Some questions regarding issues with my new Monolith 7 X 200 amp

[Ledformyhead]

I've got a few questions regarding my recently received Monolith 7 X 200 amp that I hope you guys may be able to help me with. First I am getting a intermitent hum from the unit (the unit itself, not through the speakers)....I've seen others comment on this and I also read Gene DellaSalas' review of the unit suggesting plugging it into an Emotiva common mode AC line filter and DC offset eliminator (now the CMX 2). He said that fixed his issue and the CMX2 does not limit current or performance in any way. I purchased one because I do have a dimmer switch on the same floor as the amp, not sure it is on the same circuit. After using it now for a few days it "may" have improved the issue some but the hum is still there. I doubt it is a grounding issue because it comes and goes. I have not run a ground wire off of the Amp at this point. It's running off of my std house 15 amp outlet. I am considering running a dedicated 20 amp circuit for my Home Theater but I'm confident this is not going to fix the hum issue and other issues I'm going to mention later here.

Secondly I'm running this into my Pioneer Elite SC-LX701 and powering a 5.1 system with my mains being the SVS Ultra Towers also purchased this year. What has me a bit suprised is that when I was running the Ultra Towers through the Elite receiver alone (before I purchased the Monolith) I was getting what to me is better overall sound and dynamics with the receiver. When running through the receiver in Pure Direct mode for two channel listening, which I do a lot of, I got overall great sound. Now that I'm using the receiver as a preamp with the Monolith I find myself switching back and forth between Direct and Pure Direct mode to find the best performance and as stated I'm hearing less performance with the amp in the mix.....it doesn't sound bad but it doesn't sound great either. I've connected the AVR and the Amp with SVS Sound Path RCAs so I didn't skimp on the cables.

The Amp just isn't quite as dynamic as I was expecting....the bass is tight but not quite as full as it was with the Pioneer receiver alone and the mids and highs tend to be a bit too bright with the amp as well, when that wasn't the case with the Elite alone running things.

I used to have a Nackamichi PA 7 and I always had that plugged directly into the wall outlet and Monoprice suggests, well actually directs you to plug this directly into a wall socket as well. Have not done that yet seeing that I have two surge protectors with the rest of my equipment plugged into along with the Emotiva CMX 2. To be clear the CMX 2 is plugged directly into the wall socket of course and with two available outlets one is taken up by my new amp and the other is one of ther two surge protectors.

Anyways....sorry for the long ramble here....the Monolith is still well within Monoprices 30 day return window so I'm trying to figure out what I may be able to do to resolve these issues and if I can't "maybe" I just received an amp that isn't up to snuff or legitamately has an issue. With all the great reviews on this amp, including Genes', I was really suprised at some of the issues I've experienced.

Thanks in advance for any help......and feel free to question anything I've done or haven't done.

 

[Kleinst]

When I was looking at AVRs, Accessories4less was selling the 701 and was trying to convince me to buy that one because they said the class D amp in that AVR was very dynamic. No idea if that's true but it might be that its going to give you all you need. I ended up getting a Marantz instead but I considered that one.

Honestly, if your 7x isn't making it for you, maybe you return it and keep that $ for the next big purchase. They aren't cheap these days.

But have you tried using a cheater plug for one second (not perm. as that's dangerous I hear) just to make sure it's not a grounding issue? (Which i assume would be heard through the speakers)

 

[mazersteven]

Why did you feel you needed an amp in the first place? That's a pretty stout receiver

 

[Ledformyhead]

Why did you feel you needed an amp in the first place? That's a pretty stout receiver

I've found the Ultras to be a bit power hungry and with the Elite being 135 watts (2 channels driven of course) I had the opportunity to snag the Monolith and thought my 2 channel listening would improve with the "higher quality" amplification and increased wattage. Plus in full 5.1 perfomance I would get more out of the other speakers in the set up having a full 200 watts going to all channels. After reading damn near ALL of the reviews I thought this beast would get more out of the Ultra Towers.....at this point not so much and a little less in the end.

 

[Ledformyhead]

When I was looking at AVRs, Accessories4less was selling the 701 and was trying to convince me to buy that one because they said the class D amp in that AVR was very dynamic. No idea if that's true but it might be that its going to give you all you need. I ended up getting a Marantz instead but I considered that one.

