Amplifier technology from 2001 to today? What has changed?

[Landmonster]

Hi guys.

So aside from a sub woofer, the next main purchase I will be looking at is a home theater amplifier. I'd like one to power all the speakers, but if that is too costly, then at least the front channels. I haven't looked at home theater amps since around 2001, when I owned my last one...and I'm wondering if the landscape here has changed!

I am planning on using new Polk LSiM 707 speakers, and according to the manufacturer, they sound their best with 250+ watts per channel at 8ohms. As I am sure you know.... amplifiers capable of this kind of clean power, especially in multi channel, are quite expensive!

I need some guidance in picking the best amp, and narrow down my choices I'd like a 2, 3, or 5 channel amp... capable of at least 250 watts on the main speakers (or close to it). Or a combination of the 2, such as a powerful 2-3 channel amp, and a less powerful 5 channel amp. Monoblocks are fine too!

1. My question is, has amp technology changed much in the last 15 years or so? If so, in what ways?
2. Is it wise to be looking at gently used 10+ year old amps? If not, why not?
3. If old amps are fine.... what would be some good brands or models to search for?
4. If I should be looking at new amps... what are some good recommendations that would meet my needs here? There are alot of new budget brands that have popped up..... Emotiva, Monoprice, Outlaw, etc.

For example:
I came across a used Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature (425 watts x 5) locally, for $1200. This appears to offer alot more performance than what I could buy new today for $1,200... but I am sure there may be some details or other factors here that I am overlooking!

Was this amp ever any good? How would it compare to a modern 5ch amp from today's standards?
Details: https://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_6_3/sunfire-cinema-grand-signature.html


Thanks

 

[Speedskater]

Well Class 'D' amps have improved, at least for any given price point.
But on the other hand, some really good chips and transistors from back then are no longer available.

 

[Kvn_Walker]

You most likely won't be able to stay in the room with those speakers with 250 watts actually going into them.

What's important is having headroom for musical peaks while listening at levels you enjoy. While there's no such thing as too much power in reserve, you won't tap into it very often unless you listen really really loud.

All that said, I (and many others here) can personally recommend the awesome Outlaw 2200 monoblocks. Highly doubtful you will be left wanting.

 

[Landmonster]

You most likely won't be able to stay in the room with those speakers with 250 watts actually going into them.

What's important is having headroom for musical peaks while listening at levels you enjoy. While there's no such thing as too much power in reserve, you won't tap into it very often unless you listen really really loud.

All that said, I (and many others here) can personally recommend the awesome Outlaw 2200 monoblocks. Highly doubtful you will be left wanting.

I saw those. 200 watts per channel? I don't recall them publishing specs on them.

On that note, what specs are most important for an amp?

 

[slipperybidness]

I saw those. 200 watts per channel? I don't recall them publishing specs on them.

On that note, what specs are most important for an amp?

Most important specs for an amp section:

Continuous power at full bandwidth--but unfortunately not many amp manufacturers will publish this number. So, you have to do what you can with the power specs that they do publish.

THD + N spec

Other important specs are--ruler flat frequency response and low output impedance. but, modern SS amps, these items are a given unless the FR was intentionally shaped by the designer.

S/N is somewhat important for an amp, but it is really critical for the pre-amp stage.

 

[Landmonster]

What about the monolith amp offerings? They seem decent for modern multichannel amps

I am open to a used amp as well, ideally 200+ watts per channel for 5 channels driven with topend sound quality

 

[slipperybidness]

What about the monolith amp offerings? They seem decent for modern multichannel amps

I am open to a used amp as well, ideally 200+ watts per channel for 5 channels driven with topend sound quality

I haven't seen a complaint about the Monolith, seems solid.

Personally, I would probably take Outlaw over Monolith.
https://www.outlawaudio.com/mofcart/electronics.html

I would think the model 5000 @ 120WPC would be plenty, but I'm not familiar with those Polks.

Why do you want 200WPC?

 

[Landmonster]

Look up the Polk lsiM 707s.

They apparently have excellent sound reproduction, but they are notoriously power hungry

The Polk reps say they sound the best with tons of power, 250-300 wpc. Something like the emotiva xpa2 or higher.

Many users confirm this... That they are less than amazed at these flagship speakers driven by an AVR... But transform when given power from a real amp.

 

[slipperybidness]

Look up the Polk lsiM 707s.

They apparently have excellent sound reproduction, but they are notoriously power hungry

The Polk reps say they sound the best with tons of power, 250-300 wpc. Something like the emotiva xpa2 or higher.

Many users confirm this... That they are less than amazed at these flagship speakers driven by an AVR... But transform when given power from a real amp.

Max output for 120W vs 200W is <3dB..........

Of course, there is headroom to consider, not just max output

 

[Kvn_Walker]

The Outlaw and the Monolith are both built by ATI, so you wouldn't go wrong either way.

 

[Phase 2]

Hi guys.

