Speaker Cable Question(s) - How old is too old? Top brands for 2019?

[Landmonster]

Hi guys.


So, as I may have mentioned in other threads on this forum, I am coming back into home theater from a hiatus since 2002!

As such, I found some old Monster Cable XP HP CL3 (seen here) https://www.woofersetc.com/p-11173-xphp-ci-monster-cable-biggie-spool-100-feet-speaker-cable.html It looks like this, but has been sitting in my closet for 17 years. I have at least 2 strings of about 40 feet, which I was considering running in my walls for surround speakers.

Questions!
#1) Is my vintage Monster Cable XP HP still useful, since it was produced in 2002? If I cut the ends off to make fresh connections, is there any wire degradation I should be aware of?

#2) Even if it is still okay.... are there better choices for in-wall speaker cabling for 2019 standards? The length of the run might be 40 feet each. I am okay spending money if I need to get something better.

#3) I also need some new wire for my main speakers. What are some top brands for Front/Center/Right main speaker cables, 10 feet or less? I Would like something in black color to match my decor, without sacrificing anything in sound quality. I would like some black speaker cable, preferably 12 or 14 gauge, with the highest build-quality and sound-quality possible without overspending on fluff.

I don't need any esoteric suggestions for speaker wire... like the $2,600/foot sort of thing that used to prevail in the late 90s.



Bonus question:
#4) What has happened to the speaker wire industry in the last 15 years? I see that the venerable Monster Cable brand is basically out of business, and nooone seems to be selling super high-priced cabling any more.

Has this all been determined to be snake-oil, or is the market for high-end audio not what it used to be?


Thanks.

 

[lovinthehd]

http://roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm
https://www.audioholics.com/audio-video-cables/speaker-cable-gauge

Monster was often caught with their phony marketing stunts....they offered larger gauge than normal at one point, that's pretty much all they can claim fame for.

 

[ryanosaur]

+1 to the Russel article. Good read.
So is the AH one...

I don't think there will be anything wrong with your old cable. There is also nothing wrong going all in on some Monoprice Choice, or their Access series which is rated for in-wall installation.

Cheers.

 

[j_garcia]

As long as it is not corroded, there's no reason to worry about it.

The crazy cable gods are still around, but have become boutique instead of mainstream because the average person noticed the man behind the curtain. BS can only survive so long.

 

[lovinthehd]

There's plenty of snake oil cables at ridiculous prices if you want, though. Monster was just a piker in this regard, if you want silly stupid expensive there are offerings from Nordost, Audioquest, MIT Cable, Synergistic Research and other charlatans....

 

[Landmonster]

Ok. So my questions still stand.

What would be some premium black speaker cable for the main channels? Without paying ridiculous prices.

Is it fine using the 14g Monster cable xp hp for 40 foot runs? Or should I upgrade, since it will be a permanent in wall installation?

 

[lovinthehd]

Find speaker wire in black and terminate it yourself at the specific length you need would be my suggestion. I'm sure someone sells it in black (I don't shop by color, I don't look at speaker wires ). I've seen better pricing for in-wall rated 12g than that Monster stuff. Try monoprice.com. Maybe bluejeanscable.com if you want fancier.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Ok. So my questions still stand.

What would be some premium black speaker cable for the main channels? Without paying ridiculous prices.

Is it fine using the 14g Monster cable xp hp for 40 foot runs? Or should I upgrade, since it will be a permanent in wall installation?

Your question stands because you didn't read the articles carefully enough. But since you literally can't even - the answer is ANY 12AWG cable will do just fine for 40ft runs.

 

[Grandzoltar]

I think kimber cable is the real deal if your looking for a boutique speaker cable. They have the lowest measured capacitance speaker cable I’ve seen

 

[Grandzoltar]

I use kimber kwik 12 for my 40 foot run

 

[mtrycrafts]

I think kimber cable is the real deal if your looking for a boutique speaker cable. They have the lowest measured capacitance speaker cable I’ve seen

Inductance that is the important factor in speaker cables and capacitance for interconnect cables.
Most amps will accept higher capacitance cables.

 

[mtrycrafts]

OP, your exiting cable is fine unless the insulation is brittle with age. If you have excess cable, use it in the front speakers as well.
If you want black cable, either that Monoprice cable mentioned or even landscape wire is fine.
Don't agonize over speaker cables.

