Can a High End Receiver compete with High End Separates

[bnobre69]

Hi there,

can someone please tell me if a high end receiver like a marantz sr8012 or a denon x8500h can compete in audio quality with an onkyo m5000r power connected to a p3000r pre amp?
let´s imagine we would connect both to a good pair of speakers, would we be able to tell a diference if we did a blind test?
ive been searching around these questions and the separates vs receivers videos but the more i search the more confused i get....


Best regards

 

[Leemix]

Do you mean for 2 channel stereo music listening?
If so then not really but probably depends on the electronics themselves and your preferences. I dont know the onkyos you mentioned. I much prefer my PS audio stellar GCD as a dac or dac/pre-amp compared to the marantz 8805 for stereo music listening.

 

[Pogre]

This is gonna be fun.

 

[bnobre69]

sorry, yes @Leemix , i mean stereo setups, the onkyo power m5000r and the p3000r pre amp are premium produts, the p3000m pre amp also has a good dac, i think the onkyo duo sells for 5k.. there are many reviews (including audioholics) stating that these onkyo are the best thing onkyo has produced in the last 20 years and they do sound good.. but my main question is, the marantz sr8012 was able to drive 4ohm speakers in the audioholics bench tests, wich we may adress has one of the most fatal flaws in receivers, they lack high curent to drive low impedance speakers and they all have a limited power rating of 150watts (8ohm) maximum per channel.. and also, this marantz tested very good for stereo separation.. so the question is, whithin these powers (100watts) and connected to a good pair of speakers , were we able to tell the diference in quality?

 

[Out-Of-Phase]

can someone please tell me if a high end receiver like a marantz sr8012 or a denon x8500h can compete in audio quality with an onkyo m5000r power connected to a p3000r pre amp?

Yes.

 

[lovinthehd]

Too vague a setup for a real answer. Under what conditions particularly? You mean both setups used well within their comfort limits and both solid state setups? I doubt there'd be an audible difference just with good electronics....and if there was a slight difference would it be of importance let alone knowing which was "better"? Why are you worried about this sort of stuff? I've gone from good 2ch separates to various avrs and power amps with various rooms and speakers and not noticed any particular quality differences myself....even when I expected some. YMMV.

 

[Leemix]

It would be great if you could try them at home to hear what you think, if you like the difference enjoy it, if you dont or dont hear any you can save a lot of money
Just like peoples eyes are different peoples hearing is also, we notice, care about and are sensitive to different things.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Verdinut]

If the AVR is operated within its limits, you shouldn't hear any difference.

 

[BriReeves629]

I think it really comes down to features rather than SQ when choosing your source. Most AVR have pre-amp outputs if you need more power than the AVR provides. What you really should be asking are questions like: How many channels do I need? Do I want to expand to different Zones and do I want to do so wirelessly or wired? This is where I have seen the most differences between products. Obviously aesthetics come into play if you aren’t putting your components in a closet out of view. If there is one thing I have learned here is if you are trying to find out which product “sounds better”, you need to learn more. It really comes down to what you need the product to do. The speakers are what make one system sound different than another.

 

[Mikado463]

. so the question is, whithin these powers (100watts) and connected to a good pair of speakers , were we able to tell the diference in quality?

I don't know, we're we ???

like 'lovin' said, way too many variables. Regardless, IMO for 2 channel use there are far better choices than multi-channel AVR's

 

[John Parks]

I don't know, we're we ???

like 'lovin' said, way too many variables. Regardless, IMO for 2 channel use there are far better choices than multi-channel AVR's

I concur. Contrary to some of the good folks here on AH, I see absolutely no reason to us an AV receiver in a 2 channel setup and have never considered one in my own system (and yes, I do video through mine as well).

 

[3db]

Most definately yes.....and easily too but with the one proviso that you do not push the AVR into clipping in trying to achieve the same level of loudness with the same speakers that you can do with a dedicated power amp. For small rooms with efficient speakers, buying a power amp will NOT improve the SQ over an AVR.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I would take a flagship AVR from Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, or Sony any day over any Onkyo.

People didn't really spend $4K on some Onkyo products, did they?

$2500 for an Onkyo 80-watt stereo amp? Really?

 

[John Parks]

I would take a flagship AVR from Denon, Marantz, Yamaha, or Sony any day over any Onkyo.

People didn't really spend $4K on some Onkyo products, did they?

$2500 for an Onkyo stereo amp? Really?

Looks like some serious kit: https://www.techradar.com/reviews/audio-visual/hi-fi-and-audio/amplifiers/onkyo-m-3000r-and-m-5000r-940283/review

AH seemed excited about it as well: https://www.audioholics.com/amplifier-reviews/onkyo-m-5000r-p3000r-c7000r-fl

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

Looks like some serious kit: https://www.techradar.com/reviews/audio-visual/hi-fi-and-audio/amplifiers/onkyo-m-3000r-and-m-5000r-940283/review

AH seemed excited about it as well: https://www.audioholics.com/amplifier-reviews/onkyo-m-5000r-p3000r-c7000r-fl

Yeah, but for separates, Onkyo isn't the first name that comes to mind, especially for $4K or more. And for 80 Watts into 8 ohms?

 

[Mikado463]

Yeah, but for separates, Onkyo isn't the first name that comes to mind, especially for $4K or more. And for 80 Watts into 8 ohms?

but it can damn near 'dbl down' (150 watts into 4 ohms),how many run of the mill AVR's can do that ? and in the world of separates 5k for a stereo amp and preamp is actually pretty cheap. I do agree though that Onkyo is not what comes to mind when one thinks 'high end' separates .....

 

[Out-Of-Phase]

"Tonality with voices and instruments is wonderfully lifelike and unfailingly accurate in a soundstage that grows and shrinks perfectly with the size of the piece being played."

Wow! It does a gorgeous babe and a fat lady all at the same time! My Denon AVR-X4400 receiver is jealous.

 

[Truthslayer]

While in most cases, better quality parts are in separates. A lot of electronics are crammed into avr's and usually when al that stuff is crammed into one box, the audio quality will suffer, but some will not notice. @ channel separates are made and designed with one goal in mind, and that is to sound good. As mentioned before, it's an old debate. Kind of like, do all amps sound the same. And it probably boils down to preference and how good of an ear you have. None of it or anyone elses opinion should affect your decision. Let your ears be the judge.
All that being said, my preference is separates.

 

[John Parks]

Yeah, but for separates, Onkyo isn't the first name that comes to mind, especially for $4K or more. And for 80 Watts into 8 ohms?

Granted, Onkyo is not the first name that comes to mind these days, but I remember way back when (80s, early 90s maybe?) before they launched their Integra line, they were putting out products named "Onkyo Integra" and were very highly regarded alongside Sony ES and Pioneer Elite (as well as Nakamichi and higher end Denon).

 

[BriReeves629]

I love my Integra AVR (DRX-5). Paid just under $2500 for it new 3 years ago. I love it because it does exactly what I need it to do in one box with plenty of power for the volumes I listen to.

That said, I wouldn’t have bought it specifically for a 2.0 or 2.1 system. I also wouldn’t run out to buy separates if I decided to set up a 2-channel system and I had an extra one of these lying around. I listen to music regularly in 2-channel stereo mode and it sounds just fine.

SIDE NOTE: I think the Onkyo amp looks very cool with the dials.