Honestly, if your 7x isn't making it for you, maybe you return it and keep that $ for the next big purchase. They aren't cheap these days.

But have you tried using a cheater plug for one second (not perm. as that's dangerous I hear) just to make sure it's not a grounding issue? (Which i assume would be heard through the speakers)

I actually purchased the 701 from Accessories4less.....they were the best price at the time by a good amount.

I really don't think it's a grounding issue....not sure what you mean by "cheater plug". As I said nothing is coming through the speakers......it's just a humming from the Monolith itself that comes and goes.

I may end up returning it in the end if I can't resolve my issues. Hate doing that but it may end up happening.

 

[Kleinst]

I have a monolith 7 and I don’t get any transformer hum that I notice. So it’s hard to tell if it’s the AMP just being bad as I wouldn’t think it should do that so new, or if something in your house is irritating it. Maybe try to run an extension cord from plugs on another circuit to see if it goes away. Not easy to move it around to different parts of the house and try that I’m sure.

 

[PENG]

I've got a few questions regarding my recently received Monolith 7 X 200 amp that I hope you guys may be able to help me with. First I am getting a intermitent hum from the unit (the unit itself, not through the speakers)....I've seen others comment on this and I also read Gene DellaSalas' review of the unit suggesting plugging it into an Emotiva common mode AC line filter and DC offset eliminator (now the CMX 2). He said that fixed his issue and the CMX2 does not limit current or performance in any way. I purchased one because I do have a dimmer switch on the same floor as the amp, not sure it is on the same circuit.

I could be due to some nasty harmonic resonance. To eliminate that possibility, you could try it in the middle of the night when you can switch everything off, no dimmer, no tv, no humidifier, basically nothing that has variable speed or light controls need to be off/unplugged even better. If the hum/noise from the amp's transformer is gone than you know it is a harmonic issue, then you need to turn things on one at a time to determine which one(s) is/are the culprit. Those dc offset killer may fix noise issue due to dc, but not harmonics in the ac line.

You are right about transformer hum and ground loop related hum, that should be there all the time or at least most of the time, not so intermittent.

Obviously the quickest/safest/simplest way is to return the unit, but..

 

[Ledformyhead]

I could be due to some nasty harmonic resonance. To eliminate that possibility, you could try it in the middle of the night when you can switch everything off, no dimmer, no tv, no humidifier, basically nothing that has variable speed or light controls need to be off/unplugged even better. If the hum/noise from the amp's transformer is gone than you know it is a harmonic issue, then you need to turn things on one at a time to determine which one(s) is/are the culprit. Those dc offset killer may fix noise issue due to dc, but not harmonics in the ac line.

You are right about transformer hum and ground loop related hum, that should be there all the time or at least most of the time, not so intermittent.

Obviously the quickest/safest/simplest way is to return the unit, but..

But what? Ha! You left me hangin' there. The biggest BUT I see in a return is shipping this 93 pound beast back to them and likely on my dime, I haven't checked but I'm guessing the 30 day return policy doesn't cover shipping.

 

[VMPS-TIII]

I've got a few questions regarding my recently received Monolith 7 X 200 amp that I hope you guys may be able to help me with. First I am getting a intermitent hum from the unit (the unit itself, not through the speakers)....I've seen others comment on this and I also read Gene DellaSalas' review of the unit suggesting plugging it into an Emotiva common mode AC line filter and DC offset eliminator (now the CMX 2). He said that fixed his issue and the CMX2 does not limit current or performance in any way. I purchased one because I do have a dimmer switch on the same floor as the amp, not sure it is on the same circuit. After using it now for a few days it "may" have improved the issue some but the hum is still there. I doubt it is a grounding issue because it comes and goes. I have not run a ground wire off of the Amp at this point. It's running off of my std house 15 amp outlet. I am considering running a dedicated 20 amp circuit for my Home Theater but I'm confident this is not going to fix the hum issue and other issues I'm going to mention later here.

