stereo receiver vs integrated amp vs avr?

[jsf0656]

i want a 2ch setup for music. sound quality and cost wise...which of these 3 is best?

 

[Pogre]

Start with speakers first. That's where the bulk of your budget should go. Once you've settled on speakers then you start looking at what you need for power. If you can save a little buying an avr you can put those savings into better speakers.

What I look for is good room correction, sufficient or a little more power than necessary to drive the speakers in stereo and preouts for flexibility should I decide to add an amp down the road.

 

[jsf0656]

i want a 2ch setup for music. sound quality and cost wise...which of these 3 is best?

i need a unit that has a sub input and has a optical or coaxial input as well.

 

[Pogre]

i need a unit that has a sub input and has a optical or coaxial input as well.

You mean sub preout?

That's the nice thing about avrs. In general most will have all the connections you need and bass management, which is very nice when you're using a sub. What speakers are you looking at? Do you already have some or..?

 

[jsf0656]

i meant preout. sorry about that. i have jbl230s now and a yamaha rx475 avr i was told by a guy at best buy that a stereo 2ch receiver, 2ch integrated amp would give me a better and cleaner sound than a avr. i wanted to ask that question on this forum because i believe i would get an honest answer vs some guy in a best buy!

 

[Pogre]

i meant preout. sorry about that. i have jbl230s now and a yamaha rx475 avr i was told by a guy at best buy that a stereo 2ch receiver, 2ch integrated amp would give me a better and cleaner sound than a avr. i wanted to ask that question on this forum because i believe i would get an honest answer vs some guy in a best buy!

Heh. Yup.

The thing is, amps and receivers are a mature technology now and just about all of the competent manufacturers are making them with transparent DACs and most of the differences in measurements fall outside of audibility. If you're chasing better and cleaner sound that's absolutely going to be found upgrading speakers, or... learning about how your speakers interact with your room.

Proper setup and positioning are probably the most overlooked part of the process and probably has the most impact on your sound quality outside of the speakers themselves. Just the simple stuff like distance from room boundaries, toe in, tweeter height, unobstructed line of sight, distance apart and from mlp, dsp/room correction... all of that can have a profound impact on sq. It's worth doing the homework and experimentation.

 

[killdozzer]

i meant preout. sorry about that. i have jbl230s now and a yamaha rx475 avr i was told by a guy at best buy that a stereo 2ch receiver, 2ch integrated amp would give me a better and cleaner sound than a avr. i wanted to ask that question on this forum because i believe i would get an honest answer vs some guy in a best buy!

Well, it's nice of you to trust people on this forum and give them credit. @Pogre gave you fair and true answers.

2ch stereo amp and 2ch stereo rcvr will not give you a better or cleaner sound. The guy at BestBuy perhaps really believes in what he said, but that's just not true.

You have speakers of 88dB sensitivity and an AVR that can do 80Wpch into 8 2ch driven. You should be good.

 

[killdozzer]

@jsf0656

Here you can see some detailed spec and measurements. Nothing hints at this unit having any problems.

 

[Mikado463]

some sage advice here !

 

[highfigh]

Several integrated amplifiers and stereo receivers have a sub out and digital inputs, although a couple of expensive integrated amps have none. I don't understand that although I could if they had a companion digital module that handled both.

 

[lovinthehd]

If you want a sub I'd look at units with bass management, not just a pre-out that could well be full range only with many 2ch integrated amps/receivers (they're slow to adopt subs in 2ch world generally). I'm sure the salesman makes more money if you bought another box of electronics. tho

Your current avr and speakers are just fine, and you can easily integrate a sub with what you've got. If you really want to upgrade audio quality, that would be mostly the arena of the speaker/sub. Since you are lacking the sub now it seems, I'd start there.

 

[jsf0656]

thanks everyone for your advice!

 

[FcBuff]

What kind of source material for your 2 channel set up? Vinyl? Must have some digital if you want optical/coax. Marantz makes some spicy integrated amps.
You can check out some older stuff, since you won't be worried about surround format. I would check out some older Class'e integrated amps. For the $$$, they sound pretty amazing.

 

[pcosmic]

The bestbuy dude was not entirely wrong. Good speakers can start to be very revealing of a lousy front end. Low end receivers sound like ass for music. Flagship receivers can sound good but they cost a lot. You may be able to outdo the sound of a flagship receiver at around a 3rd of the cost with certain integrated amp and dac combos (for 2 channel music).

