Grounding.

[lovinthehd]

Yep, actual fiber. It's a thin little cable too that they bury in your lawn leading to the house. Plus, I'm already being irradiated by 5G.

The actual repair technician of my AVR said he has everything on one extension cord that he unplugs when a storm comes. Oh' the thoughts that ran through me head. The actual power company said they can test if there is an adequate grounding rod for a fee. Google that stuff and there's a few endless rabbit holes about using dedicated rods.

In the house I lived at before my current one, the cable company had just created their own ground rather than use the house's main one (and I did have some ground loop hum issues that caused me to look into it). My current place the installs have used the house's ground. As far as lightning goes, my grandfather, an ee, would just simply unplug electronics if the electric storm forecast worried him enough. I fortunately live in an area where lightning is relatively rare so not much of a worry for me in any case. If I did the UPS with disengagement sounds good as well as whole home surge protection....

 

[TLS Guy]

Wow, you have an actual fiber that comes into your house? While we have fiber into town, the connections to the house are standard coax copper type and still require grounding....

At our lake home on Benedict Lake we had fiber coming into the house. However code requires these fiber cables to have a metal grounding wire in the cable. This still has to be grounded correctly. I have no idea why this is required, but it is.

 

[highfigh]

Some experts make a strong case that just the opposite is true.

Motors don't cause spikes? Really? Ever seen lights dim when the refrigerator or furnace motor start?

Do you have examples?

 

[highfigh]

The only device likely to cause a surge inside most homes is the AC air compressor motor, and then only if it has failing starting and or running caps. These should be professionally checked every year before the start of each cooling season. Failing to check these caps causes more failure of electronic equipment than generally realized. If you note any change in your lighting as the AC starts, get these caps checked right away.

You forgot about refrigerators, sump and well pumps, etc. You're also assuming the house wiring is clean, tight and has no corrosion. Dimming can also be caused by the connections at the service entrance such as the crimped terminals for the two hot and neutral before the meter- those caused the problems at my parents' house and ended after the terminals were replaced.

 

[highfigh]

Yep, actual fiber. It's a thin little cable too that they bury in your lawn leading to the house. Plus, I'm already being irradiated by 5G.

The actual repair technician of my AVR said he has everything on one extension cord that he unplugs when a storm comes. Oh' the thoughts that ran through me head. The actual power company said they can test if there is an adequate grounding rod for a fee. Google that stuff and there's a few endless rabbit holes about using dedicated rods.

You were being irradiated by the last three cellular systems, weather radar and and any other wireless devices in your house.

BTW- if you think 5G stands for '5Gigahertz', you need to read about what it really means. 5G stands for '5th Generation'.

You don't want to use a bunch of grounding rods spread around the building. The whole idea behind using them at one place is to prevent resistance in the ground and electrical service causing voltage to be present between device grounds. The system is supposed to be equipotential.

 

[TLS Guy]

You forgot about refrigerators, sump and well pumps, etc. You're also assuming the house wiring is clean, tight and has no corrosion. Dimming can also be caused by the connections at the service entrance such as the crimped terminals for the two hot and neutral before the meter- those caused the problems at my parents' house and ended after the terminals were replaced.

The motors in refrigerators, sump pumps and well pumps are much smaller 120 volt motors. Yes they can cause spikes, but they are very unlikely to damage equipment. Again if those devices are dimming light they need to be checked. I don't think those devices generally have caps. I know our well pump at our lake home did not have caps.

 

[Speedskater]

I agree after this I put in my own ground stake outside and ran separate ground wires to anything that would except it here in my area eastern Ohio for some reason we get a lot of fluctuations in our power everybody has had problems with it . I’ll take no chances again was an expensive repair job that time .

DANGER, DANGER, DANGER
Never, ever do this! It's just asking for trouble.
All the ground rods need to be connected to a single point near the service entrance / main breaker panel.
The idea is during a nearby lightning strike, is to keep everything at the same potential. Different ground rod systems can have several thousands of volts between them.

 

[Speedskater]

Motors don't cause spikes? Really? Ever seen lights dim when the refrigerator or furnace motor start?
Do you have examples?

