Mismatched sub help needed

[ciotime]

Hi...a noob here needing some help. I currently have 2 subs ( Paradigm PDR10 and PDR12 ) in a dedicated HT room ( 13x19x8 ) that is functional but quite old. I'm planning on getting the SVS PB-1000 since my old subs can't really go down to the lower frequencies.
1) Will I be better off using 2 SVS PB-1000 rather than integrating the SVS to the existing 2 Paradigm subs? I would rather integrate them than having to spend for another sub.
2) Should I just use the PDR12 and SVS PB-1000 for a dual setup or is a 3 sub setup doable?
3) I understand that Audyssey will only EQ to the capability of the less capable Paradigm Subwoofers but can I use the miniDSP to get around this problem and be able to maximize the SVS's potential? If so how do I go about doing this? A step by step guide would be truly helpful...thanks.

*PDR-10

Amplifier: 120 watts RMS / 360 watts Peak
Subwoofer Cutoff Frequency: Variable 50 Hz – 150 Hz
Bass Driver: 254-mm (10 in) carbon-fiber-reinforced composite cone, 38-mm (1-1/2 in) voice coil
Low Frequency Extension: 27 Hz (DIN)


*PDR-12

Amplifier: 150 watts RMS / 450 watts Peak
Low Pass Filter Frequency: Variable 50Hz-150Hz
Low Frequency Driver: 305-mm ( 12" ) carbon-fiber-reinforced composite cone, 51-mm (2 in) voice coil
Low Frequency Extension: 24 Hz (DIN)



*SVS PB-1000 Specs

Amplifier Power Rating	300 W RMS 720 W Peak
Drivers	10" / 25.4 cm
Frequency Response	19 to 270 Hz
Amplifier Class	Class-D

 

[mazersteven]

Just a thought. Sell the Paradigm's make a couple of bucks to offset the cost of 1 capable subwoofer for that size room.

 

[ciotime]

Just a thought. Sell the Paradigm's make a couple of bucks to offset the cost of 1 capable subwoofer for that size room.

I prefer to use 2 subs for my HT room coz of the benefits of using multiple subs instead of 1. I know the best option is to use 2 SVS's but if it's possible to save then I wanna try using the PDR12 with the single SVS.

 

[stalag2005]

Honestly the Paradigm subwoofers you have are very good for the time they were developed. I replaced my pdr-3100 Paradigm subwoofer with a Paradigm Defiance x12 and it was a massive improvement. In my office on my computer audio I replaced a Pinnacle 100 subwoofer with a SVS SB-3000 which was also a major improvement. The newer subwoofers design and capabilities are so vastly improved that IMHO you are not going to see the best improvement mixing old with new vs. all new.

 

[ciotime]

I've posted here the REW results of the 3 subs routed to the miniDSP.

2 subs on the front and 1 sub at the rear center. No EQ etc yet. Just the summation of the 3 subs turned on. Measurement was made from 10HZ to 120HZ. I don't really know what the graph says. I just know there's a dip at about the 38HZ and 75HZ region. Can anyone please check the results if it's not bad/average/bad? Thanks.

 

[shadyJ]

The ideal here is a flat line, of course. One thing you might think about doing is using EQ to trim the hump from 20 to 30Hz. It is very highly boosted compared to everything else. But then again it is so low in frequency that it probably isn't an issue all that often. The dips shouldn't be fixed by EQ, they should be alleviated through different subwoofer placements. The dip at 75Hz is what should be addressed first, that would be what I would be looking to get rid of above all else.

 

[ciotime]

The ideal here is a flat line, of course. One thing you might think about doing is using EQ to trim the hump from 20 to 30Hz. It is very highly boosted compared to everything else. But then again it is so low in frequency that it probably isn't an issue all that often. The dips shouldn't be fixed by EQ, they should be alleviated through different subwoofer placements. The dip at 75Hz is what should be addressed first, that would be what I would be looking to get rid of above all else.

I added delays to the 2 subs and inverted the rear sub. Below is the result. Is it better?

 

[shadyJ]

That is better, but there is still some room for improvement. The 75Hz dip is still there. You will probably need to physically move the subs to address that.

 

[ciotime]

Thanks...I saw Home theater guru's video and he used EQ via the miniDSP to smooth out the response using a house curve. Maybe that will help?

 

[shadyJ]

I would aim for a flat response first. Once you know you can get that, you can adjust it to taste, but getting a flat response to start with shows that you have already taken care of acoustic problems.

 

[ciotime]

I would aim for a flat response first. Once you know you can get that, you can adjust it to taste, but getting a flat response to start with shows that you have already taken care of acoustic problems.

I did some tinkering on REW. After EQ this is what I got. Saw a video that instead of using a house curve in REW EQ to just instead flatten the response and to try to get it to hug the line as much as possible. I'm still a noob so I can't really say if this result is considered really good.

 

[shadyJ]

I did some tinkering on REW. After EQ this is what I got. Saw a video that instead of using a house curve in REW EQ to just instead flatten the response and to try to get it to hug the line as much as possible. I'm still a noob so I can't really say if this result is considered really good.

View attachment 42668

That is an excellent response. The thing is to measure it in other positions too, to make sure the improvements aren't only for one position in space. See what the response is near that measurement position and also in other listening positions in the room.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

That’s definitely an excellent response. To add to shadys points, now is when to start building the house curve, as I’m sure the way it is now will sound a little flat. No pun intended.

 

[ciotime]

That is an excellent response. The thing is to measure it in other positions too, to make sure the improvements aren't only for one position in space. See what the response is near that measurement position and also in other listening positions in the room.

Will do...

 

[ciotime]

That’s definitely an excellent response. To add to shadys points, now is when to start building the house curve, as I’m sure the way it is now will sound a little flat. No pun intended.

Thanks...sorry for the noob question but what advice can you give for setting the house curve? Thanks.

 

[lovinthehd]

Toole's research found people like a bit of a tilt up at the lower end of the frequency range, and a tilt down at the upper end of the frequency range...but how much of a tilt is personal preference as well. You might find this discussion interesting https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/some-comments-from-floyd-toole-about-room-curve-targets-room-eq-and-more.10950/

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Thanks...sorry for the noob question but what advice can you give for setting the house curve? Thanks.

Sorry if I missed. It what are you using for eq? Minidsp? Or audyssey?
Basically you’ll want a shelf filter at 22hz(based on the graph it looks like your sub rolls off there) at maybe +5db. It should taper down to 200hz from there. I would read the link HD put up. Also, google “how to” set a house curve. Theresa lot of good info at home theater shack although it is old by now, the principles are there. I’ll be driving most of the day so hopefully you can get some help from the guys.

 

[ciotime]

Sorry if I missed. It what are you using for eq? Minidsp? Or audyssey?
Basically you’ll want a shelf filter at 22hz(based on the graph it looks like your sub rolls off there) at maybe +5db. It should taper down to 200hz from there. I would read the link HD put up. Also, google “how to” set a house curve. Theresa lot of good info at home theater shack although it is old by now, the principles are there. I’ll be driving most of the day so hopefully you can get some help from the guys.

Used MiniDSP.