So aside from a sub woofer, the next main purchase I will be looking at is a home theater amplifier. I'd like one to power all the speakers, but if that is too costly, then at least the front channels. I haven't looked at home theater amps since around 2001, when I owned my last one...and I'm wondering if the landscape here has changed!

I am planning on using new Polk LSiM 707 speakers, and according to the manufacturer, they sound their best with 250+ watts per channel at 8ohms. As I am sure you know.... amplifiers capable of this kind of clean power, especially in multi channel, are quite expensive!

I need some guidance in picking the best amp, and narrow down my choices I'd like a 2, 3, or 5 channel amp... capable of at least 250 watts on the main speakers (or close to it). Or a combination of the 2, such as a powerful 2-3 channel amp, and a less powerful 5 channel amp. Monoblocks are fine too!

1. My question is, has amp technology changed much in the last 15 years or so? If so, in what ways?
2. Is it wise to be looking at gently used 10+ year old amps? If not, why not?
3. If old amps are fine.... what would be some good brands or models to search for?
4. If I should be looking at new amps... what are some good recommendations that would meet my needs here? There are alot of new budget brands that have popped up..... Emotiva, Monoprice, Outlaw, etc.

For example:
I came across a used Sunfire Cinema Grand Signature (425 watts x 5) locally, for $1200. This appears to offer alot more performance than what I could buy new today for $1,200... but I am sure there may be some details or other factors here that I am overlooking!

Was this amp ever any good? How would it compare to a modern 5ch amp from today's standards?
Details: https://hometheaterhifi.com/volume_6_3/sunfire-cinema-grand-signature.html


Thanks

1200 for that amp is a fair price, but how old is it? Let's just say 18 years old. You can get a new 5 channel for 2 to 3 bills more.

 

[Landmonster]

1200 for that amp is a fair price, but how old is it? Let's just say 18 years old. You can get a new 5 channel for 2 to 3 bills more.

Yea it's from 2001 or 2002. It has 425 watts per channel.... But the finish is kind of dinged up.

I just wondered if amps has improved or changed much along the way

 

[slipperybidness]

Yea it's from 2001 or 2002. It has 425 watts per channel.... But the finish is kind of dinged up.

I just wondered if amps has improved or changed much along the way

The only real improvement/change is the proliferation of good Class D circuit topology.

Beyond that, amplification has been a mature technology for quite a long time.

I have a ~1997 vintage Parasound still going strong. The only reason I would consider replacing it would be for something smaller and more efficient, or if it fails.

 

[Hetfield]

The only real improvement/change is the proliferation of good Class D circuit topology.

Beyond that, amplification has been a mature technology for quite a long time.

I have a ~1997 vintage Parasound still going strong. The only reason I would consider replacing it would be for something smaller and more efficient, or if it fails.

Parasound rocks, I am powering my HT with a 5 channel Parasound amp.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

 

[slipperybidness]

Parasound rocks, I am powering my HT with a 5 channel Parasound amp.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

Agreed, for the most part.

I use a Para 1206 and a zCD, both are good pieces of kit.

 

[lovinthehd]

Look up the Polk lsiM 707s.

They apparently have excellent sound reproduction, but they are notoriously power hungry

The Polk reps say they sound the best with tons of power, 250-300 wpc. Something like the emotiva xpa2 or higher.

Many users confirm this... That they are less than amazed at these flagship speakers driven by an AVR... But transform when given power from a real amp.

What I call Polk mythology. The speaker has no idea you've got 300wpc unless they're (i.e. all 300 wpc) in use.

 

[lovinthehd]

The Outlaw and the Monolith are both built by ATI, so you wouldn't go wrong either way.

Well, the lower end 5000 amp from Outlaw is different...

 

[slipperybidness]

What I call Polk mythology. The speaker has no idea you've got 300wpc unless they're (i.e. all 300 wpc) in use.

Right, so when does 1W not equal 1W????

 

[lovinthehd]

LOL don't get him started on amp mythology where some watts are better than others....altho it's probably on the Polk forums, too.

Right, so when does 1W not equal 1W????

Landmonster you might want to play around with an spl calculator to get an idea/approximation (considering sensitivity specs can be a bit off) how loud with how much power your speakers get. https://myhometheater.homestead.com/splcalculator.html

 

[Phase 2]

Yea it's from 2001 or 2002. It has 425 watts per channel.... But the finish is kind of dinged up.

I just wondered if amps has improved or changed much along the way

I'm No amp expert here, but Bob Carver's amps have his umm unique signature? So to speak, PENG, I believe can speak volumes on amps, he or M Code can go into more detail on specifics of amp designs. Bob Carver had a way of taking a SS amp and making it have a signature sound the guy is a guru for sure with amps. I believe that's what made him famous so to speak. He could make a SS amp have a "tube" amp like sound. Maybe do some research on ole Bob Carver, I did and I found the guy to be a very interesting fellow with what he brought to audio with his designs.