Bill Whitlock , retired from Jensen Transformer goes into detail in his seminar paper:

http://centralindianaaes.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/indy-aes-2012-seminar-w-notes-v1-0.pdf

 

[Mark E. Long]

DANGER, DANGER, DANGER
Never, ever do this! It's just asking for trouble.
All the ground rods need to be connected to a single point near the service entrance / main breaker panel.
The idea is during a nearby lightning strike, is to keep everything at the same potential. Different ground rod systems can have several thousands of volts between them.

I do have one for the whole service for the main house service. I just put one in for the few grounds that go to equipment them selves the main one at the service entrance should cover the whole house anyhow. This is just for individual grounding for outboard eq’s and the avr it’s not an ungrounded line from the panel .

 

[highfigh]

Bill Whitlock , retired from Jensen Transformer goes into detail in his seminar paper:

http://centralindianaaes.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/indy-aes-2012-seminar-w-notes-v1-0.pdf

Do you want to reference a specific section? Is it the part about NEC grounding?

I have met and talked with Bill Whitlock- he didn't say I was an idiot and didn't dispute anything I said.

NEC articles 250 and 820-

https://www.dps.ny.gov/gbcs_Comments_Questions_and_Answers.html

Grounding & lightning protection system-

Code Q&A: Grounding & Lightning Protection System

Your most pressing National Electrical Code (NEC) questions answered

www.ecmweb.com

Who Cares About 25 Ohms or Less?

Find out why the National Electrical Code "25 ohms or less" rule may have less to do with power quality than you think. Nearly all electricians and electrical inspectors are familiar...

www.ecmweb.com

Code for new construction and ground rods-

Electrical Code for New Construction and Ground Rods

New Construction and Ground Rods: What is the current code for ground rods on new construction?

ask-the-electrician.com

Additional ground rods-

Adding second ground rod. Is this an acceptable way of bonding?

I recently found out that our sole ground rod is only 4 feet long. That said, I want to add a properly-sized ground rod to "improve" the grounding system and hopefully comply properly with the elec...

diy.stackexchange.com

 

[highfigh]

I do have one for the whole service for the main house service. I just put one in for the few grounds that go to equipment them selves the main one at the service entrance should cover the whole house anyhow. This is just for individual grounding for outboard eq’s and the avr it’s not an ungrounded line from the panel .

Read the links in my last post to Speedskater, especially the last two.

 

[highfigh]

At our lake home on Benedict Lake we had fiber coming into the house. However code requires these fiber cables to have a metal grounding wire in the cable. This still has to be grounded correctly. I have no idea why this is required, but it is.]

The motors in refrigerators, sump pumps and well pumps are much smaller 120 volt motors. Yes they can cause spikes, but they are very unlikely to damage equipment. Again if those devices are dimming light they need to be checked. I don't think those devices generally have caps. I know our well pump at our lake home did not have caps.

Refrigerators definitely have caps- I recently replaced the one in my fridge. I don't know about large pumps, but something has to cause it to start turning in the correct direction, right? Haven't seen a well pump in decades, so......

Is your fiber feed 'armored' cable? That would be the reason it needed to be grounded.

The links in my post to Speedskater pertain to general grounding, but also to communication equipment, too.

I think anyone who wants to install an extensive AV system/network needs to make sure they read and understand the pertinent NEC codes for those-

Communication systems and the NEC

Many people believe the National Electrical Code (NEC) has jurisdiction over electrical systems operating at a voltage only over a specified level. This

www.testandmeasurementtips.com

725.144 Transmission of Power and Data.

These CMP-LP cables comply with the rules in 725.144(B).

www.electricallicenserenewal.com

Adding second ground rod. Is this an acceptable way of bonding?