Secondly I'm running this into my Pioneer Elite SC-LX701 and powering a 5.1 system with my mains being the SVS Ultra Towers also purchased this year. What has me a bit suprised is that when I was running the Ultra Towers through the Elite receiver alone (before I purchased the Monolith) I was getting what to me is better overall sound and dynamics with the receiver. When running through the receiver in Pure Direct mode for two channel listening, which I do a lot of, I got overall great sound. Now that I'm using the receiver as a preamp with the Monolith I find myself switching back and forth between Direct and Pure Direct mode to find the best performance and as stated I'm hearing less performance with the amp in the mix.....it doesn't sound bad but it doesn't sound great either. I've connected the AVR and the Amp with SVS Sound Path RCAs so I didn't skimp on the cables.

The Amp just isn't quite as dynamic as I was expecting....the bass is tight but not quite as full as it was with the Pioneer receiver alone and the mids and highs tend to be a bit too bright with the amp as well, when that wasn't the case with the Elite alone running things.

I used to have a Nackamichi PA 7 and I always had that plugged directly into the wall outlet and Monoprice suggests, well actually directs you to plug this directly into a wall socket as well. Have not done that yet seeing that I have two surge protectors with the rest of my equipment plugged into along with the Emotiva CMX 2. To be clear the CMX 2 is plugged directly into the wall socket of course and with two available outlets one is taken up by my new amp and the other is one of ther two surge protectors.

Anyways....sorry for the long ramble here....the Monolith is still well within Monoprices 30 day return window so I'm trying to figure out what I may be able to do to resolve these issues and if I can't "maybe" I just received an amp that isn't up to snuff or legitamately has an issue. With all the great reviews on this amp, including Genes', I was really suprised at some of the issues I've experienced.

Thanks in advance for any help......and feel free to question anything I've done or haven't done.

My Monolith 7X200 is plugged into a monolith surge protector. I don't have any hum at all. It's dead silent and even the turn on is absolutely quiet. I use a 15 amp outlet.

Based on the hum issue and the fact that you don't really like the sound compared to your receiver I would return it. I did find the sound was a bit crisper with the Monolith 7X200 maybe that's the brightness you hear?

As the 7X200 cost was probably over $1700 for a new unit you should let it go now during the return period rather than live with it unhappy. I ordered some Magnepan speakers months ago that just arrived. After testing them, they're not what I expected and will be returning them. I'm out shipping both ways but I'm not stuck with something I won't use. Unfortunately, this happens sometimes.

 

[Kleinst]

Happened to me with a klipsch center I tried a month or two back wasn’t

My Monolith 7X200 is plugged into a monolith surge protector. I don't have any hum at all. It's dead silent and even the turn on is absolutely quiet. I use a 15 amp outlet.

Based on the hum issue and the fact that you don't really like the sound compared to your receiver I would return it. I did find the sound was a bit crisper with the Monolith 7X200 maybe that's the brightness you hear?

As the 7X200 cost was probably over $1700 for a new unit you should let it go now during the return period rather than live with it unhappy. I ordered some Magnepan speakers months ago that just arrived. After testing them, they're not what I expected and will be returning them. I'm out shipping both ways but I'm not stuck with something I won't use. Unfortunately, this happens sometimes.

Happened to me with a klipsch center I tried a month or two back wasn’t any better than what I had. Strangely sometimes there is a value in realizing something isn’t better than what you have even if it costs a little shipping. Cost of doing business I guess

 

[eljr]

the bass is tight but not quite as full as it was with the Pioneer receiver alone and the mids and highs tend to be a bit too bright with the amp as well,

amazing

simply amazing

 

[PENG]

But what? Ha! You left me hangin' there. The biggest BUT I see in a return is shipping this 93 pound beast back to them and likely on my dime, I haven't checked but I'm guessing the 30 day return policy doesn't cover shipping.

You got it, that's what the "but...." implied, just didn't want to upset you by spelling it out.

 

[Ledformyhead]

amazing

simply amazing

Out of curiosity what is "amazing.....simply amazing"? One would think that the Monolith amp would at the very least sounded as good with the Ultra Towers.....I didn't expect some night and day difference. But to get somewhat diminished sound quality is something that truely suprised me.

And for what it's worth with all of the extremely positive reviews, including Audioholics themselves naming this "Product of the Year" for 2016 I believe I would have expected that adding this to my system would have been a positive result. The fact that a Pioneer Elite AVR would sonically out perform the Monolith (especially in 2 channel listening) is a bit "amazing".

 

[Ledformyhead]

You got it, that's what they "but...." implied, just didn't want to upset you by spelling it out.

