Newer Denon AVRs vs my AVR-X5200--how much better Dolby True HD decoding?

[KEW]

As far as SACD and DVD-Audio, it has been my experience that standard CD's have the ability to provide excellent sound quality and I have not seen that the exact same recording on SACD (or DVD-A) audibly outperforms a plain CD.
However, there are cases where an older CD has been remastered as an aspect of the SACD.
So my answer is that it more depends on the capability of the recording/mastering engineer than the disc format!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

The x6400 SQ won’t be better. But you will have more features.

 

[Gmoney]

Somewhere around the year 2000, I promised myself a pair of whispers. By the time I can spend that kind of money on speakers, I’ll probably want something else but who knows...
Edit: yeah, these ones.

now that’s what i’m talking about! When you buy a pair of Legacy speakers you get a Professional home Installation expert ! She coming in a red dress and 6” Stiletto shoes! Sweet!

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

now that’s what i’m talking about! When you buy a pair of Legacy speakers you get a Professional home Installation expert ! She coming in a red dress and 6” Stiletto shoes! Sweet!

Wait, the speakers come with a hot babe? No wonder the SQ is improved!

 

[mtrot]

The x6400 SQ won’t be better. But you will have more features.

Thanks, well if the decoding is not going to be better, then there's no reason to upgrade for me.

 

[PENG]

Thanks, well if the decoding is not going to be better, then there's no reason to upgrade for me.

To me, the newer crops of avr/avc do decode better, assuming you meant the DSP (hardware and software) functionality.

As for the ICs, Denon/Marantz has updated the volume control and multiplexor/switche ICs for their whole line up since 2017 for sure but likely 2016, along with the DAC.

The DAC chip in the X6400H (same for the X1400H and SR5012) has much lower distortions+noise, 0.00045% vs 0.002% (lower better obviously), or in SINAD, 107 dB vs 94 dB (higher better) than the one in the X5200W.

The volume control chip in the X6400H (same for the X1400H and SR5012) also has better THD+N specs and the switches, being separate from the otherwise part of a LSI (large scale integrated) chip as well. For more information, read the introduction section of the linked article by Dr. Rich

AVR-Audio Video Reciever-Build Quality: Part V - HomeTheaterHifi.com

Good News! Marantz Says No More AVR LSIs for You! You might recall my article on Audio Video Receiver Build Quality announcing the downgrade of the analog section of almost every AVR and Pre Pro coming from the major Far Eastern manufacturers. The article discussed how multi-channel audio...

hometheaterhifi.com

As HD alluded to, while specs do support the newer D&M product are much better, it is not clear how many, if any at all, can tell the difference between the X5200H and X6400H in a properly conducted listening tests when the effects of bias are mitigated.

For example, is the difference between the 0.002% THD+N for the X5200W's DAC and the 0.00045% for the X6400H's audible? I have seen some Krell FPB amps that didn't measure all (in terms of THD+N)that well vs AVRs, definitely much worse than even the DAC in the AVR-X5200W, yet I bet you think it improves SQ for you even at low listening level right?

 

[mtrot]

To me, the newer crops of avr/avc do decode better, assuming you meant the DSP (hardware and software) functionality.

As for the ICs, Denon/Marantz has updated the volume control and multiplexor/switche ICs for their whole line up since 2017 for sure but likely 2016, along with the DAC.

The DAC chip in the X6400H (same for the X1400H and SR5012) has much lower distortions+noise, 0.00045% vs 0.002% (lower better obviously), or in SINAD, 107 dB vs 94 dB (higher better) than the one in the X5200W.

The volume control chip in the X6400H (same for the X1400H and SR5012) also has better THD+N specs and the switches, being separate from the otherwise part of a LSI (large scale integrated) chip as well. For more information, read the introduction section of the linked article by Dr. Rich

AVR-Audio Video Reciever-Build Quality: Part V - HomeTheaterHifi.com

Good News! Marantz Says No More AVR LSIs for You! You might recall my article on Audio Video Receiver Build Quality announcing the downgrade of the analog section of almost every AVR and Pre Pro coming from the major Far Eastern manufacturers. The article discussed how multi-channel audio...

hometheaterhifi.com

As HD alluded to, while specs do support the newer D&M product are much better, it is not clear how many, if any at all, can tell the difference between the X5200H and X6400H in a properly conducted listening tests when the effects of bias are mitigated.

For example, is the difference between the 0.002% THD+N for the X5200W's DAC and the 0.00045% for the X6400H's audible? I have seen some Krell FPB amps that didn't measure all (in terms of THD+N)that well vs AVRs, definitely much worse than even the DAC in the AVR-X5200W, yet I bet you think it improves SQ for you even at low listening level right?

Thanks much for taking the time to provide info on this. I wasn't really thinking about distortion levels at all, which I would think would be inconsequential on the 5200. What I would be interested in for an upgrade would be, how well can your hear what is going on in the overall sounds of the movie, clarity of dialog, placement of various sounds and effects in the sound field of the movie, and surround channel information, etc.

 

[PENG]

Thanks much for taking the time to provide info on this. I wasn't really thinking about distortion levels at all, which I would think would be inconsequential on the 5200. What I would be interested in for an upgrade would be, how well can your hear what is going on in the overall sounds of the movie, clarity of dialog, placement of various sounds and effects in the sound field of the movie, and surround channel information, etc.

In my own experience, my AVR-X4400H (2017) seems to do noticeably better in those sound effects, than my AV8801 that is the same year model (2014) as the X5200W but has a much better DAC (in specs). Though I am not sure about the clarity of dialog, that to me depends mostly on the recording and the loudspeakers. Dynamic volume would help, even in the "light" setting, but I think it works by simply boosting the speech's frequency band.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Thanks, well if the decoding is not going to be better, then there's no reason to upgrade for me.

Yeah, unless you have giant golden ears (who can hear the difference between THD of 0.01% vs 0.000000001% and SNR of 80dB vs 800dB ), I wouldn't worry about any SQ differences.

Just wait until you get an Atmos system or 8K TV.

I'm sure our giant golden eyes will be able to tell the difference between 4K vs 8K videos especially when the original movie was shot on 3K cameras.

 

[lovinthehd]

I've got avrs ranging over the last 10 years and don't think the handling of codecs in and of itself is appreciably different from unit to unit....has the software from Dolby or DTS changed appreciably? Audibility of very slight changes in distortion measurements.....meh.