I recently found out that our sole ground rod is only 4 feet long. That said, I want to add a properly-sized ground rod to "improve" the grounding system and hopefully comply properly with the elec...

diy.stackexchange.com

National Electrical Code Tips: Article 840, Premises-Powered Broadband Systems

NEC information; expand your knowledge of the National Electrical Code with our free series of NEC 10 Tips, each covering an aspect of the Code. This article explains Article 840, Community Antenna Television and Radio Distribution Systems.

www.codebookcity.com

Communication systems and the NEC

Many people believe the National Electrical Code (NEC) has jurisdiction over electrical systems operating at a voltage only over a specified level. This

www.testandmeasurementtips.com

 

[Mark E. Long]

Read the links in my last post to Speedskater, especially the last two.

So I have to connect the second ground wire to the one that’s hooked to the meter box on the outside of our home to be effective? The way I have it now I’ve got a second one 6 ft long outside the window were my system is with a wire run to a water pipe and a wire run to my AVR so wouldn’t they be tied together in that way ? And thanks for you links and input on this .

 

[highfigh]

So I have to connect the second ground wire to the one that’s hooked to the meter box on the outside of our home to be effective? The way I have it now I’ve got a second one 6 ft long outside the window were my system is with a wire run to a water pipe and a wire run to my AVR so wouldn’t they be tied together in that way ? And thanks for you links and input on this .

One of the links refers to 25 Ohm goal, but also said it's not necessarily a realistic number.

Physically connected and electrically well-connected are two different things. One of them has a diagram with two rods that are 20 meters apart- because of the possibility of resistance between them, which causes them to be less connected than desired, it mentioned cows being killed when lightning strikes. They should have included people, because I don't remember seeing anything about the code being written as a way to save cattle.

Read about bonding and how it pertains to grounding in the link to Articles 250 and 800. Remember that electricity takes the path of least resistance and if that happens to be a human, that's where it will go. This is the reason for the electrical code- it's partly meant to assure roper operation of devices, but it's also meant to ensure safety.

 

[Speedskater]

Speedskater said:
Bill Whitlock , retired from Jensen Transformer goes into detail in his seminar paper:
http://centralindianaaes.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/indy-aes-2012-seminar-w-notes-v1-0.pdf

Do you want to reference a specific section? Is it the part about NEC grounding?

Sorry, the pages on surge suppression start at panel #210

The section on 'grounds' and 'Earth' starts at panel #17

 

[highfigh]

Speedskater said:
Bill Whitlock , retired from Jensen Transformer goes into detail in his seminar paper:
http://centralindianaaes.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/indy-aes-2012-seminar-w-notes-v1-0.pdf


Sorry, the pages on surge suppression start at panel #210

The section on 'grounds' and 'Earth' starts at panel #17

I did a system, starting in 2006, which required that most of the equipment be moved to the basement, along with some new gear. I was installing the rack and needed power for everything to be nearby, to avoid using any circuits that were already in this house, which was originally built in 1905 and had various "upgrades and updates". I asked for a separate wire for bonding the rack to the panel and Sparky said "When I do systems, I never do that" to which I replied, "I don't give a rat's ass what you do in your systems- they don't have computer-based music servers, equipment connected to systems on other floors & rooms and aren't as expensive as this equipment. If you don't do what I need, you won't get the trouble calls, I will.". This is the place where I heard the loud snap sound in the basement equipment room when lightning struck outside- NOTHING has been lost to surges, but a subsequent electrical job caused noise because they ran two heavy direct burial cables within 6" and parallel to my AV cabling when they abandoned the feeds from the pole, to bury everything. If it had been in conduit, I doubt the noise would have been audible, but.....

Metal equipment racks are supposed to be grounded, as per the code link I provided earlier, but Sparky didn't know that.

Bill's a cool guy- had a couple of chances to talk and it was very informative.

 

[Speedskater]

Yep, bonding pro audio style equipment racks to the Safety Ground system is a requirement (especially in commercial buildings)(NEC Article 640.22). Metal hi-fi shelf units are a different ball game.
The Middle Atlantic pro audio white paper often touches on racks.
"Integrating Electronic Equipment and Power into Rack Enclosures"
'Optimized Power Distribution and Grounding for Audio, Video and Electronic Systems'
the link works differently from time to time:
https://www.middleatlantic.com/resources/white-papers.aspx