This is causing all of the problems. Luckily I have tons of extra cash and will just buy more speakers. Thanks for the advice!