Separate sub eq for music?

[Nakean]

RF82 < forte, IMO, not close, particularly in the bass. Forte bass is tight, dry and resolving, not bloated or ringy.

By design the fortes rely on boundary reinforcement to dig deep (f3 is in the low thirties, but only if stuffed deep into corners), but since you have a sub for that your priority should be for positioning catering to imaging. Due to their high directivity down to low midrange frequencies, fortes lend themselves to extreme toe-in orientation to take advantage of time/intensity trading. That will dramatically expand the sweet spot. Google up the Bill Waslo authored paper on the topic.

The rest of my forte tips relate to eq, and I'm not sure what eq capability your kit provides. If possible, play with reductions of 2-4 db in the 2-3kHz area. That will really take the edge off and deepen the soundstage.

And use caution in search of chest thumping bass. Your rig is capable of serious spls. Listening at safer levels may demand some loudness eq to get the same effect, but you won't end up with tinnitus.

I meant that the treble was rolled off not the bass, sorry if it sounded like I meant the bass rolled off much sooner. I have them in corners and toed way in. I'm sacrificing a bit of sweet spot area for directness and center image as I don't have it toed in front of the MLP but directly toward the MLP.

My AVR automatically creates a midrange compensation dip right around that 2K mark.

Yes, very good point about those SPL's. I'm only getting older and your ears and hearing are a great blessing one should not destroy.

Finally ordered two sealed flat packs from DIYSoundGroup. I'm extremely excited to separate the two 18 drivers for an even response in the room. I'll only have about 500watts on tap to each for now at 4 ohms so shouldn't be able to get too crazy.

 

[Nakean]

Probably higher than that as was said. What are your speakers? I remember the sub now....

I finally placed my order for two sealed flat packs from DIYSoundGroup. Now I just have to remember how the guy who sold the Daytons to me told me the order in removing the drivers from the sill box.

 

[ski2xblack]

Cool, sounds like you've done your homework already. If you're using YPAOvolume or Audyssey DynamicEQ (both are loudness compensation eq), the offsets will demand different settings than less sensitive speakers, which includes your previous RF82. Try 'em toed in further, where the axis cross well in front of the mlp, by several feet, just to experiment if nothing else...looks weird, sounds amazing.

 

[ski2xblack]

@Nakean , Just came across your other sub thread, and strongly suspect that the dipole sub is the culprit. That thing is throwing out a roughly figure 8 shaped lobal pattern of cancellation and reinforcement (hence the divergent measurements via simply rotating the box). It's such an unpredictable mess, and if that sub is crossed at 80 it's affecting that chest hit band of frequencies too. You'll get more predictable and manageable response when you get the new sub cabs, no doubt.

Great avi pic! One proud papa.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

@Nakean , Just came across your other sub thread, and strongly suspect that the dipole sub is the culprit. That thing is throwing out a roughly figure 8 shaped lobal pattern of cancellation and reinforcement (hence the divergent measurements via simply rotating the box). It's such an unpredictable mess, and if that sub is crossed at 80 it's affecting that chest hit band of frequencies too. You'll get more predictable and manageable response when you get the new sub cabs, no doubt.

Great avi pic! One proud papa.

Yeah, the 45° sweep was really strange. I’d say unpredictable is generous lol. In any case, should have something legit very soon.
Also, iirc at the end of the other thread, nakean made a comment about keeping the box anyway, as his wife appreciated NOT getting shaken by bass. Gonna go ahead and say NOOOOOOOO that’s crazy talk...

 

[ski2xblack]

Hey, until he slaps together the new subs, he can enjoy highly localized, if uneven, WAF friendly bass. He might sidestep the mid-bass punch issues by crossing lower.

 

[Nakean]

@Nakean , Just came across your other sub thread, and strongly suspect that the dipole sub is the culprit. That thing is throwing out a roughly figure 8 shaped lobal pattern of cancellation and reinforcement (hence the divergent measurements via simply rotating the box). It's such an unpredictable mess, and if that sub is crossed at 80 it's affecting that chest hit band of frequencies too. You'll get more predictable and manageable response when you get the new sub cabs, no doubt.

Great avi pic! One proud papa.

Definitely a proud papa. He's not nearly as small anymore but love him just the same.

Hey, until he slaps together the new subs, he can enjoy highly localized, if uneven, WAF friendly bass. He might sidestep the mid-bass punch issues by crossing lower.

That's definitely the plan until the boxes are made. I just got the FedEx shipping number for the boxes, so I'll be starting the builds sometime next week.