Well they have apprently extended their return policy over the Holidays for any "Monoprice branded product" purchased between November 27th and December 24th out to Jan 31st. Mine falls into that time frame. So it looks like I have until then to return it, which is nice I guess. Gives me some more time to try and play around with this. They also schedule a Fed Ex pick up for you which is nice. No mention as to who pays for shipping.....I think I know the answer to that unfortunately.

 

[mazersteven]

Just one thing that's been brought up that I'd like to address. Let's just for a minute say there's no issue with the Monolith amp. And even if your receiver isn't putting out the full stated Watts into the full 7 channels. There will be No difference in "Sound Quality" between the receiver and amp. That amp is designed to produce undistorted, consistent, clean power. It's not meant to color, or manipulate sound frequencies.
Amps are about performance, not changing sound

 

[Ledformyhead]

Just one thing that's been brought up that I'd like to address. Let's just for a minute say there's no issue with the Monolith amp. And even if your receiver isn't putting out the full stated Watts into the full 7 channels. There will be No difference in "Sound Quality" between the receiver and amp. That amp is designed to produce undistorted, consistent, clean power. It's not meant to color, or manipulate sound frequencies.
Amps are about performance, not changing sound

I get that when it comes to amplifiers as to the technical aspects of what they do and don't do. However we all know that certain amps sound better than others whether it be due to how an amplifier matches up with a speaker, what it's design is and how effectively it delivers its power. If all amps were the same, I and others would simply buy the cheapest amp they could that puts out the power desired.

In this case, as I stated, this amp is actually sonically less dynmamic than the Elite receiver. I realize that may be due to the receiver possibly coloring the sound some but with all the commentary on this Monolith amp one would think that I would not notice an actual sonic quality and dynamic fall off. Maybe I'm nuts.....but I don't think so. I've been an "audioholic" for roughly 40 years and I think I know what to expect and what not to expect. With that said I don't know everything by any means which is why I'm reaching out here to the forum.

P.S. I also realize that it is unlikely that there is anything wrong with such a new amp.....but it's not impossible. With that said I am moving forward assuming it's not the amp and perhaps it's an issue elsewhere. The hum issue is its own issue....I'd love to get that resolved. I purchased the Emotiva "conditioner" the CMX 2 based on Genes experience with the same hum. As stated it has not fully resoved the issue.....that's disappointing on its own. But to be honest I could live with that minor hum (at times not so minor by the way) IF the amp sounded great with these Ultra Towers. But as stated it's not as expected. I've even read articles on here and elsewhere where folks have paired this specific amp with my Ultra Towers and they have stated it was a great pairing.....the amp really brought the SVS Towers alive. Not hearing that.....and unfortunately quite the opposite in my case.

 

[mazersteven]

However we all know that certain amps sound better than others whether it be due to how an amplifier matches up with a speaker

"Matches up w/ speakers"

I must have missed that. That certain amps match better with certain speakers better than others. I'll have to refer to my Audioholics for Dummies manual again see if I miss that.

 

[lovinthehd]

I actually purchased the 701 from Accessories4less.....they were the best price at the time by a good amount.

I really don't think it's a grounding issue....not sure what you mean by "cheater plug". As I said nothing is coming through the speakers......it's just a humming from the Monolith itself that comes and goes.

I may end up returning it in the end if I can't resolve my issues. Hate doing that but it may end up happening.

While I've never found a power amp to be a magical difference, just more capability over typical avr amp sections, YMMV. So far its sounding like maybe a return and putting the money to other uses if your Pioneer works great for you alone.....

Cheater plug to test if lifting ground makes a difference

 

[VMPS-TIII]

But what? Ha! You left me hangin' there. The biggest BUT I see in a return is shipping this 93 pound beast back to them and likely on my dime, I haven't checked but I'm guessing the 30 day return policy doesn't cover shipping.

It's possible you could get Monoprice to pay for the return shipping if the unit is defective. Hum is not normal and if no other devices hum on the same circuit I would contact Monoprice and tell them why the unit is defective and ask for a return shipping label.

You should be happy with a new purchase. If they send you anything less than a no hum unit then you should be able to receive a return shipping label. They may not offer it at first but if you keep pressing the issue they will make good on this.

 

[Truthslayer]

That best price you found , could turn out to be costly.
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