 

[Landmonster]

I want to spend $100 or less for the 2 main speaker cabling. About 10 feet to each


A follow-up question is ... Do I need to worry about bi amping? (With a Denon 4500 receiver, using 4 channels and 2 sets of cables each)

Or am I better off just finding a quality 10g or ,12g wire?

 

[ryanosaur]

We all generally agree that Bi-amping is a waste... especially off your AVR, as the more Amp Channels you run, the lower the available power per channel becomes.
It is said there can be a very minimal gain in doing passive bi-amping, but only one person I know of has indicated he could hear a difference. I don't think there has ever been a published spec that shows a tested improvement in speaker performance.
In fact, several speaker designers that I've talked to, offer dual sets of Binding Posts mainly for the perceived value of it, but they don't think it adds any performance enhancement. Two said bi-wire and bi-amp is ridiculous and a waste... one said DO NOT bi-amp, but you can bi-wire if you want even though hit doesn't do anything... The third cat said he likes bi-wiring (only guy I ever heard say this!) but does not like or encourage bi-amping. This guy also sells Mil-Spec wiring upgrades to his speakers and says it sounds much better than conventional speaker wire. (I take that with a hefty dose of salt.)

Anyway, I like 12AWG pure copper wire: use it for all my runs. Monoprice fits the bill and is very affordable. Choice for regular runs. Access for in-wall runs. Same wire... just the insulation changes.
Also, if you like Bananas, their Affinity Series Banana Plugs are pretty great, available in straight and 90deg. Some reviewer bench tested them against others and found these to be the most conductive, and they have a great price.

Cheers!

 

[CB22]

Hi guys.
Has this all been determined to be snake-oil, or is the market for high-end audio not what it used to be?
Thanks.

I will tell you a quick story from my high-end audio store experience. I went to a high-end audio store, which I recently found out about in my area and the salesman telling me about Paradigm speakers and Magnapans there. I explicitly told him I just wanted to hear them and would not buy anything. + I always like meeting people who are into audio. He showed me these cheaper speakers and I explained that I was just checking them out and had no need to upgrade; We were chatting I brought up my system. I told him about the BMRs and X13s. I explained they are killer speakers and I would only add anything new to my system if I could tell a very noticeable difference in SQ. I then told him about my experience at PS Audio where I got to listen to the awesome 60+k system. I explained to him that my system takes me about 95% of the way there and the only noticeable difference I heard between the 60k system and my system was an epic sound stage (speakers were in a huge room btw) and a sense of environment (I could very clearly tell the track was being recorded in a vocal booth).
This is the track that I will always remember for the "environment" and a sense of space that I'm talking about above:

Anyways, he told me that I should consider better cables and said my cables are probably the weakest link in the system. He explained that blue jeans were good for the $ but there are a lot better out there. I told him I did not really believe in whole cables and he said he part. He explained the science, silver is a better conductor, the way the wires were wrapped etc... So I said how about this, lend me a pair of cables you think are far superior to my Blue Jeans cables and if I can tell a difference I'll buy them. So he took my credit card info and let me go home to play with the cables. I pulled out the whole rig and spent about three hours testing the cables. I listened to the first 30 seconds of each song 3x on the BJ cables and 3x on the fancy cables only to hear NO difference what so ever. On Saturday I pulled into the parking lot and parked my piece of sh*t truck next to a Porsche and Lotus sports car. I brought the cables in and said, sorry I could not hear any difference between the cables. He said alright if you don't hear it don't spend your money on it.

As long as it is not corroded, there's no reason to worry about it.

Agreed.

Side note, the salesman showed me the difference between a crusty power cable and a 1000 dollar snake cable. Sure enough, I could hear a night and day difference. However, what he did not show me was a new out of the box power cable and the 1000 dollar snake cable. I wonder how much a difference there would be? My point is it seems like some people have their minds made up that cables are crucial and really matter. I'm not here to change your mind. IMO I don't think it matters all that much provided your using decent cables. My version of decent is the thing does not look like a total rusty piece of crap. But if you have the money to drop on cables knock your socks off. Wonder why I parked next to a Porsche and a lotus now? Bc those old geezers in there had money to drop on cables! Noting against them and if they want to drop big bucks on cables and can afford it more power to them.

 

[lovinthehd]

I want to spend $100 or less for the 2 main speaker cabling. About 10 feet to each


A follow-up question is ... Do I need to worry about bi amping? (With a Denon 4500 receiver, using 4 channels and 2 sets of cables each)

Or am I better off just finding a quality 10g or ,12g wire?