 

[Nakean]

Yeah, the 45° sweep was really strange. I’d say unpredictable is generous lol. In any case, should have something legit very soon.
Also, iirc at the end of the other thread, nakean made a comment about keeping the box anyway, as his wife appreciated NOT getting shaken by bass. Gonna go ahead and say NOOOOOOOO that’s crazy talk...

Haha, crazy talk indeed, but I might argue any man who gets married is a little crazy. The fact that I can have Forte's and 2 large 18's in an era of shrinking speakers like Sonos and the like, I feel pretty damn lucky.

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

Haha, crazy talk indeed, but I might argue any man who gets married is a little crazy. The fact that I can have Forte's and 2 large 18's in an era of shrinking speakers like Sonos and the like, I feel pretty damn lucky.

As well you should! I agree, marriage takes a lot to be successful. Just hit 20yrs in September. I hear you on the gear. I have 3 subs in the LR, my mains are monkey coffins with 12” woofers, 7.3.4 overall and she does NOT love it, but I do so we figure it out. I think what makes her most crazy is the 5.1 in the bedroom and 5.2 in the media room as if Atmos in the LR isn’t enough. Lol.
Not to mention my studio with drums and guitars, and a piano in the house too. It’s all good though. Until I start talking upgrades...lol!

 

[Nakean]

As well you should! I agree, marriage takes a lot to be successful. Just hit 20yrs in September. I hear you on the gear. I have 3 subs in the LR, my mains are monkey coffins with 12” woofers, 7.3.4 overall and she does NOT love it, but I do so we figure it out. I think what makes her most crazy is the 5.1 in the bedroom and 5.2 in the media room as if Atmos in the LR isn’t enough. Lol.
Not to mention my studio with drums and guitars, and a piano in the house too. It’s all good though. Until I start talking upgrades...lol!

haha, I love it, man! We just got married and just moved last year so I'm trying to take it slow. Would love to convert the garage and soundproof as much as possible to bring the drums, piano, and guitars in there. We have two 10-year-olds (boy and girl) so I think I have leverage there, hahaha.
Laptop only in the bed is killing me. I don't care about the screen but the god awful laptop sound. Can't even hear it half the time. She knows that's a slippery slope and she's holding fast, lol.

Congrats on 20 years! That amazing.

 

[ski2xblack]

haha, I love it, man! We just got married and just moved last year so I'm trying to take it slow. Would love to convert the garage and soundproof as much as possible to bring the drums, piano, and guitars in there. We have two 10-year-olds (boy and girl) so I think I have leverage there, hahaha.
Laptop only in the bed is killing me. I don't care about the screen but the god awful laptop sound. Can't even hear it half the time. She knows that's a slippery slope and she's holding fast, lol.

Congrats on 20 years! That amazing.

Nothing will test her more than your collection of big ol' Klipsch Heritage speakers. If she'll put up with that, she's demonstrated being wife material. Kudos!

Back to audiophilia, if I may, since you're down the Heritage rabbit hole and have a taste for that sort of thing. You're also familiar with Diysoundgroup. At least a few of us have built some of their speaker offerings, in my case the Jeff Bagby designed Fusion 12 Tempests. They're about the size of your Heresies but performance-wise closer to your fortes (possible WAF angle). Unlike either of your Klipsch, they require no eq or fussing, as in nothing at all, to sound great.

So, if after building your subs, if you wish to dive deeper into building some mains that rock as hard as your Klipsch but without the requisite eq and tweaking, there are options out there to consider. It's a fun path, potential father/son project too.

 

[Nakean]

Nothing will test her more than your collection of big ol' Klipsch Heritage speakers. If she'll put up with that, she's demonstrated being wife material. Kudos!

Back to audiophilia, if I may, since you're down the Heritage rabbit hole and have a taste for that sort of thing. You're also familiar with Diysoundgroup. At least a few of us have built some of their speaker offerings, in my case the Jeff Bagby designed Fusion 12 Tempests. They're about the size of your Heresies but performance-wise closer to your fortes (possible WAF angle). Unlike either of your Klipsch, they require no eq or fussing, as in nothing at all, to sound great.

So, if after building your subs, if you wish to dive deeper into building some mains that rock as hard as your Klipsch but without the requisite eq and tweaking, there are options out there to consider. It's a fun path, potential father/son project too.

Will be checking those out! Thank you so much!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

It seems like everyone including myself are always searching for the plus or minus 3DB flat holy grail response but in that flat response I feel as though I’m missing that chest thumping bass when I play certain types of music. Do you guys ever cut your super low frequencies and boost the mid base on order to get that thump or do your systems give you that chest thumb even with a flat response?

Yeah I use my Yamaha Parametric EQ to boost my sub’s 40-80 Hz by 3.0dB to get that chest-thumping slamming freight-train-from-hell bass.