This is largely a hometheater/movie centric forum where receivers loom large.. I personally like receivers because i do a lot of my music listening in multichannel, but, i also have several purist pieces for 2 channel music. Try and get different opinions at audiogon, stevehoffman, etc as well which may have a higher density of 2 channel hifi centric guys. Who knows...you may even end up being a tube amp kinda guy or something...Have fun while you're figuring out what works for ya.

 

[TLS Guy]

The bestbuy dude was not entirely wrong. Good speakers can start to be very revealing of a lousy front end. Low end receivers sound like ass for music. Flagship receivers can sound good but they cost a lot. You may be able to outdo the sound of a flagship receiver at around a 3rd of the cost with certain integrated amp and dac combos (for 2 channel music).

This is largely a hometheater/movie centric forum where receivers loom large.. I personally like receivers because i do a lot of my music listening in multichannel, but, i also have several purist pieces for 2 channel music. Try and get different opinions at audiogon, stevehoffman, etc as well which may have a higher density of 2 channel hifi centric guys. Who knows...you may even end up being a tube amp kinda guy or something...Have fun while you're figuring out what works for ya.

Be careful, there are a lot of audiophools on Audiogon and Steve Hoffman has definite tendencies to audiophilia. Be very careful of subjective opinions. It really is your speakers that overwhelmingly determine how your rig sounds in any given environment. The maxim holds, that if you don't like the sound you are getting, then go speaker shopping. If you are a DIYer like me, then it is modify your current one of design and build some different ones. It really comes down to that, with the amps and receivers it comes down to reliability and longevity. It seems to me receivers do have longevity issues, and do have trouble powering speakers that present difficult loads.
So if you have a two channel system with low impedance speakers, then adding a beefier power amp can be an asset. This requires using a receiver with preouts, or using a pre/pro and external amps. I personally don't use receivers, as I'm wedded to my power amps.

I think music only systems are becoming increasingly limiting, as so much music on offer comes with a picture now. So all my systems, even my two channel, has a TV screen. That pushes you in the receiver or pre/pro direction.

Lastly it is nonsense that a good theater system can not be a good music system. That nonsense continues to be propagated. If a theater system does not reproduce music really well, then it is a lousy theater system period, and will more likely than not have speech reproduction issues and other shortcomings. A good theater system should be a first class music reproducer, to which a screen has been added.

 

[killdozzer]

You may be able to outdo the sound of a flagship receiver at around a 3rd of the cost with certain integrated amp and dac combos (for 2 channel music).

Now flip this sentence for exactly 180 degrees and you get facts. It is precisely the price of well performing avr's that everything but plummeted and it is the price of stereo gear that raised since the numbers sold fell. It is exactly the other way around.

You can't have low numbers selling and cheaper units. It doesn't work that way.

It is also not easy to imagine one sound sounding good and the other sounding bad.

And I'm not HT oriented not in the least. I like and use stereo, it has nothing to do with SQ.

 

[highfigh]

If you want a sub I'd look at units with bass management, not just a pre-out that could well be full range only with many 2ch integrated amps/receivers (they're slow to adopt subs in 2ch world generally). I'm sure the salesman makes more money if you bought another box of electronics. tho

Your current avr and speakers are just fine, and you can easily integrate a sub with what you've got. If you really want to upgrade audio quality, that would be mostly the arena of the speaker/sub. Since you are lacking the sub now it seems, I'd start there.

Best Buy stopped paying commission over ten years ago. Something about removing competition between salespeople.......

 

[highfigh]

I think music only systems are becoming increasingly limiting, as so much music on offer comes with a picture now. So all my systems, even my two channel, has a TV screen. That pushes you in the receiver or pre/pro direction.

Since TVs can up-convert, there's no reason the video sources can't be connected directly, then the audio sent to a 2 channel system- I do that with a Yamaha MusicCast, receiving the optical from my TV and it works well. The Yamaha has analog input, too- that way, I can use my integrated amp for additional switching and its phono preamp. I don't mind getting off of my butt occasionally, but I do use the universal remote for most operations. Since I have a power amp, I don't need an AVR or Pre/Pro because the system is two channel and the room works fine for that, but it's really not suitable for surround. Maybe I'll use surround in my next house.

 

[jsf0656]

this is great info and i am sold on what i have now except for one thing....THE SUB! the 10in klipsch is pretty good but i know i can do better. i want deeper so that my music can blend in better almost as if you dont even know the sub is playing...like one seamless soundstage. am i making any sense? please help!

 

[jsf0656]

BTW, i have been looking at the svs pb and sb 1000 subs. again this is music only and my living room is 15x18 with 10ft vaulted ceiling.