$100 is more than enough. I usually spend about 40 cents a foot including termination for 12g cable (but buy 12g in 300 ft reels, too).

I think you mean buy-wiring? Passive bi-amping with an avr IMO is a waste of wire (as is bi-wiring). Here's an article on the subject https://www.audioholics.com/frequent-questions/the-difference-between-biamping-vs-biwiring

For a 10 ft run you can use even 16g easily enough. Handy chart from the Roger Russell (former director of McIntosh) speaker wire site I linked earlier is a little more generous, tho: http://roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#wiretable vs the AH article's table

As to Kimber, they are probably the least of the charlatans, their pricing is more on par with Monster. The twisted pair arrangement is supposedly helpful in rejection of RFI but home environments usually don't have such to contend with anyways, more suited to other purposes IMO. The Kwik 12 is $2.50 a foot, which is way overpriced IMO....if you could buy it at huge discount then maybe...

 

[Landmonster]

How about this cable? Does anyone know anything about "Sewell", or is that a junk brand?

https://www.amazon.com/Silverback-Strand-Speaker-Banana-Plugs/dp/B009RTC62K/ref=sr_1_1?qid=1559114153&refinements=p_n_feature_keywords_browse-bin:3605314011&s=aht&sr=1-1&th=1#customerReviews


I am curious 10 AWG Belden 5T00UP https://www.parts-express.com/belden-5t00up-10-awg-2c-cable-hi-flex-in-wall-speaker-wire-cl2-100-ft-usa--102-1192 Apparently BlueJeans cable company likes that cable, for whatever that is worth.

The problem with that one, is I can't find any retailers willing to sell it in reasonable lengths without gouging me on shipping. Parts Express wants $11 shipping for 20 feet of cable.

 

[highfigh]

The problem with that one, is I can't find any retailers willing to sell it in reasonable lengths without gouging me on shipping. Parts Express wants $11 shipping for 20 feet of cable.

Have you shipped anything lately? The cost has gone up drastically. Don't blame the seller for try to avoid losing money on a $20 sale. I shipped a phono cartridge and it cost $13.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

How about this cable? Does anyone know anything about "Sewell", or is that a junk brand?

https://www.amazon.com/Silverback-Strand-Speaker-Banana-Plugs/dp/B009RTC62K/ref=sr_1_1?qid=1559114153&refinements=p_n_feature_keywords_browse-bin:3605314011&s=aht&sr=1-1&th=1#customerReviews


I am curious 10 AWG Belden 5T00UP https://www.parts-express.com/belden-5t00up-10-awg-2c-cable-hi-flex-in-wall-speaker-wire-cl2-100-ft-usa--102-1192 Apparently BlueJeans cable company likes that cable, for whatever that is worth.

The problem with that one, is I can't find any retailers willing to sell it in reasonable lengths without gouging me on shipping. Parts Express wants $11 shipping for 20 feet of cable.

Parts Express is about the only place you can buy that by the foot. I bought 24ft of the 5000UP for my setup. Even with shipping costs, it's still a great deal for an honest well-made product.

Silverback is a popular brand for banana plugs. If you're going to use those plugs anyway, that's not a bad price for a pre-made cable.

 

[lovinthehd]

How about this cable? Does anyone know anything about "Sewell", or is that a junk brand?

https://www.amazon.com/Silverback-Strand-Speaker-Banana-Plugs/dp/B009RTC62K/ref=sr_1_1?qid=1559114153&refinements=p_n_feature_keywords_browse-bin:3605314011&s=aht&sr=1-1&th=1#customerReviews


I am curious 10 AWG Belden 5T00UP https://www.parts-express.com/belden-5t00up-10-awg-2c-cable-hi-flex-in-wall-speaker-wire-cl2-100-ft-usa--102-1192 Apparently BlueJeans cable company likes that cable, for whatever that is worth.

The problem with that one, is I can't find any retailers willing to sell it in reasonable lengths without gouging me on shipping. Parts Express wants $11 shipping for 20 feet of cable.

I use those Silverback banana plugs, haven't bought any complete cables. The same banana plugs are marketed by a few brands (Nakamichi is one off the top of my head). I like these banana plugs as they have two set screws to help with a secure connection.

Belden, Canare, Mogami, Hosa are all fairly big brands in the pro audio world....