N

NorCalRP

Full Audioholic
Trying to make the best decision for my situation. I've been looking closely at the Dayton 18" sealed Ultimax kit. The plan would be to buy a Crown XLS 2502, and use one channel each for a set. Down the road, I'll do the same again to end up with quads. I can get the Crown right now for $550 from Crutchfield, so with the kits and all the parts ( including clamps) I'd be looking at a cost close to a pair of ULS 15's and a slight jump up the the VTF-15H.

Right now I'm running a SVS PC2000 and a HSU VTF-3 MK4 through a Denon 4400H. My room is 1800ft³. I'm cool with the output of my current subs, but am wanting the coverage quads will give, and want them identical. The musicality of a sealed box is what's pointing me in that direction, but am wondering what type of output loss around and below 20 I might see from the ULS-15.

I started another thread and I don't think it got a single reply. I'm hoping someone is willing to help. HT has been a passion of mine for 25+ years, and have only been able to pursue it for about 2. I love learning new things, and this forum has been great for that. I'm looking forward to learning more. Thanks everyone.
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
I don't have duals, but I can tell you that with one of those sealed 18" UM kits and a mini-dsp I'm flat to 16 Hz at the main listening position.
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
I can only imagine how much my wife would hate if I made 3 more... :eek:
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
This is an interesting choice. I wouldn't worry about the 'musicality' of a sealed sub though, it's no more musical than a ported sub, at least if it is well-executed. Anyway, with the Hsu subs, you can always seal the ports if you decide you don't like the ports' contributions. As far as midbass goes, at 40 Hz and above I don't think you will see a big difference. Any of these option will have more output than you will ever use. The Ultimax will have a bit less distortion, but the Hsu subs don't really have much distortion in that range. The Ultimax does stay cleaner than the ULS-15 in deep bass, but if you push either hard, they do run into significant quantities of distortion in deep bass. The VTF15h mk2 run in 1 port mode, is very close to both distortion quantities and output headroom to an Ultimax, at least when I look at the Umax data from data-bass.com- but that was using a very powerful amplifier.

When I look closely at the performance data, I would say this: If you are interested in the music range, 40Hz+, it doesn't matter what you get, they will all be on par with each other. From 16 Hz to the mid 30s Hz range, a VTF15h in ported modes may have a slight output advantage. Below 16 Hz, the Ultimax should have a very significant advantage. Keep in mind that the Ultimax will be a bit more power hungry than the Hsu subs for the same SPL. I think the VTF-3 mk5 will have performance very similar to the VTF15h above 25 Hz or so.
 
WaynePflughaupt

WaynePflughaupt

Audioholic Samurai
I don't have duals, but I can tell you that with one of those sealed 18" UM kits and a mini-dsp I'm flat to 16 Hz at the main listening position.
Did it take a lot of boost to get extension that low?

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
 
N

NorCalRP

Full Audioholic
This is an interesting choice. I wouldn't worry about the 'musicality' of a sealed sub though, it's no more musical than a ported sub, at least if it is well-executed. Anyway, with the Hsu subs, you can always seal the ports if you decide you don't like the ports' contributions. As far as midbass goes, at 40 Hz and above I don't think you will see a big difference. Any of these option will have more output than you will ever use. The Ultimax will have a bit less distortion, but the Hsu subs don't really have much distortion in that range. The Ultimax does stay cleaner than the ULS-15 in deep bass, but if you push either hard, they do run into significant quantities of distortion in deep bass. The VTF15h mk2 run in 1 port mode, is very close to both distortion quantities and output headroom to an Ultimax, at least when I look at the Umax data from data-bass.com- but that was using a very powerful amplifier.

When I look closely at the performance data, I would say this: If you are interested in the music range, 40Hz+, it doesn't matter what you get, they will all be on par with each other. From 16 Hz to the mid 30s Hz range, a VTF15h in ported modes may have a slight output advantage. Below 16 Hz, the Ultimax should have a very significant advantage. Keep in mind that the Ultimax will be a bit more power hungry than the Hsu subs for the same SPL. I think the VTF-3 mk5 will have performance very similar to the VTF15h above 25 Hz or so.
Shady, thanks for your input hermano. I'd been trying to decipher this very information reading here and elsewhere, looking on data bass, product pages, etc. I think the Ultimax is looking like the direction I'm going to want to go in.
 
N

NorCalRP

Full Audioholic
On the input I've gotten here and on AVS, I pulled the trigger on the 18" Ultimax kit from PE and the Crown XLS 2502 from crutchfield ($575 total w/tax, so about $125 less than PE). Just got one Ultimax in the unlikely event that I'm not into it. Thanks to @shadyJ & @lovinthehd for guidance. Thanks to everyone else as well.

Now to hop on over to another forum to start learning about REW and/DSP. Man I frickin love this hobby!
 
Pogre

Pogre

Audioholic Slumlord
On the input I've gotten here and on AVS, I pulled the trigger on the 18" Ultimax kit from PE and the Crown XLS 2502 from crutchfield ($575 total w/tax, so about $125 less than PE). Just got one Ultimax in the unlikely event that I'm not into it. Thanks to @shadyJ & @lovinthehd for guidance. Thanks to everyone else as well.

Now to hop on over to another forum to start learning about REW and/DSP. Man I frickin love this hobby!
I love it too! I'm making excuses to break out my measuring gear once it cools off just to play around and try something different.
 
NINaudio

NINaudio

Audioholic Samurai
Did it take a lot of boost to get extension that low?

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt
no, I had a bump in room at 16 hz, I applied some boost around 20 Hz to even it all out. I'd have to check my screenshots at home to be able to tell you exactly what and where I applied boosts/cuts.
 
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